Z-axis is wrong

[BaDaBingDK]

I know this is maybe a small thing.
But the X-Y-Z axis are messed up.
In 3D space they are as follows.
Z is up/down
Y is forw/backw
X is left/right

In the game, Z is backw/forw which makes no sense.

I get where the confusion is coming from, as on a paper hold out in front of you Y-axis seams to point up.
But Y and X are flat two-dimensional = Left, right, forward and backward.
Z is the one adding the 3rd dimension which is up and down.

[Genexi2]

The axis used for the altitude varies on a per game/engine basis since it's all arbitrary as far as the computer cares. Beat Saber runs on Unity, where the Y-axis is used for height.

[BaDaBingDK]

I am aware that some engines uses Y-axis for height. Usually engines that started out as 2D drawing engines, but that does not make it right.
How the engine works is irrelevant.
In 3D space Z is always up and down, no matter how the engine is build.
You can not expect players to know how different engines work.
So it would make more sense to name the X-Y-Z-axis from the perspective of the real world, and not from the perspective of the individual engine.

[Alternity]

To be honest it could be R T Y for all I care. Variables do not mean anything.

[BaDaBingDK]

Originally posted by Alternity:

To be honest it could be R T Y for all I care. Variables do not mean anything.

Then we might as well switch up and down, right and left.
You will figure it out eventually.
But why the frick not name things properly from the start?

[Alternity]

Up down right and left are not variables. You seem to be missing the point.

[BaDaBingDK]

What point?
That everyone can call the axis what they want?
X is one dimension.
X, Y is two dimensions and flat.
Z adds the third dimension of height.
I get that some game- and drawing engines use Z as depth and not height, as Y is hight on the screen that sits vertically in front of you.
But in all the world og robotics, CNC and machining in general.
Z is always up and down.
The only place doing it differently is some drawing engines, making them the odd ones out.
Z being height is the norm.
Doing it any other way, just creates confusion.

[Alternity]

The point was that names such as Up, Down, left and Right are not variables, they are names that have meaning in the dictionnary, and that letters are variables that do not mean anything on their own, they are variables. I'm not sure how that was complicated. You literally compared variables with names that have a set meaning. So far you seem the only one to be confused, I wasn't confused when I set it up.

[Tenor Sounds]

People are giving you some grief, but I know exactly where you're coming from. My floor was too low in-game so I went to adjust the Z axis, and was really confused when things started shifting forwards/backwards. In 3D space Z is up-down, full-stop.

It might be a minor thing, but if they can make it more accurate they should.

Edit: To touch on the "it's arbitrary and based on the engine" thing, that makes sense to me if I'm developing a game on a computer. But when the software is emulating the visuals and immersion of a 3D space for the player, I feel like the language we use (both literal and design-wise) should reflect the standards we have for actual 3D space as well. I'm not adjusting the room in Blender or Unity, I'm adjusting my virtual space from the perspective of that virtual space.

[Alternity]

The letters do not mean anything. If they really want to reflect the meaning of the variables they should name them:

Up/Down
Left/Right
Forward/Backward

This have actual meaning, the letters do not, they can be anything it really doesn't matter.

[Tenor Sounds]

Originally posted by Alternity:

The letters do not mean anything. If they really want to reflect the meaning of the variables they should name them:

Up/Down
Left/Right
Forward/Backward

This have actual meaning, the letters do not, they can be anything it really doesn't matter.

Variables like the x in "x + 2 = 4" are different than the letters we use as labels for the geometric axis we learned about in math class. The letter label of an axis can correlate with variables in geometric equations, but the label itself is not an arbitrary variable. It's not like "z-axis is up/down" is like, just my opinion, man.

What would it look like if they changed it to "Up/Down"? We'd get a menu that looks like:

Up/Down --> -1
Left/Right --> 0
Forward/Backward --> +2

I'd argue that's unintuitive and requires the player to translate +/- integers with paired labels describing same axis into 3D space. That's why it's important that x-axis/y-axis/z-axis actually do mean something and it's pretty well-defined, because most players have had at least some exposure to these concepts and what they mean and know negative and positive #'s represent different directions on the same axis.

Again, we're splitting hairs here. But I don't really get why folks wouldn't want it to be accurate if it's such a small change.

[BaDaBingDK]

Originally posted by Tenor Sounds:

People are giving you some grief, but I know exactly where you're coming from. My floor was too low in-game so I went to adjust the Z axis, and was really confused when things started shifting forwards/backwards. In 3D space Z is up-down, full-stop.

It might be a minor thing, but if they can make it more accurate they should.

Edit: To touch on the "it's arbitrary and based on the engine" thing, that makes sense to me if I'm developing a game on a computer. But when the software is emulating the visuals and immersion of a 3D space for the player, I feel like the language we use (both literal and design-wise) should reflect the standards we have for actual 3D space as well. I'm not adjusting the room in Blender or Unity, I'm adjusting my virtual space from the perspective of that virtual space.

Thank you.
Exactly my thoughts.

[JakeURb8ty]

Its software specific. Axis are not universal. One reason 3D files need to be converted is different software packages define axis their own ways. Like when blender geometry i made to make a building in Cities Skylines a Unity game, A dialogue option asks what file kind or what letter is the up down axis. Otherwise the object might be upside down or inside out.

[Enorats]

So.. my math classes always taught that when graphing a point in 3 dimensions X is left/right, Y is up/down (just like in 2d space) and Z is forward/backward.

A quick google search returns numerous examples of both methods of labeling the axis however. I suppose which is up/down and which is forward/backward just depends on whether you're thinking about adding a 3rd axis to a flat plane that's sitting horizontally on a desk or one on a screen that's oriented vertically.

If you've got an X/Y plot sitting on a desk and you're adding a Z axis to it.. then that Z axis would intuitively be up/down. If you're working with something on a screen then it would more intuitively be forward/backward.

[BaDaBingDK]

I borrowed this explanation from a user on "escapistmagazine" which i think makes sense.

"For 2d work, X is horizontal and Y is vertical. This should remain unchanged.

When transitioning to 3d work, the above statement should apply to a top view of the object/item. For example, in a game like Super Mario 64 (or any other "simple 3d game"), X+Y axises should refer to the planar movement (forward, back, sideways). The Z dimension would be vertical (up).

When people say height/width/depth, they are usually referring to looking at an object (for example, a cube or a figure). For representation of a gaming world, it makes more sense to use a north/east/up method for XYZ. This allows maps to be made on the XY coordinate system, and Z values whenever height is necessary (such as building structures in Minecraft).

FYI for the OP: "Y is the standard for math" isn't true. Y is the standard up for a 2 dimensional coordinate system. Z is the standard up for a 3 dimensional coordinate system. Since we need a 3d system for 3d gaming Z would be the logical answer for height.!