What is Resistance Penetration?

[Dipernacus]

found some gear with "Fire" Resistance Penetration stats on them, and was curious what exactly that means? is that like...the dmg i do with a fire axe vs a fire-resistant enemy? sorry if it's a dumb question.

[Łşk]

Exactly what it says on the tin? It ignores a portion of enemies resistance to that element. For example if you deal 100 fire damage, the enemy has 20% fire res and have 20% fire pen, you'll ignore 20% of enemies fire resistance, dealing the full 100 dmg instead of a reduced 80, or possibly deal more than 100 dmg if they have no resists i would imagine since resistances can go negative, would need clarification from devs on that though.

[WesleySakamoto]

Has anyone concluded that Resist Penetration applies to pet damage? Like Imps/Gargoyle benefiting from elemental resist pen?

[my butt is erect]

crap is what it is.
search my other topic for a decent amount of discussion on it

[my butt is erect]

But as far as what it's supposed to help, pretty sure it's as simple as any damage of x element will be aided by it, at least when the monster has some resist. But don't know if it can reduce resist below 0, or even how much resist any monster has to theorize.

[Mawdesty]

Originally posted by Łşk:

Exactly what it says on the tin? It ignores a portion of enemies resistance to that element. For example if you deal 100 fire damage, the enemy has 20% fire res and have 20% fire pen, you'll ignore 20% of enemies fire resistance, dealing the full 100 dmg instead of a reduced 80, or possibly deal more than 100 dmg if they have no resists i would imagine since resistances can go negative, would need clarification from devs on that though.

This is likely wrong on lots of fronts.

Partially assuming from the first game, but also inferring based on the way the stat is displayed, penetration isn't "ignore 20% of an enemies DR" making 20% DR act like 0%. Penetration gives a flat number so it likely treats enemy resistances on the number side.

If they have 0 resistance, it probably goes negative and you do more damage, like maybe 30% tops. If they have something ridiculous like 2,000 and you knock off 150 now they act like they have 1,850. Which for arguments sake, if 2,000 armor/resistance was 82% DR, then 1,850 might reduce the effectiveness down to 80% DR. Looking like it will be more worthless than it was in the first game.

[my butt is erect]

They are very definitely wrong as I had 100 penetration and damage was still trash. That post is pretty bold for how wrong and assuming it was.

[Revalopod]

It's a useless stat not ever worth putting on gear when you can just put plain damage increases on.

[Why can't Light win ASL]

Originally posted by Mawdesty:

Originally posted by Łşk:

Exactly what it says on the tin? It ignores a portion of enemies resistance to that element. For example if you deal 100 fire damage, the enemy has 20% fire res and have 20% fire pen, you'll ignore 20% of enemies fire resistance, dealing the full 100 dmg instead of a reduced 80, or possibly deal more than 100 dmg if they have no resists i would imagine since resistances can go negative, would need clarification from devs on that though.

This is likely wrong on lots of fronts.

Partially assuming from the first game, but also inferring based on the way the stat is displayed, penetration isn't "ignore 20% of an enemies DR" making 20% DR act like 0%. Penetration gives a flat number so it likely treats enemy resistances on the number side.

If they have 0 resistance, it probably goes negative and you do more damage, like maybe 30% tops. If they have something ridiculous like 2,000 and you knock off 150 now they act like they have 1,850. Which for arguments sake, if 2,000 armor/resistance was 82% DR, then 1,850 might reduce the effectiveness down to 80% DR. Looking like it will be more worthless than it was in the first game.

Reduced enemy DR from 82% to 80% is more than a 10% damage increase, how is that worthless?

[Fengtorin]

Originally posted by Why can't Light win ASL:

Originally posted by Mawdesty:

This is likely wrong on lots of fronts.

Partially assuming from the first game, but also inferring based on the way the stat is displayed, penetration isn't "ignore 20% of an enemies DR" making 20% DR act like 0%. Penetration gives a flat number so it likely treats enemy resistances on the number side.

If they have 0 resistance, it probably goes negative and you do more damage, like maybe 30% tops. If they have something ridiculous like 2,000 and you knock off 150 now they act like they have 1,850. Which for arguments sake, if 2,000 armor/resistance was 82% DR, then 1,850 might reduce the effectiveness down to 80% DR. Looking like it will be more worthless than it was in the first game.

Reduced enemy DR from 82% to 80% is more than a 10% damage increase, how is that worthless?

The example he made up would in fact be quite significant as you point out, but in reality if you go run some tests - put resistance penetration on every item you can and you won't be seeing a 10% increase. You'll barely notice the damage change at all.

[Why can't Light win ASL]

Originally posted by Fengtorin:

Originally posted by Why can't Light win ASL:

Reduced enemy DR from 82% to 80% is more than a 10% damage increase, how is that worthless?

The example he made up would in fact be quite significant as you point out, but in reality if you go run some tests - put resistance penetration on every item you can and you won't be seeing a 10% increase. You'll barely notice the damage change at all.

I agree with this, I think on the two items that can have Armor sundering (I dont know about resistances but armor works the same it just have a different name) Weapons and Gloves have better options, Vulnerability and Combat respectivelly. I think the issue is that the armor sundering values are just too low atm, I think if it was four times high it would be competitive.

[DeadBeMyDignity]

Just to put it simple, when you hit ng+ you receive malus on your armor and resistance. It work the same against enemy. Some of them have armor, other resistance, but even if they don't, they will receive more dmg from pen

[DeadBeMyDignity]

Originally posted by WesleySakamoto:

Has anyone concluded that Resist Penetration applies to pet damage? Like Imps/Gargoyle benefiting from elemental resist pen?

I do work, for example. If you gargoil as lighting trident and you have lighting pen, your pet will benefit as well from the pen. It simply affect all dmg you inflict, as long as you have the right type of pen

[Mawdesty]

Originally posted by Why can't Light win ASL:

Originally posted by Mawdesty:

This is likely wrong on lots of fronts.

Partially assuming from the first game, but also inferring based on the way the stat is displayed, penetration isn't "ignore 20% of an enemies DR" making 20% DR act like 0%. Penetration gives a flat number so it likely treats enemy resistances on the number side.

If they have 0 resistance, it probably goes negative and you do more damage, like maybe 30% tops. If they have something ridiculous like 2,000 and you knock off 150 now they act like they have 1,850. Which for arguments sake, if 2,000 armor/resistance was 82% DR, then 1,850 might reduce the effectiveness down to 80% DR. Looking like it will be more worthless than it was in the first game.

Reduced enemy DR from 82% to 80% is more than a 10% damage increase, how is that worthless?

If you wanna put something like conflagration on all 6 gear pieces, so no two handers, for a like 12% bump in your relative damage, be my guest. Equipment offers lots of buffs in the secondary that do great effects, like a 10% bonus spell damage buff on gloves alone. And by the way, pretty sure I only see the penetration buffs on mainly the weapons. With so much variety to buff your damage, penetration does little for how much you'd need to invest in it.

[Why can't Light win ASL]

Originally posted by Mawdesty:

Originally posted by Why can't Light win ASL:

Reduced enemy DR from 82% to 80% is more than a 10% damage increase, how is that worthless?

If you wanna put something like conflagration on all 6 gear pieces, so no two handers, for a like 12% bump in your relative damage, be my guest. Equipment offers lots of buffs in the secondary that do great effects, like a 10% bonus spell damage buff on gloves alone. And by the way, pretty sure I only see the penetration buffs on the weapons. With so much variety to buff your damage, penetration does little for how much you'd need to invest in it.

I responded to another person with a similar response, I agree that armor sundering and pen isnt worth it as it is in the game right now but just because the values are too low, there are two slots that can get pen, weapons and gloves, 25 max on all and doesnt scale with item level, with pen on main hand, off hand and gloves you can get 75 sundering or pen.

For spells you can get crit chance instead of pen so I guess if you for whatever reason dont play crit with spells you might want pen since the other suffixes are kinda bad but for weapon attack builds I think Vulnerability is going to be better.