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EDIT: The printed stats are never going to be represented by how the characters are portrayed in the books because they are all practically Mary Sues and would have max stats. Do you read the books only and not play D&D at all?
Back in 2nd edition Drizzt already was a lvl 16 ranger, in the novels he was already an incredible fighter when he meets the rest of the Companions. And I mean the first books. If you are going to give a "logical" lore based answer stating why he is not as useful as other champions, at least it should be lore-coherent.
I mean, I totally understand your point when you say "hey, it's a 5th thing, don't blame us" but you should listen to the game's fanbase when they say that it's not accurate the way Drizzt works right now. Don't use the novels to elaborate an answer, because it looks like you guys don't know what are you talking about.
The Codename guy just said that they used the stats they were given by WotC. I'm saying that they should speak to them again, because that version is totally wrong (and is gimping Drizzt for their game).
The last time WotC gave an official version of Drizzt was in v3.5 D&D. The version Codename are using is based on the lvl 8 version some random guy came up with for some 8th level campaign he was playing... the guy's got Drizzt using leather armour and has his class as a Fighter, so clearly took massive liberties when creating him (or simply wasn't well versed with the character).
Again, you're totally wrong. I've read loads of D&D themed books and bought and played loads of the campaigns and accesories. TSR then WotC often published campaign setting books which list the characters from novels as accurately as they can in the game system. I'm not making up those stats I listed, they are on their official website!
Str 13, Dex 20, Con 15, Int 17, Wis 17, Cha 14
See the links I put in my post... It's halpful if you actually read a thread before spouting off.
That 'random guy' is Chris Perkins, who has worked with WoTC for over 20 years, and is senior producer for the D&D line. For the avoidance of doubt, whatever he says Drizzt's stats are in 5e are, goes.
Sadly, I can't find the context for his level (I assume it was a relative power issue), but upping him to 16 isn't going to increase his stats that much.
He created that character for an 8th level campaign and probably made it using the "point buy" method, which is why the stats are so low. You can just roll d6 for character creation (using a variety of different methods), which is why hero characters with much higher stats are still perfectly legal within the game rules.
The character Chris Perkins created was obviously made with party balance in mind for the game he was playing. That's perfectly fine, but does not reflect Drizzt as he was described in the books, and should not be used as the "official version" of Drizzt, because there are so many mistakes. WotC have done a much more accurate version, which I linked to on their official site.
Here's an example of one of the many things wrong with that character profile: Drizzt was a fighter in the underdark, who left for the surface, then was trained as a ranger of Mielikki by Montolio De'Brochee. It was much later that he found the two scimitars, Icingdeath and Twinkle.
So Drizzt is either a lower level fighter geared up with Adamantine weapons and armour, wearing a Piwafwi cloak, (which all melted when he reached the surface). OR he's a multi-classed Fighter/Ranger with Icingdeath/Twinkle and the armour Bruenor made for him etc...
Just that simple example proves that the 8th level fighter character Chris made is garbage.
Now, I've proved that the Drizzt character in the game isn't accurate, but that's just a diversion from the game balance problem. Drizzt is currently useless, and as the most recognisable and famous character Codename are ever going to get in their game, it isn't sensible to leave him in this state. I strongly suggest changing it before the game leaves Early Access.
18, 15, 15, 13, 18, 13 = 92 points
10, 19, 14, 12, 14, 11 = 80 points
That's a 12 point difference! Codename has set a precedent for characters with much higher stats, so "game balance" is hardly a reason for gimping Drizzt.
Like the show Whose Line is It Anyway?, the rules are made up and the points don't matter. CNE knows the characters need to be rebalanced and are working on it. If you don't like the stats WotC gave CNE for Drizzt then you need to complain to WotC.
Please consider reviewing his character ... and I pledge to buy any Drizzt DLC with his gear or chest that drop his equipment!
This whole thread is basically a testament to why you are wrong for the sole fact that anything pre-5e is never going to be used. Codename has zero say in any of this so this whole thread is the definition of pointless. Go file a complaint with Wizards because you are obviously very unclear of how they have operated since 4e came out. While I don't play 4e or 5e myself, I am still abreast of how WotC operates their IP.
EDIT: At the end of the day, your opinions and "feelings" on the topic matter not one iota.
I have.
The stat rules in 5e D&D haven't changed since 3e.
Drizzt's stats as used in the game are wrong and don't accurately describe the character. Drizzt is also a useless gimp in Idle Champions, when he should be the most powerful dps available (to fit the lore and popularity of the character).
This isn't a hard concept to understand...
If they fix his stats he'll be worth using.
No, you aren't understanding. You have made that very clear as you never address or acknowledge what anyone is saying. You are a broken record and are starting to sound like a petulent child who will stop at nothing to get his way despite being in the wrong place to get it. We have explained to you why the stats are the way they are and why they won't change. As I said above, if you aren't happy with that, you need to talk to WotC.
EDIT: I absolutely agree that the stats don't accurately reflect the characters, that isn't the argument. The argument is that the stats are never going to reflect the literary characters because they are a bunch of Mary Sues that would have near perfect stats. After two pages of this thread, I would have thought you would understand by now that you are in the completely wrong place to get this changed.
Ah I see, so Codename has no control over the stats and are forced to use whatever they're given by WotC... okay.
Wait! Now you're saying that Codename deliberately gimped Drizzt for game balance purposes?!
Your counter-arguments are incoherent and contradictory.
WotC wouldn't give a toss about game balance in some tiny indy-developed idle game, not when it comes to choosing offical stats for one of their flagship characters. As I've mentioned before, the official Drizzt stats that WotC previously published on their website ARE accurate to the books, so I've proven that WotC have form for giving heroes boosted stats.
Also, if you knew anything about D&D you'd know that even the "perfect stats" Drizzt has are nowhere near optimised for a fighter character. Min/maxed D&D fighters pump up str (for hit and damage bonuses) and use 2-handed weapons for more damage. Even a dual wielder would have as much strength as possible with con as the third highest stat. You'd need some wis for ranger spellcasting, but int and cha would be dump stats.
Besides, Tyril has 12 more stat points than Drizzt, so Codename could just as easily bump up his cha/int/wis to truly reflect the character and actually make him buffable by Hitch/Dhadius.
Yes, I have repeatedly said that Codename has zero control over in-game stats. Anything regarding assets has to be run by WotC for approval before it can be added to the game. That is industry standard for developers using another company's Intellectual Property. This is not a hard concept to grasp and yet you have refused to believe it for two whole pages of this discussion. Honestly I'm not sure what else to tell you. I think you just literally can't accept this and move on for some reason.
Drizzt's stats have nothing to do with balance as far as Idle Champions of the Forgotten Realms goes. Again, they give every champ stats based on what WotC wants them to have. Sure, they do some balance around that, but that isn't what is wrong with Drizzt in-game currently. As other people have mentioned, in both this thread and plenty of others, he is weak due to how the math for his buff work currently. I imagine they will be given a balance pass by the time Wulfgar is released.
As per your insinuation on my knowledge of D&D, I know as much as anyone else here. I have been an active player and DM since 2e, about 30 years. I am well versed in mechanics, RAW/RAI, lore, etc as well as how both TSR and WotC have handled the IP over the years.
Honestly at this point I don't know if you are deliberately ignoring what I say and misinterpreting me in a vain attempt to make your thread seem relevent, but it is getting old. My best advice is to let this one go. If you really find yourself losing sleep at night because of this, get in contact with WotC about it.
To quote you, you said:
"The argument is that the stats are never going to reflect the literary characters because they are a bunch of Mary Sues that would have near perfect stats."
Perfect stats... your words, not mine.
You're telling me that you think a 'perfect' D&D fighter would only have 13 strength? After 30 years of playing the game you honestly think that?
Actually, the real problem is that with his gimped stats, Drizzt isn't eligible for buffs from characters like Hitch and Dhadius. Codename would need to make the Champions of the Hall bonus vastly more powerful than it currently stands to address this simple fact.
Obviously. So why don't Codename raise the point that his stats as given are too low and don't match up with stats WotC have given out before? Drizzt is the most popular character that WotC own, so they'll be sympathetic to making sure he's as powerful in the game as he should be. He's also a major marketing draw to the game for Codename, so when their players pick up Drizzt, they should be thinking "Yeah, he's awesome!" not "Oh... he's useless."
Codename would have far more sway in bringing this issue up with WotC than I would, so stop throwing up that ridiculous strawman. Besides, this issue is affecting Codename's game, it's not my responsibility to intercede with WotC on their behalf and fix it for them.
To give an example of how ridiculously bad Drizzt is in the current game, I just started a new adventure, to compare him and Jarlaxle (because they both benefit from Asharra's elf buff and the two characters exist in the same novels).
Now, bear in mind the following:
1) In the novels, Jarlaxle is a skilled combatant, but wouldn't stand a chance against Drizzt in a straight fight.
2) In the game, Jarlaxle is a dps/support hybrid, who offers a huge group buff in gold find.
3) In the game, Drizzt is (supposed to be) pure dps, with a mild group damage buff.
4) I was using 3 champions of the hall - Bruenor, Catti-brie, Regis. (two of which are event characters, which represent months worth of consist playing to acquire).
5) My Drizzt and Jarlaxle are both full epics, but Drizzt has a golden Icingdeath, while Jarlaxle only has a shiny Knave's eye patch.
So you'd expect Drizzt to vastly outclass Jarlaxle right?
Wrong.
By the time I'd reached level 30 in the adventure, Jarlaxle was doing 50x Drizzt's damage! As the characters leveled up, that damage difference grew bigger and bigger, all because Drizzt wasn't eligible for Hitch's buff. If I hadn't been able to use Calliope and had to use Dhadius instead, the damage difference between the two would have been enormous.
So the answer isn't just fixing Drizzt's Companions of the Hall ability. For him to actually compete as a viable dps character (and he arguably should be the best in the game), he needs to be eligible for as many buffs from other champions as possible.
Which means fixing his stats.
Your reading comprehension is attrocious at best and at worst you are deliberately ignoring what I am saying. I have stated twice that the literary characters would have perfect stats if you were to try to accurately reflect them on a character sheet, specifically because they are Mary Sues. They are written that way. Obviously WotC and Codename aren't going to give them perfect stats. I also never stated, and am frankly not sure how you came up with the idea, that WotC's character sheet given to Codename was an accurate reflection of Drizzt's stats. They are neither perfect nor optimal and I never said as such.
I just gave you a couple ways you could more feasibly get this crusade of yours accomplished, what you feel you should or shouldn't have to do is up to you. I am telling you, from my experience with other games that use another company's IP, that you are not going to affect change through Codename. You would think that's how it works, but it really doesn't. Take it or leave it.
I am very well aware of how ridiculously bad Drizzt is in-game; I have played consistantly since release. Your problems with his not being buffed by other champs is a reflection of a much bigger problem, one that other champs fall into as well. Myself and others would have thought there would be more synergy between the other Companions and Drizzt rather than it solely being Drizzt synergizing with them. Except for maybe Regis in his really broad way they haven't synergized, and that will end up hurting his viability in the long run. His not being buffed by the current champs is killing him in the current meta coupled with his terribly tuned numbers.
I get that you are asking them to make him the best character in the game, and that you feel his stats were the easiest way to accomplish that, I just question as to why you feel they should beyond him being the most popular Forgotten Realms character. Time will tell, but I think they are playing a longer game here as far as balance and use of characters goes. At least that's what us long time players have been hoping. I would love for ways to use multiple formations so that I could play around with the entire roster. Judging from Codename's other game, Crusaders of the Lost Idols, that time will come. I just hope sooner rather than later.