What would be considered the strongest 3 man team?

[VincentVolaju]

Which 3 man team combo would most likely be the strongest to use throughout the game? Assuming you weren't going to sub in any other characters, and were only going to use 3 for the entire game. Which job combos would you go with?

[Hinnyuu]

That depends entirely on how you define "strongest". Deals the most damage? Takes the least damage? Clears the story the fastest? Clears superbosses the fastest? Needs the least gear? There's a hundred hundred ways to approach this, and the answer changes based on how you ask the question.

[VincentVolaju]

Hmm, well not exactly has the most damage. I meant more so like, the 3 class combos that can cover everything needed in the game without having to swap in any other members. For example, a 3 man team that has tank, heals, dps, can kill flyers, can float, utility, buffs etc. Like which 3 man class combo has access to everything in game and can complete the story and hunts without many issues.

[Hinnyuu]

Originally posted by VincentVolaju:

cover everything needed in the game

"needed" how? Because you don't NEED a whole lot if all you're interested in is defeating everything. 3 White Mages can probably do it, it would just take FOREVER.

Originally posted by VincentVolaju:

For example, a 3 man team that has tank, heals, dps, can kill flyers, can float, utility, buffs etc. Like which 3 man class combo has access to everything in game and can complete the story and hunts without many issues.

So Float is an absolute requirement for you? What do you mean by "utility buffs"? Do you mean able to use absolutely every ability in the game? Because a lot of them are, well, pretty useless and superfluous, if you're talking kill/time efficiency. Float included.

All that being said, if I HAD to choose 3 characters to run with, no subbing allowed, I'd probably go with

Knight/Black Mage
Machinist/White Mage
Monk/Bushi

[Arkhne]

Originally posted by Hinnyuu:

All that being said, if I HAD to choose 3 characters to run with, no subbing allowed, I'd probably go with

Knight/Black Mage
Machinist/White Mage
Monk/Bushi

Go with these. I spent some time thinking about it, but these are better than anything I came up with.

[Serafie1999AD]

Originally posted by Hinnyuu:

Knight/Black Mage
Machinist/White Mage
Monk/Bushi

Sounds similar to what I'd have come up with, with the requirements given by OP. I'd have chosen Shikari instead of Machinist, though, for tanking.

[Arkhne]

Originally posted by Serafie1999AD:

Originally posted by Hinnyuu:

Knight/Black Mage
Machinist/White Mage
Monk/Bushi

Sounds similar to what I'd have come up with, with the requirements given by OP. I'd have chosen Shikari instead of Machinist, though, for tanking.

Pretty sure Machinist was chosen for endgame Time Magic Buffs. I would've tried to squeeze in Time Mage itself into a combo that needs Heavy Armour to give access to Haste/etc earlier in the game, but Machinist is generally considered the better class, I think (not sure, haven't used it yet).

EDIT: I suppose I should give an example, even if I think Hinnyuu's is better.

Shikari/Time (Protectga/Shellga/Hastega/Float)
Knight/Black
Red/White (Probably Fran or Ashe for the free spells early on)

[Hinnyuu]

Knight/Black Mage is a perfectly viable tank, you don't need a Shikari. Shikari is a luxury for 6-man parties, where you can make it tank first and then play it as an ace card vs. anything weak to dark damage. But outside of those two uses, it's not a very good job.

Knight/Black Mage meanwhile is not only a tank (missing out only on Main Gauche, which isn't a big deal) but also one of the best single-target damage dealers (thanks to Excalibur + White Robes) AND one of the best multi-target damage dealers (thanks to Black Magicks). In terms of overall damage flexibility, it's probably the single most powerful job combo in the game.

Machinist I take primarily for early guns. If you rush Arcturus and then Mithuna, there probably isn't a job in the game that will end the game having dealt more damage overall. Early/midgame is completely annihilated by the top-tier guns, and even at endgame it's one of the biggest single-hit damage sources in the game. At endgame you turn into Reverse tank that can keep the other two damage dealers in constant berserk and still refresh their Bravery/Haste. Being able to heal with Dark Shot + absorb gear for massive 0-mp heals is just gravy.

Monk/Bushi is a fairly obvious combination, a melee combo damage dealer that also sports Wither/Expose as well as powerful healing (thanks to mystic armor). It's not super amazing on trash, but with a Knight, Machinist, AND Black Mage around you basically have the best trash damage in the game already. On bosses, the usual combo shenanigans will more than redeem this pick.

[Nito]

Knight/Foebreaker a tank + debuff combo

White Mage/Dark Mage just focus on magic power and change to white robes or dark robes for the 50% bonus

Shikari or Bushi/Time Mage Hastega + a high combo rate

[Hinnyuu]

Originally posted by Nito:

Knight/Foebreaker a tank + debuff combo

Knight/Monk is superior to that in pretty much every way. There's exactly one enemy in the entire game where casting Addle is even worth it (Zodiark) and even there it's by no means required.

Originally posted by Nito:

Shikari or Bushi/Time Mage Hastega + a high combo rate

Shikari without mystic armor is practically useless, as the only way to deal respectable damage is via boosted Yagyu. Bushi without Focus/Adrenaline is a substantial damage loss as well. Haste is overrated as a buff, it's not worth losing 50% extra damage from boost or Adrenaline. ESPECIALLY not on a combo class, since more combos = less time charging = less benefit from Haste.

[Serafie1999AD]

Originally posted by Hinnyuu:

Machinist I take primarily for early guns. If you rush Arcturus and then Mithuna, there probably isn't a job in the game that will end the game having dealt more damage overall. Early/midgame is completely annihilated by the top-tier guns, and even at endgame it's one of the biggest single-hit damage sources in the game. At endgame you turn into Reverse tank that can keep the other two damage dealers in constant berserk and still refresh their Bravery/Haste. Being able to heal with Dark Shot + absorb gear for massive 0-mp heals is just gravy.

I guess this is an issue of different gamestyles. In my WM/Machinist combo, the Machinist was almost useless until I got Mithuna. To get Mithuna, I had to farm Archaeoaevises for Emperor Scales, but I wasn't strong enough to regularly beat them until the end-game (post-Pharos). For crafting Arcturus, it's not exactly easy to beat a Salamand Entite when you first encounter them. A combination of Black Robes + Mithuna + Dark Shot is indeed strong, but most enemies in the end-game are undead and absorb Dark. The Machinist's finest hour is against Yiazmat, but for most of the game, Machinist was a hindrance to me. I'd rather pair the class with someone who gets Focus/Adrenaline, and who you can Berserk (no point Berserking a White Mage). I didn't use Machinist for Hastega, either. You get Hastega very late in the game, and I almost never used it even with a Time Battlemage, so I just decided to give Famfrit to my Monk for an additional Arise, which turned out to be much more useful than Hastega.

Originally posted by Nito:

Knight/Foebreaker a tank + debuff combo

Foebreaker isn't really a useful class. There's other classes that are more reliable (read: less random) with the melee damage, and the debuffs can be replaced by using other, more useful classes.

[Nito]

Originally posted by Hinnyuu:

Knight/Monk is superior to that in pretty much every way. There's exactly one enemy in the entire game where casting Addle is even worth it (Zodiark) and even there it's by no means required.


Shikari without mystic armor is practically useless, as the only way to deal respectable damage is via boosted Yagyu. Bushi without Focus/Adrenaline is a substantial damage loss as well. Haste is overrated as a buff, it's not worth losing 50% extra damage from boost or Adrenaline. ESPECIALLY not on a combo class, since more combos = less time charging = less benefit from Haste.

Addle is not the why it is worth Wither is the gamebreaker even more on late game enemies

i dont see much use of Focus/Adrenaline since most enemies just insta kill you(bosses) or keeps with you bad status like poison/sap/disease so you never keep 100% of health or critical life with haste you just keep attacking if you combo lucky you and with a 10% chance without low life(unless like someone said keeps one with reverse and 2 others healing each other) and never change the other two characters with good gambits....

[Nito]

Originally posted by Serafie1999AD:

Foebreaker isn't really a useful class. There's other classes that are more reliable (read: less random) with the melee damage, and the debuffs can be replaced by using other, more useful classes.

That is why the knight class as well just make basic sword/shield gives you evade and a fixed damage

[Hinnyuu]

Originally posted by Serafie1999AD:

I guess this is an issue of different gamestyles. In my WM/Machinist combo, the Machinist was almost useless until I got Mithuna. To get Mithuna, I had to farm Archaeoaevises for Emperor Scales, but I wasn't strong enough to regularly beat them until the end-game (post-Pharos). For crafting Arcturus, it's not exactly easy to beat a Salamand Entite when you first encounter them.

Yes, the value of Machinist absolutely rises and falls with how you approach gun acquisition. You don't need to defeat the Salamand Entite, by the way; the Salamand Halcyon is available via stealing, and since entites start out neutral, they reset their inventory on a single zone switch. It's not THAT hard to steal it, especially if you wait until after Raithwall so you have Thief's Cuffs (and, incidentally, an easier source of Wyvern Wing as well).
Archaeoaevis I usually kill after Henne Mines/Eruyt Village, since that gives access to Karkata. Bouncing confuse status on them (coupled with blind) you can whittle them down over a couple of minutes. 1 Emperor Scale can also be stolen from the Elder Wyrm boss.
It certainly takes some time to get those guns, but they also save a lot of time. You can tear through Nabudis with them fairly well, and that in turn gives a substantial boost to the rest of your team as well.

But as always, this is entirely up to personal preference. If you take a different route through the post-Raithwall world, you might find some other combo more useful.

Originally posted by Serafie1999AD:

A combination of Black Robes + Mithuna + Dark Shot is indeed strong, but most enemies in the end-game are undead and absorb Dark. The Machinist's finest hour is against Yiazmat, but for most of the game, Machinist was a hindrance to me.

I find that something like Yiazmat is actually the WORST time to be using a Machinist for damage. Guns are most powerful relative to other weapons when there's as few hits to count as possible, since their per-hit damage is very high but their sustained damage per time is very low (because of their slow charge and inability to combo). The longer the fight, the further ahead combo weapons are. Yiazmat is the epitome of combo weapon madness, as it's not only the longest fight in the game by far, it's also a fight where you can easily maintain <6.25% HP on your combo attackers, sending their damage into entirely new realities.
My main use for Dark Shot is actually to heal, not to attack; you're very right that a TON of enemies immune/absorb dark in this game. The shots I use most are Silent Shot and Wyrmfire Shot - tripling damage via Oil can yield some insane numbers. Nothing quite like critting for 50,000 damage on a story boss.

Originally posted by Serafie1999AD:

I'd rather pair the class with someone who gets Focus/Adrenaline, and who you can Berserk (no point Berserking a White Mage).

I find Focus/Adrenaline overrated for Machinist. They already oneshot or near-oneshot most trash enemies, and they already suck on long sustained damage - adding 20%/50% damage is usually not going to change any of that in meaningful ways. And if you really need it, you can always get it via an accessory, which isn't hard for Machinist since they don't care about stats, and berserk yourself manually. Personally, I use berserk a LOT on my Machinist/White Mage. Berserk is really a godsend for guns, as it helps you consistently oneshot trash before it becomes a problem. And it's easy to turn on/off via Berserker Bracers if you do end up in a spot where you need a lot of healing.

Originally posted by Nito:

Addle is not the why it is worth Wither is the gamebreaker even more on late game enemies

I only mention Addle because Monk already has Wither/Expose so that's obviously not an argument to be taking Foebreaker.

Originally posted by Nito:

i dont see much use of Focus/Adrenaline since most enemies just insta kill you(bosses) or keeps with you bad status like poison/sap/disease so you never keep 100% of health or critical life with haste you just keep attacking if you combo lucky you and with a 10% chance without low life(unless like someone said keeps one with reverse and 2 others healing each other) and never change the other two characters with good gambits....

There's a number of superbosses where you can maintain <6.25% HP for maximum combo rate practically throughout the fight - including the two longest fights, Hellwyrm and Yiazmat. And maintaining Focus is pretty easy with a dedicated tank, giving you a free +20% damage for a lot of the game.

[Serafie1999AD]

Hinnyuu, I believe some of those citations were quoting me, not Nito.

Originally posted by Nito:

That is why the knight class as well just make basic sword/shield gives you evade and a fixed damage

So why take a Foebreaker at all? When Knight gives you the tankiness and damage, what does Foebreaker give you? Nothing! You may as well pair Knight with someone who gives them Mystic Armor, such as Bushi (or Black Mage). If it's debuffs you want, I usually used Monk (or Uhlan) for that. A Monk is a useful class that you can pair with someone like Bushi (or Black Mage, or if you really want all 4 debuffs, use Monk & Time Battlemage, and give Zeromus to your TBM).

[Nito]

Originally posted by Serafie1999AD:

So why take a Foebreaker at all? When Knight gives you the tankiness and damage, what does Foebreaker give you? Nothing! You may as well pair Knight with someone who gives them Mystic Armor, such as Bushi (or Black Mage). If it's debuffs you want, I usually used Monk (or Uhlan) for that. A Monk is a useful class that you can pair with someone like Bushi (or Black Mage, or if you really want all 4 debuffs, use Monk & Time Battlemage, and give Zeromus to your TBM).

Well if the class has Wither and Expose or Wither and Addle it is good enough