Dryads Kind of Suck?

[tiberiansun371alexw]

Most races have their anti-infantry units and their anti-cavalry units. And then then are some stuff like Peasants, Zombies, and Skavenslaves which are just there to waste time because they aren't going to do much against anything that fights back.

I'm wondering if Eternal Guards with shields are actually more cost effective than Dryads against armoured infantry.

The intuitive answer is obviously not. I mean Eternal Guards (shields) is a spear unit with an anti-large role. In this game, spear units are notably weaker against infantry as opposed to Rome II where they did OK. Dryads have physical resistance and they are cheaper. So against infantry Dryads should trade better and against cavalry Eternal Guards should trade better. The Eternal Guard might be able to hold the line better with their shields, but they wouldn't be cost effective at damaging infantry with armour right?

But on the other hand there are two things in the Eternal Guards' favor. They have shields which can block some damage, which means they can last longer to do their own damage. And their damage is armour piercing. Against units wit armour 75, this ought to be useful right?

To be clear, I know neither unit it the Elves' strengths. Archers and monsters are their endgame. The infantry's job is to buy time, not trade cost efficiently, but between these two units one of them obviously trades better right?

[Zane87]

Unless you are Drycha, Driads indeed suck and indeed should not be used, not even as line-holders.
Eternal Guards work quite well for that job and they are cheap

[Tricks]

Dryads are really only good for Drycha. They were never meant to be fighting heavily armored infantry. They're damage dealer units meant for flanking chaff T1 infantry.

If you want melee infantry that can deal damage you want wardancers, and more importantly, bladesingers. And... I guess Wildwood Rangers though I feel like their role has been taken by the superior bladesingers, so I'm not even sure what they're useful for anymore, tbh.

[Tomislav]

Dryads have less AP damage than Eternal Guard, why would they be better against armour? Dryads have Vanguard Deployment, magic attacks, cause fear, and are faster. Seems pretty obvious they don't fill the same niche.

[tiberiansun371alexw]

Originally posted by Tomislav:

Dryads have less AP damage than Eternal Guard, why would they be better against armour? Dryads have Vanguard Deployment, magic attacks, cause fear, and are faster. Seems pretty obvious they don't fill the same niche.

Well most races low tier anti-infantry units are more cost effective than their mid-tier anti-cavalry units against armoured infantry. Except it seems to me the shields and armour piercing of the Eternal Guards would make them obviously better even though it is theoretically an anti-cavalry unit.

[Tomislav]

Originally posted by tiberiansun371alexw:

Originally posted by Tomislav:

Dryads have less AP damage than Eternal Guard, why would they be better against armour? Dryads have Vanguard Deployment, magic attacks, cause fear, and are faster. Seems pretty obvious they don't fill the same niche.

Well most races low tier anti-infantry units are more cost effective than their mid-tier anti-cavalry units against armoured infantry. Except it seems to me the shields and armour piercing of the Eternal Guards would make them obviously better even though it is theoretically an anti-cavalry unit.

Dryads aren't anti-infantry though.

[tiberiansun371alexw]

Originally posted by Tomislav:

Dryads aren't anti-infantry though.

Wait what? Don't tell me their vangaurd deployment means they're supposed to sneak up and silence enemy missile units because they're too slow to do that.

[Tricks]

Originally posted by tiberiansun371alexw:

Originally posted by Tomislav:

Dryads have less AP damage than Eternal Guard, why would they be better against armour? Dryads have Vanguard Deployment, magic attacks, cause fear, and are faster. Seems pretty obvious they don't fill the same niche.

Well most races low tier anti-infantry units are more cost effective than their mid-tier anti-cavalry units against armoured infantry. Except it seems to me the shields and armour piercing of the Eternal Guards would make them obviously better even though it is theoretically an anti-cavalry unit.

There are a lot of low tier anti-infantry damage dealers that don't have much AP damage. Ghouls, flagellants, witch elves, marauder berserkers. In fact I think that most (if not all) units with the "Damage Dealer" descriptor have low AP damage.

[GalloglassCA]

Dryads are an early tier 1 unit designed to beat up on other low tier mid/low quality tier 1 troops.

[Andrewbh2003]

issue with dryads is there over-priced

there a 550 gold unit that in combat performs closer to a 450 ish unit

but thats because dryads have a LOT of gimmick traits that they pay for think about it

they have ITP they have magic damage they cause fear they have vanguard deployment and they themselves have phys resist

the only thing they dont have really is perfect vigour and regen while your at it and the problem is you rarely get to use ALL of these traits at the same time so they often times do indeed feel like they under-perform

are they a bad unit "hell no" but are they "too versatile for there own good?' thats a argument you can make

[tiberiansun371alexw]

Originally posted by Tricks:

There are a lot of low tier anti-infantry damage dealers that don't have much AP damage. Ghouls, flagellants, witch elves, marauder berserkers. In fact I think that most (if not all) units with the "Damage Dealer" descriptor have low AP damage.

That's rather ironic. Marauder berserkers actually have OK AP damage (not great, but not horrible).

Originally posted by Andrewbh2003:

they have ITP they have magic damage they cause fear they have vanguard deployment and they themselves have phys resist

I'm not even sure what good vangaurd deployment does for them.

[Andrewbh2003]

Originally posted by tiberiansun371alexw:

Originally posted by Tricks:

There are a lot of low tier anti-infantry damage dealers that don't have much AP damage. Ghouls, flagellants, witch elves, marauder berserkers. In fact I think that most (if not all) units with the "Damage Dealer" descriptor have low AP damage.

That's rather ironic. Marauder berserkers actually have OK AP damage (not great, but not horrible).

Originally posted by Andrewbh2003:

they have ITP they have magic damage they cause fear they have vanguard deployment and they themselves have phys resist

I'm not even sure what good vangaurd deployment does for them.

mass vanguard builds

wood elves can pull some VERY nasty mass vanguards

orion + deepwood scouts + a bunch of wild riders and maybe even a forest dragon mass vanguard start the battle right in your opponents face and catch them off guard

wood elf vanguard rushes while not optimal by any means can be VERY scary if used properly

thing is the only wood elf infantry that has vanguard by default are dryads so...

[Pimpin Pippin]

Dryads are for murdering archers, artillery and anything that lacks AP and is not armored.
Their leadership is very strong and will often fight to the last model.

Since they are small the dryads are phenomenal to use to intercept the enemy spearmen while your cavalry does its job.
Thats i guess why they have vanguard deployment, so you can use them as support for your cavalry to tie down enemy spearmen that protect the back line.

[Barser]

I think dryads are decent. They hold the line quite well since they are immune to terror.

[Aleera]

Neither of them is meant to fight armored infantry. You have Wildwood rangers, Bladesingers for that. Especially Bladesingers.

Eternal guard are just that, lineholders. They're not meant to trade into anything but buy time. Dryads are made to cut through low armored infantry. Archers, artillery.
They get vanguard. So they can easily sneak up on artillery.
They're immune to Psych, while causing fear themselves.

Dryads have their place, fighting armored infantry is not their place. Other then Dwarves at the early game, no faction should be wielding high enough armored against you on infantry that Eternal guard are more effective then Dryads.

[tiberiansun371alexw]

Originally posted by Aleera:

Neither of them is meant to fight armored infantry. You have Wildwood rangers, Bladesingers for that. Especially Bladesingers.

Oh I'm well aware of that. But one is obviously better than the other. And I find it funny the anti-cavalry unit appears to be better at it.