Ranking the races based on noob-friendliness (for ME campaign)

[burningmime]

Was reading a different topic where someone said empire was easy and that got me thinking (cause I don't think Empire right not is easy at all). Here's how I would rank the 10 I've played enough to rank. I haven't played Brettonia or Tomb Kings enough to rank them, and haven't played Beastmen/Norsca/Chaos at all.

1. Lizardmen - Saurus are dead easy; get huge armies and right click on things. Replace them with dinos when you have the money. Do the rite to get a free army that will stomp everything until turn 50 or so. Their campaign mechanics are very basic and simple; not much to learn. They have pretty good economy (especially late game when the geomantic web kicks in). Their start positions are mostly protected or on the edges of the map, and they have other lizard allies around.

2. Wood Elfs - Their campaign is kind of strange/different than the others, but it's very guided with missions to tell you what to do. A lot of factions hate you, but your forests are defensible. Very powerful in battle, especially against the AI because you have strong missile units and very strong heroes/lords to hold the front line (I think this gets less effective on low model count; if you have ultra unit size then WE heroes are super tanky). And you don't have to manage dozens of cities; you only have a few forests to build up and recruit from.

3. High Elfs - Surrounded by friends in Ulthuan, incredible economy, very strong armies throughout the game. They would be #1, but IMO they are a bit more complex than lizards or woodies, since they require a tiny bit more work in battle, and because their troops are expensive so you're stuck with one army for a while.

4. Greenskins - Very powerful in the current patch. Simple but brutally effective campaign mechanics (scrap upgrades for your best troops then call a wag). They're a combined arms faction and rely a bit on melee infantry, which does make them harder than some other factions in battle, but you have a big green wag button. And goblins are so overtuned in the current patch it's hard to go wrong.

5. Dwarfs - Haven't done a full campaign with them since TWW1, so not totally sure where to put this. I'd say in a lot of ways (especially in battle), they're the noob-friendliest since you just stick a bunch of dudes in front of artillery and cheese the AI. No mages or cav to micro. But it seems like they're a bit weak in this patch, and you need to turtle up until T4 to get their best units. Expanding too quickly is going to give you a bunch of grudges.

6. Vampire Coast - You can sit with one city (in the case of the dreadfleet an almost impenatrable one) and use pirate coves to make all your money. Army has good artillery to cheese the AI. Raise dead for insta-armies. You do have to deal with corruption mechanics, but it never feels too bad. I've actually only played them in Vortex where they have a quite guided campaign with littler things to do like dig for treasure, etc. They would be higher on the list but they just have so many meachnics so I don't think they're actually newbie-friendly.

7. Dark Elfs - Tons of ways to make money, very good units (especially darksharts), black arks, and very overtuned AI allies. Malekith is braindead easy from what I remember. But this is brought down because the other lords have tricky start positions that force them into war very early on and make their early game very challenging.

8. Vampire Counts - Insta-armies of raise dead, lore of vampires, and low battle complexity (you're basically forced to rush), albeit you do need to be casting spells. You can get by with massing low-tier units for a long while. However, in campaign you need to deal with corruption mechanics (that force slow expansion) and everyone hates you. Overextending can lead to ruin very quickly.

9. Skaven - One of the most mechanically complex factions, both in battle and on the campaign map. You can make some poor decisions or army builds early on that can hurt you down the line. Their economy is weak, food requires careful management or undercities, etc. However, they are really really powerful (especially with DLC), probably the strongest race in the game vs the AI if played properly. I would never reccomend a player start here unless they like rats.

10. Empire - Reason I made this list :-). I think Empire in their current state are the *least* noob-friendly faction. First, they're a combined arms faction with strong cav and wizards, meaning they require some work to control in battle. Their low-tier units aren't the best; you can't just right click and win like most other factions. The elector counts shuffle thing can very easily mess you up and give you huge penalties when your authority drops. Overextending will leave you with a bit of a mess on your hands. Vampires can quickly eat up your allies and corrupt your land if RNG decides it likes vampires that run (even worse if orcs take over dwarfs). You're very likely to be in the middle of the map with a multi-front war.

Not saying Empire are challenging to veteran players (none of these are, although some specific factions can be a PITA). They're quite fun and their econ means they can be very powerful. But for a new player, playing Empire is really jumping into the deep end where you're forced to learn tons of mechanics while being threatened on all sides.

Feel free to add your own ranking or tell me I'm an idiot.

EDIT 2: Where would y'all stick the other 5 factions? Every time I play tomb kings I feel like it's cutting teeth; I barely get anywhere. But I play on VH/N. And I hate playing end turn simulator for 50 turns. Bret seems like you can cheese with lord spam because no supply line penalties, but that probably isn't something a newbie would do, and they're fairly micro-intensive for sure. No idea about the hordes or the angry Vikings.

[Mr Robert House]

I wouldn’t say any race is particularly noob friendly, they all have aspects that need to be learned, and some lords have very different starts within the same faction.

[ChuTheMan]

I dont think it's enough to just go by races, but also factions. since some factions under the same race got different mechanics that can make them easier or harder to play or just add more micromanagement to them.

[Man of Culture]

I don't think there's much to debate the list you made is pretty much spot on as far as I'm concerned. Getting into certain factions within the races could add some depth to it but as it stands this is a solid take.

[Sifer2]

Originally posted by Mr Robert House:

I wouldn’t say any race is particularly noob friendly, they all have aspects that need to be learned, and some lords have very different starts within the same faction.

Nah I think High Elves/Dwarves are both as noob friendly as you can get. Strong economy which supports turtling up. And tanky units that let you just sit back, and spam ranged. Elves a bit harder to use on battlefield but easier to manage diplomacy on world map. I guess it's nice both games have a easier faction for newbies to cut their teeth on. I wonder who it will be in game 3 though. Probably Kislev or Cathay.

[Totally Not Myers]

Originally posted by Sifer2:

Originally posted by Mr Robert House:

I wouldn’t say any race is particularly noob friendly, they all have aspects that need to be learned, and some lords have very different starts within the same faction.

Nah I think High Elves/Dwarves are both as noob friendly as you can get. Strong economy which supports turtling up. And tanky units that let you just sit back, and spam ranged. Elves a bit harder to use on battlefield but easier to manage diplomacy on world map. I guess it's nice both games have a easier faction for newbies to cut their teeth on. I wonder who it will be in game 3 though. Probably Kislev or Cathay.

Agreed about Dwarfs. I can literally go afk to get a drink or use the bathroom, come back, and they're still doing their thing in a battle with next to no developments.

[burningmime]

Originally posted by Sifer2:

Originally posted by Mr Robert House:

I wouldn’t say any race is particularly noob friendly, they all have aspects that need to be learned, and some lords have very different starts within the same faction.

Nah I think High Elves/Dwarves are both as noob friendly as you can get. Strong economy which supports turtling up. And tanky units that let you just sit back, and spam ranged. Elves a bit harder to use on battlefield but easier to manage diplomacy on world map. I guess it's nice both games have a easier faction for newbies to cut their teeth on. I wonder who it will be in game 3 though. Probably Kislev or Cathay.

Dwarfs are super easy in battle, but in campaign you can end up overextending and getting tons of grudges. Also, I hear they are weak on this patch.

[burningmime]

Originally posted by Chutheman:

I dont think it's enough to just go by races, but also factions. since some factions under the same race got different mechanics that can make them easier or harder to play or just add more micromanagement to them.

I was kind of taking the average. But you're right in that a hard faction of an otherwise easy race (e.g. Imrik, Grom) is going to be much harder than an easy faction of a challenging race (e.g. Ikit, Malekith)

[KaBandha]

Thats pretty good ranking. I would only put Greenskins behind Dwarves.

[echoes222]

Originally posted by Mr Robert House:

I wouldn’t say any race is particularly noob friendly, they all have aspects that need to be learned, and some lords have very different starts within the same faction.

helves are really easy tho. Maybe not Teclis or that dragon douche-b but other than those 2, easy mode

[burningmime]

Originally posted by KaBandha:

Thats pretty good ranking. I would only put Greenskins behind Dwarves.

I put dwarfs low because I heard they're weak in this patch. And Greenskins for sure are crazy strong in this patch.

[Step Sis Proof Appliances]

I agree with all of this but I would put HE in either first or second with the Lizardmen following.

[burningmime]

Originally posted by Step Sis Proof Appliances:

I agree with all of this but I would put HE in either first or second with the Lizardmen following.

Reason I put lizzies first is that a full army of saurus can take you really far in the game. Then on turn 15 or whatever, you do the ritual and get some dinos to mix in. Battles are really easy.

With HElfs, a single army of spearmen/archers will get you fairly far, but start to fall off more quickly and need to be upgraded. It also requires a bit more micro (especially if you add casters to the mix, which you don't need to do for lizards). And when fighting DElfs, darksharts will beat archers 1 for 1, so you need to use the range advantage. Then there's LSG who have decent ranged attacks, but generally are better in melee (otherwise they're just overpriced, underperforming archers) -- and ideally you manage their ammo and switch them at 50%. Oh, and they rely a lot more on diplomacy than lizards; you need to butter up your neighboring factions, or at least check who likes whom before going to war. And an influence gauge to manage and if you spend it all on what the game tells you to (court intrigue stuff), you're stuck with ♥♥♥♥♥♥ traits on your lords and heroes (made that mistake my first time). And don't get me started on white lions...

Sorry I got on that train of thought and missed my station.

[Man of Culture]

I agree that lizardmen are easier than high elves. When your roster boasts a lot of its kill power in ranged units you have to use a lot of micro management just to avoid friendly fire. Lizardmen really don't have that issue to the same degree and like you said Saurus warriors don't really fall off. Any race where you don't need to upgrade units to higher tiers right away is a solid 'noob friendly' race in my book.

[Step Sis Proof Appliances]

Fair enough

[Chop]

The first faction I played was Vampire counts...now von carstein (mannfred) and it was interesting having no missiles and having to deal with corruption. other than that I'd say their pretty noob friendly.

After that was Wood Elves and well, I struggled with them. Mostly because of how expensive their units are and the fact that they cant build proper settlements outside their home settlement.

After that was Dark Elves who were incredibly straight forward, the only new thing was the slave economy which isn't that hard to get used to.

High Elves are even more simple than the dark elves but I find their starting position more difficult (Avelorn). I think something changed between my DF and HF campaigns because in my DF campaign I don't remember the Dark Elves starting with territory in Ulthuan.

Lastly I'm playing as the tomb kings who are definitely more advanced due to the fact that they have no upkeep for units or armies but major penalties elsewhere to compensate. But they're probably one of the funnest and most satisfying factions I've ever played now that I know what I'm doing.

If I had to rank, Dark Elves\High elves tied for easiest, Vampires 2nd, Wood Elves third and Tomb kings most difficult\advanced.