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1. Dark Elfs
2. Dark Elfs
3. Dark Elfs
4. Skaven
5. Tomb Kings
6. Greenskins
7. Lizards
8. Empire
9. Dwarfs
10. Brettonia
11. Wood Elfs
12. Vampire Coast
13. Vampire Counts
14. Norsca
15. Chaos
16. Beastmen
17. High Elfs since all of Ulthuan is going to the dark side before turn 100 every single campaign I play
EDIT: Added Chaos/Beasts to the bottom; they badly need updates. Greenskins are probably too high here; some campaigns I see them take over a bunch of Dwarf territory but others I see them ordertided out.
Nah. They get to chill with ordertide and sometimes have a foothold in Araby. Vampires are a lot more boned right now. Counts get ordertided out. Coast sits around doing nothing in their starting provinces.
Vampires are worse then Bretonnia? High elves are worse than Bretonnia?
This isn't technically heresy but my gut says, heresy.
Also regarding Bretonnia my critique is based more on asthetic, spiritual, moral, and darwinian grounds.
Gameplay wise they suck so bad the devs got rid of supply chains for them so it's hard to loose as Bretonnia. Despite their inferiority in every regard.
Why Dark Elfs are the strong ones? I tried them but Idk, they didn't seem too much good
Oh did you mean as a *player* faction? That's just how they usually end up when AI does it all.
Dark Elves are among the stronger ones because they have great income, access to every type of unit, and good stuff in eveyr unit category. Black Arks are pretty OP espercially on high difficulty (since you can essentially "hide" an army's upkeep and not recievce the crippling supply lines penalty).
But Skaven, played right, can also be incredibly powerful. Lizards are super easy to play and can stomp. High Elfs are quite a bit weaker than Dark at the moment, but are still a great well-rounded faction with amazing economy. Honestly, as a player, you can make any faction work, alrhough some are quite a bit weaker than others.
Right now for the AI, yeah. Brettonia is part of ordertide, so they keep their coast (until the Dark Elfs are finished with Ulthuan) and part of Araby. They don't expand much, but they tend to survive. Vampire Coast just says in their starting provinces and never seems to do much (maybe takes a bit of Ulthuan). Vampire Counts get wrecked by Empire, Dwarfs, Orcs, and sometimes even Skaven.
Not totally relevant to this topic, but they were the *strongest* multiplayer faction at the WC.
2. Skaven due to the same, ambush stance, undercities and ability to defense small settlements.
3. Bretonnia due to supply limits removed. This seriously allows them to have a higher economy than any other faction other than HELFS and sport far more armies.
4. Vampire Coast as they totally ignore economy and have super powerful magic and doomstacks.
5. Empire due to high magic, access to all lores, viable doomstacks, high economy, easy confeds and alliances, and able to specialize armies to each faction's weakness.
6. Dark Elves if you abuse their slavery system, otherwise they're below average. Doom stacks aren't a strong point here, and they have less access to magic than other factions. Their economy dies out over long campaigns and you need to be aggressive, and still will ultimately be lower than High Elves.
7. Cult of Sotek lizards (other lizards would be in the 9 and below region). They can get upkeep free unbreakable doomstacks with infinite magic. That is powerful.
8. Vampire counts - knowledgable spam, dark incarnate spam, strong LL, ♥♥♥♥ stacking. Essentially a cheeser fav. Able to make multiple 1 LL armies and just abuse magic. Outside of exploiting mechanics, they are average.
9. Tomb Kings, free upkeep and if you abuse their lord recruitment cheese they can get a lot of free upkeep armies. Essentially doing everything vampire counts do, but far worse due to limited heroes and otherwise limited recruitment.
10. Woodelves due to magic and hidden abuse allowing you to solo whole factions with 4 LL without any units. Flying doomstack is viable with Sisters, otherwise you only have 2 real viable armies which are both doomstacks. Regardless, magic is the forte here. Rather meh outside of magic abuse.
11. Greenskins. Weak units across entire roaster, poor economy, only 1 average LL, rest being weak. Access to limited magic that can't be abused. No real strengths beyond easy confederate.
12. Dwarves. OK units. Weak melee units. No magic. No real way to defend against magic. No mechanic equal to magic. Average LL other than grommy. High economy. Only real strength is economy and theme. Otherwise they're quite weak, and the current meta across campaign and multiplayer is a focus on magic. Because double clicking a spell and killing 600+ units every 30 seconds, is better than a weak army that gets 100 kills per unit across a battle.
13. Chaos. Weak units other than 2. No economy. Easily led to campaign over disasters. 2 LL are strong, but other 1 is weak, no access to 4th, generics are weak. Limited access to magic. Limited by growth.
14. Beastmen. They're beastmen. No good units, all bottom tier of what they do. No real magic. No good LL. No useful mechanics. Suffers from everything chaos does but worse.
At least from the perspective of a Very Hard player, Dark Elfs are a fair bit stronger than High Elfs. Your trade economy is a bit weaker sure. Not sure what you mean by "abuse their slavery system"; that's just a part of the faction. You send them all to 2 or 3 provinces that can make 8k apiece.
But the real charm is Black Arks. Mobile high-tier recruitment stations are great, but you can also hide your whole army in there and not increase your supply line cap (relevant on VH) and pay a fraction of the upkeep.
For magic, Dark is just about the best school of magic besides Life. Blade Wind is super OP until end game. You also have access to Fire and Death. Not sure about doom stacking, but your armies have great hybrid units like Medusae, Darksharts (much better than HE archers). You also have Malus, who might be the strongest LL in the whole game. Maybe in the super late game when everyone has stacks of T5 units, HE are stronger -- phoenoixes are just awesome -- but DE rule the midgame. You also have 4 hero types that are all great in your army (assassins maybe less than the others but omg death hags)
Last, but definitely not least, your AI companions are going to be werecking everything in the current patch. In every campaign I play, DE just melt Ulthuan and even expand towards the old world. You can confederate if you'd like or just keep them as an ally.
My personal list is these along with my favorite Legendary Lord to use per race
1.) High Elves Alith Anar
2.) Dark Elves Malus Darkblade
3.) Bretonnia Louen Leoncour or Repanse
4.) Vampire Coast Aranessa Saltspite or Luthor Harkon
5.) Tomb Kings Khalida
6.) Wood Elves Sisters of Twilight
7.) Lizardmen Nakai
8.) Vampire Counts Isabella and Vlad
9.) Dwarfs Ungrim Ironfist
10.) Beastmen Malagor
The ones not listed here are the groups I don't bother to play, simply because I do not like their campaigns or rosters. But if I had to pick here they are.
11.) The Empire Karl Franz
12.) Skaven Thrott
13.) Greenskins Wurrzag
14.) Norsca Throgg
15.) Warriors of Chaos Archaon
Cool so you are a pretentious pseudo-intellectual who has clearly in the past shown zero basic knowledge about certain elements of the Warhammer setting, despite constantly bringing it up.
Funny that you think their gameplay is bad because in a recent worldwide multiplayer tournament Bretonnia along with Wood Elves and the Greenskins were the top three for scoring wins while the Empire was in the bottom five biggest losers. I am just guessing you are one of those players who can't do anything but infantry based armies with lots of ranged and artillery.
The best moustache goes to Volkmar the Grim. He is #1. Dwarves are really good runner-ups with their beardiness, Bretonia third, and then Norsca. Honorary mention to Noctilus and Settra. Settra does not shave.
There is a hero and lord combo that brings their decline to 0 and improves income by roughly 300%. So you'd be losing money in supply lines, but overall profit from it. Dark is no where near as good as Vampire. Blade Wind is actually the weakest in terms of AP and overall damage of vortex spells, with no way to improve such as with Fire or Ruin. Has higher costs across the board as well. Medusa are worthless units and not even remotely worth their cost. Darkshards are better than HE archers, but there is no comparable unit to Sisters of Avelorn that outform the entire DE roster. For cheaper. And sooner accessed. Malus is the strongest LL with the sword of Khaine, which gimps your entire faction, thus is a dumb option. Also, with the sword, Vlad far outperforms Malus.
It seems you don't really optimize your playthrough, but instead brute force your way, and aren't fully aware of the strengths and mechanics available to other factions or DE.
Also, HE is able to field 10x the armies, each out performing the DE roster. Have far higher winds of magic, and access to multiple fields. Have free construction, free recruitment, diplomacy on everyone, huge growth, immunity to public order from mid-game onwards.
From the perspective of a Legendary difficulty player.
My first act as a pseudo-intellectual will be to summarize my arguments against Bretonnia.
1. Aesthetic concerns- They look like a 4 year old illustrated them with crayons. If you put my children in charge of art design, the results would be indistinguishable. The voice acting is absurd.
2. Political - Feudalism. Lame.
3. Philosophical- They hand over their fates to the lady, rather than attempt to deal with their problems as fully realized, autonomous beings.
4. Fools - They are fools. The Lady is an elves goddess manipulating them at every turn.
5. Degenerates- Having abandoned thier own fates, Bretonnians have physically degenerated to barely sentient demi humans. The exception is the ascended, but also inhuman, nobles, who made the same deal but got a better bargain.
6. Technology- Look at their tech tree. Bretonnians discover friendship, fire, and putting excrement on arrows. In keeping with their intellectual capacities I suppose.
7. The End Times - Its cannon. They get what they deserve.