Star Dragon Breath Does Nothing to Leaders

[NecessaryWeevil]

Okay, so several times I've had star dragons target enemy leaders with their breath, with no perceptible effect on their health bars. Star Dragons are supposed to be awesome. What am I missing?

[wpegg]

Breath attacks are area effect, they are not very good at damaging single entities. Just like vortex or wind spells. With star dragon breath you want to target a bunch of high value infantry like Black Guard of Naggarond or Har Ganeth Executioners.

[veracsthane]

Originally posted by wpegg:

Breath attacks are area effect, they are not very good at damaging single entities. Just like vortex or wind spells. With star dragon breath you want to target a bunch of high value infantry like Black Guard of Naggarond or Har Ganeth Executioners.

they actually have youtube videos on this and star dragon does dummy damage all around the skill likely missed. somehow for some reason and id have to have the video footage to say more.

star dragon does do damage to single entity and since he said lord i suspect magical resistance and ward saved blocked it or it missed.

sun dragon is like normal damage moon dragon is like armor piercing damage star dragon is like magic damage. if you dont know the difference between damage types then that means nothing and the only thing you need to know is when a lord has enough magic resistance and wardsave magic damage is worse then armor pericing damage

all dragon breath is magic damage. it wont do damage to the lord because of the resistance which you can see if you pause the game. it was like 50-60 combined and its pointless because you do half damage at most.

[KG]

Under the hood, star dragons' breath weapon consists of 15 projectiles and the 5 meter explosion AoE attached to each projectile, fired randomly inside of a moderately focused cone. Each projectile does 32 normal and 50 armor piercing non-magical fire damage while the explosions deal 19 normal and 31 AP damage. So the maximum damage it could deal assuming you find a target big enough and slow enough to actually get hit by every projectile is 765 normal and 1,215 AP damage.

That requires a good shot on an almost stationary and very big target though. Most lords' mounts aren't nearly big enough to eat all of that and they're unlikely to remain still enough unless you've engaged them with units of your own that have a lot of mass - who will likely eat some of the breath attack too.

Even the biggest lord on foot will likely only take a few hundred damage and that's before you factor in missile resistance, physical resistance, and ward save. I don't know how often most foot lords get knocked down by a star dragon's breath but if that happens it, being knocked down will also prevent further damage until the lord gets up. (This is part of why cavalry is terrible at killing fleeing units.)

So you should save that breath attack for either densely-packed elites like wpegg said or a really high-value, really big, and really stationary enemy unit. For a lord on foot or horse just drop out of the sky on his head, preferably when he's already engaged with your infantry or cavalry.

The value in star dragons is being a deadly anti-elite unit that can pick and choose which fight to engage in, almost always get the charge bonus when engaging a unit, and inflict fear and terror where you most want it, when you want it. The breath weapon is just one part of that, and honestly kind of the hardest of them to really use well outside of sieges (which enough breath attacks will trivialize).

(P.S., if your super valuable dragon ever gets in an engagement you don't like the easiest way to make a getaway is to walk through a line of your own infantry to peel off the enemy so you can get back into the sky. Goodbye armor-piercing antilarge!)

Originally posted by veracsthane:

...

Where do you get all this nonsense, really?

[veracsthane]

Originally posted by KG:

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SQWhCxqM7E
https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/dz402q/best_dragon_breath_testing_analysis/
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1SP8LZEWiDEr4ecujNO0nKd5wwtJ8s5UdQ7YOgmKMEfM/edit?usp=sharing

https://totalwarwarhammer.fandom.com/wiki/Star_Dragon%27s_Breath
the only thing i mis remembered was dragon breath being magical and you utterly ignored what i said.

instead of magical resistance physical fire and missile would block it the core of what i said was and is unchanged

there are multiple videos of this too so you can just go back to youtube and find one that shows what you are looking for and thanks to people like legend of total war you are guranted to see in game instead of the lab if you want actual footage thats been posted for 6 years.

go back to that cess pool vermin tide 2 or mind your manners.

[veracsthane]

and agian i have 90% of the achievements the only ones im missing being multi player and norsca and some of the make x building with y faction that i missed because its faction specfic or i dropped the campaign on the win.

its like 3 breath attacks that hit to delete a carnosaur a single target creature you can use 2 and just finish it off in melee the only reason a lord specifically wouldnt take damage despite being hit is if the breath attack missed or was blocked by resistances.

you are the definition of petty if you are throwing a fit over which resistance blocks it.

[veracsthane]

and op so you know why we said something about which lord and said it was relevant information malekith has like 70% resistance to physical and missle combined as a default 20 turns in im literally take a break from alinath anar where he was on foot with literally that to make these replies and imrik has like 70%+ fire resistance it tells you in the wiki its fire related missile damage and fire damage is almost always from bretonnia peasent archers aka missile damage or magic like fire mages. fire damage and magic tend to go hand and hand and no this really isnt that important kg is a clown who pisses me off though so here we are. he literally has the stupiest opinions that dont even change what was actually said among other issues.

the only way something doesnt do damage in tww1 or tww2 or even tww3 is if the resistance is high enough to block it or missed.

oh no its missle instead of magic reistance that blocked it. i literally said it was blocked by a resistance or missed. thanks for confirming it in your "disagreement"

[Khan Boyzitbig of Mercia]

Resistance cannot be 100%, so as long as an attack hits it will do damage.

[NecessaryWeevil]

I appreciate the help. Thanks all.

[veracsthane]

Originally posted by Khan Boyzitbig of Mercia:

Resistance cannot be 100%, so as long as an attack hits it will do damage.

yes but there is a big diffrence between 1k damage and 1 damage which resistance can get you damn close to when stacked high enough see any youtube one man doom stack where archeon or any other lord kills 4 armies alone with easy.

you can also literally just go in game and confirm things by targeting certain heroes which are known to have higher resistances.

a star dragon breath on a lord will easily do close to 1k or more if it hits unless resistances are high that 1k is on a dawrf lord with missile resistance magic resistance and armor/shielded. it can be higher especially if everything hits.

and if it misses. ya missed. a miss wont do damage.

[veracsthane]

Originally posted by Weevil:

I appreciate the help. Thanks all.

cheers sorry for getting annoyed the game has things that you wont know unless you try it like how calavary actually kills broken units faster if you turn off the fast move the double arrow under the unit cards -edit in this is caused by the speed difference and charge bonus and also applies to lords running down lords like how skaven are typically faster then humans or dawrves- or how hybrid weapons act like ranged units in melee unless you intentionally tell them to goto melee.

wg is being a prick because of statements like that which are factual btw. it sounds stupid until you do it in game and get results that show. you can literally zoom in on the hybrid units and ranged units vs spear units hyrbid units will literally behave like ranged units and literally take their spears out meaning it even has an animation for the behavior change.

thats archers vs lothern sea guard vs spear...

another one is with the sheilded. things like mortars break the formation so they dont get "sheilded status" so you can increase the ranged damage you deal. the same thing happens with Calvary and large charge defense from spears and agian the animations will show it. there is a visual representation of it. Calvary will get stuck on a "wall" and take damage where as the spears will get flung and take damage and its visually notable.