Opinion - Nero at the end is still weaker than Urizen

[wetblues]

Probably at normal dante dt level at best but that is even being generous

[Lynfinity]

In Mission 08 Nero managed to destroy his "shield" and even damage him a little, while Dante couldn't do anything before obtaining Sin Devil Trigger.

With DT he probably could've beat him or at least force him to retreat. /thread

[wetblues]

Urizen wasnt even interested in Nero, he knew Dante personally. Mind you Nero DT has nothing special to it yet because it is still immature. Urizen has time conrtolling stuff, along with the energy blast etc. Nero stands no chance against him with his Dt

[AnemoneMeer]

Nero's stronger than normal Dante DT.

Nero's whole thing is raw power. He actually exceeds both Dante and Vergil in the sheer amount of physical force he can apply. His sword swings do more damage outright, even without exceed. Even back in 4, he was able to pull off feats of raw power Dante couldn't match. Hell, Nero tanks Yamato to the chest without issue.

The flip side of this is everything else. Dante is much faster than Nero, and is constantly shown performing feats of speed that surpass Nero, both offensively and defensively.

Nero in 4 was on par with DMC 3 Vergil, if not a bit beyond him. He was comfortably beyond DMC3 Dante at the start of the game. Having the Devil Bringer was proof of that, as it's a component of his proper DT already manifested, as well as blatantly being able to channel his power (the stuff he does to Berial and in the opening fight with Dante, as well as grim grips are all him manifesting spectral arms to attack and defend). Once he gets his DT, he's beyond DMC3 Vergil, as shown in the Sanctus Diabolica and Savior encounters, where he's able to blatantly out-strength and crush an utterly titanic monstrosity.

Come 5, and Nero's DT is shown as being able to physically hold Dante and Vergil back. However, even his movement leading up to this is NOT a teleport, simply a very rapid dash, and that's him going all out, power of willpower. In gameplay, Vergil is notably faster in all of his actions, and Dante has many actions that outspeed Nero as well.

Again, this is a measure of STRENGTH, not talent. Dante's so powerful because he's so experienced and talented with so many weapons and combat styles. Nero would floor him in an arm wrestling contest, but Dante would roll him in a fight.

[Lynfinity]

Originally posted by wetblues:

Urizen wasnt even interested in Nero, he knew Dante personally. Mind you Nero DT has nothing special to it yet because it is still immature. Urizen has time conrtolling stuff, along with the energy blast etc. Nero stands no chance against him with his Dt

Doesn't change the fact that Dante got wrecked hard without SDT, while Nero managed to destroy his shield single-handedly without DT at all.

Oh, and don't forget that he was able to defeat Vergil. And Vergil is definetely stronger than Urizen.

[wetblues]

Originally posted by Yodel Daddy:

Originally posted by wetblues:

Urizen wasnt even interested in Nero, he knew Dante personally. Mind you Nero DT has nothing special to it yet because it is still immature. Urizen has time conrtolling stuff, along with the energy blast etc. Nero stands no chance against him with his Dt

Doesn't change the fact that Dante got wrecked hard without SDT, while Nero managed to destroy his shield single-handedly without DT at all.

Oh, and don't forget that he was able to defeat Vergil. And Vergil is definetely stronger than Urizen.

This has been mentioned multiple times, vergil was already weak from fighting and wasnt going all out. He told Nero to stand down multiple times, Nero had a purpose for fighting. Nero isnt close to Vergil, Urizen, Dante etc.

Urizen attacked dante, Urizen never attacked Nero until mission 8

[wetblues]

Originally posted by AnemoneMeer:

Nero's stronger than normal Dante DT.

Nero's whole thing is raw power. He actually exceeds both Dante and Vergil in the sheer amount of physical force he can apply. His sword swings do more damage outright, even without exceed. Even back in 4, he was able to pull off feats of raw power Dante couldn't match. Hell, Nero tanks Yamato to the chest without issue.

The flip side of this is everything else. Dante is much faster than Nero, and is constantly shown performing feats of speed that surpass Nero, both offensively and defensively.

Nero in 4 was on par with DMC 3 Vergil, if not a bit beyond him. He was comfortably beyond DMC3 Dante at the start of the game. Having the Devil Bringer was proof of that, as it's a component of his proper DT already manifested, as well as blatantly being able to channel his power (the stuff he does to Berial and in the opening fight with Dante, as well as grim grips are all him manifesting spectral arms to attack and defend). Once he gets his DT, he's beyond DMC3 Vergil, as shown in the Sanctus Diabolica and Savior encounters, where he's able to blatantly out-strength and crush an utterly titanic monstrosity.

Come 5, and Nero's DT is shown as being able to physically hold Dante and Vergil back. However, even his movement leading up to this is NOT a teleport, simply a very rapid dash, and that's him going all out, power of willpower. In gameplay, Vergil is notably faster in all of his actions, and Dante has many actions that outspeed Nero as well.

Again, this is a measure of STRENGTH, not talent. Dante's so powerful because he's so experienced and talented with so many weapons and combat styles. Nero would floor him in an arm wrestling contest, but Dante would roll him in a fight.

Your wall of text is so wrong, Nero was no where close to vergil in dmc 4, heck even before he got his dt in dmc 5. Vergil and dante in dmc 3 are way too ridiculous

[Ferrick]

yeah Nero is weaker than the twins at the moment but looking at how they're building him up, seems like he will end up surpassing them eventually, especially when he doesn't need any demonic sword to go into his true DT

[wetblues]

Originally posted by Red Mage Ferrick:

yeah Nero is weaker than the twins at the moment but looking at how they're building him up, seems like he will end up surpassing them eventually, especially when he doesn't need any demonic sword to go into his true DT

Maybe in the future, but he needs one if thats the case. Red queen will simply be to weak for him.

[george47mathew]

Vergil actually has more refined power than Nero and Dante. The problem with him is that he does not truly have anything to fight for. Like for instance, on the why he needed MORE power. He just did not like being weak...but over the years he just lost direction completely and unlike Dante and Nero who uses power to protect than to simply dominate and destroy. So they have a firm direction and emotion to fight for. Vergil is still confused...

He did not truly fight Nero in his max power, He was clearly holding back from killing him outright. Nero won coz of his extreme emotion and frustration at his newfound knowledge of his father. Vergil seems oblivious. I dont think he knew he had a son.

If Vergil wanted, he could have killed Dante and Lady in the past, he had him for keeps.

Vergil simply wants to defeat and dominate. Not Kill.


Vergil still is confused and has no idea what or who to fight for.

Nero has a reason to fight for. He gets extra strength from his desire to protect.

[Keagian]

Originally posted by wetblues:

Originally posted by Red Mage Ferrick:

yeah Nero is weaker than the twins at the moment but looking at how they're building him up, seems like he will end up surpassing them eventually, especially when he doesn't need any demonic sword to go into his true DT

Maybe in the future, but he needs one if thats the case. Red queen will simply be to weak for him.

Yea Red Queen, while durable, is only just a normal sword. Same with Rebellion, its just a long sword without any special properties until Dante merged it with Sparda. The Yamato that Vergil wields is already a extremely powerful sword that can empower its user and cut dimensions, which is why so many demons are drawn to it.

Eventually Nero is gonna need a demon sword of his own, if he wants to further tap into his demonic side.

[Ferrick]

Originally posted by wetblues:

Originally posted by Red Mage Ferrick:

yeah Nero is weaker than the twins at the moment but looking at how they're building him up, seems like he will end up surpassing them eventually, especially when he doesn't need any demonic sword to go into his true DT

Maybe in the future, but he needs one if thats the case. Red queen will simply be to weak for him.

I get the feeling that Red Queen will break one day, though I cannot shake off this feeling that he will eventually pull out a DSN from within himself, I hope Itsuno doesn't go that route

[wetblues]

Originally posted by george47mathew:

Vergil actually has more refined power than Nero and Dante. The problem with him is that he does not truly have anything to fight for. Like for instance, on the why he needed MORE power. He just did not like being weak...but over the years he just lost direction completely and unlike Dante and Nero who uses power to protect than to simply dominate and destroy. So they have a firm direction and emotion to fight for. Vergil is still confused...

He did not truly fight Nero in his max power, He was clearly holding back from killing him outright. Nero won coz of his extreme emotion and frustration at his newfound knowledge of his father. Vergil seems oblivious. I dont think he knew he had a son.

If Vergil wanted, he could have killed Dante and Lady in the past, he had him for keeps.

Vergil simply wants to defeat and dominate. Not Kill.


Vergil still is confused and has no idea what or who to fight for.

Nero has a reason to fight for. He gets extra strength from his desire to protect.

Exactly, it felt like DMC 5 vergil had no purpose except playing with his brother

[wetblues]

Originally posted by Keagian:

Originally posted by wetblues:

Maybe in the future, but he needs one if thats the case. Red queen will simply be to weak for him.

Yea Red Queen, while durable, is only just a normal sword. Same with Rebellion, its just a long sword without any special properties until Dante merged it with Sparda. The Yamato that Vergil wields is already a extremely powerful sword that can empower its user and cut dimensions, which is why so many demons are drawn to it.

Eventually Nero is gonna need a demon sword of his own, if he wants to further tap into his demonic side.

Actually dante formed DSD like sparda formed "sparda sword" from himself. DSD is not a combination, it represents dante's new strength

[Justinyl]

Sparda original power consist of his sword sparda + rebelion + yamato. Danta only has sparda + rebelion combined. In truth sparda is stronger than dante.

[Kibarussell]

Nah considering Nero was actually able to make Urizen get off his seat while Dante couldn't speaks volumes of how strong he is now.

This is while Nero had almost no demon power at all and while Dante even had his father's sword.

I feel like people underestimate Nero because he is more human than Dante and Vergil. Is he weaker than current Dante and Vergil? Yeah more than likely, but DMC 3 Dante and Vergil? Nah that's lowballing him.