Total War: WARHAMMER II

Total War: WARHAMMER II

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burningmime May 27, 2021 @ 6:31pm
Do you use hero actions (and which ones)?
Embedding a hero in an army doesn't count.

Usually I don't want to sacrifice a hero (who could be in an army) doing dumb stuff on the campaign map. Seems rare that assault garrison or assault units would turn a losing battle into a winning one. Wound and assassinate seem better if you can pull it off, but even if you succeed, you've traded your hero for their hero (since your hero can't fight that turn). Not something I would bother with unless I had a high percentage chance of success or was really worried about an enemy wizard.

I guess steak tech, secure influence, etc, all have their uses. Again, I'd almost always rather have the hero in my army but if I run out of movement range and the hero has a bit more sometimes I will use an action just to get XP. Only for the hero to be wounded/die in the attempt. Also seems like the AI loves to assassinate lone heroes on the campaign map but not if they're in an army.

EDIT: Block Army is actually useful in some rare cases.
Last edited by burningmime; May 27, 2021 @ 6:38pm
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Showing 1-15 of 43 comments
I use hero actions quite often.
Fryskar May 27, 2021 @ 7:16pm 
Assassinate if one bothers me, break walls if i need a quick access with an army with lacking tools, block movement (although rarely) and steal tech if i got excess money (like on a skaven engi making underempires and having cd while near the intended target).
Powercow May 27, 2021 @ 7:18pm 
Almost every action has some good value.

Block Army is probably the strongest, since it can royally mess with the AI, stall an enemy's advance, or prevent them from running away. It's crazy good. When fully maxed out it's something like -80% or -90% movement. It pretty much roots an enemy army in place.
*Fun cheese: Chaos has a habit of not leaving behind any army in their 4-army doom packs, so if you root one in place the other 3 will just sit there next to it until it can move again. Not always, but often enough.

Assault Units is really strong when fully powered up. An Empire Captain can click a full 20 stack and take out 20-60% of like 5 units -- that's about 2 full unit's worth of damage. It's random what enemies it goes for though, so you might take out half of their Ratling Guns or half of their Skavenslaves.

Assault Garrison is much the same, but against garrisons only.

Assault Unit (singular) is much less impressive, but can be helpful for softening up a high-value target.

Destroy Walls is generally pretty meh, but can be helpful if you don't have any siege attackers for some reason.

Assassinate/Wound are fantastic for taking out high-priority enemy heroes or softening up an enemy's army. If you see a Skaven faction use the rite to spawn the plague hero, you'll be *real* happy you have an assassin on hand. And though the AI sucks at using magic, if you take out the only caster in their army that can be a big plus for you too.

Steal Tech is cute but only useful in large numbers. 15% research rate for a few turns, on its own, will often round out to no bonus at all. If you have 5 guys with it maxed out (35% each), though... that's pretty nice, if you have a lot of tech you still need.

Secure Influence is absolutely bonkers overpowered since they buffed it like 5 patches ago. It's insanely strong.

The only one I find to be pretty much entirely useless, at least on higher difficulties, is Hinder Replenishment. You have to damage, but not finish off, an enemy army that's in their own territory for it to even matter. Even then until it's completely maxed out it can be entirely negated (the AI's casualty replenishment bonus puts them way over the replenishment cap, so even with the debuff they might *still* be at the cap if they have some form of casualty replenishment buff.)
*Hinder Replenishment is just the absolute worst thing when they do it to you though, especially if you play a low-replenishment faction like Dwarfs or Bretonnia.

Of course the real advantage to hero actions is just vision. If you play on Legendary the last thing you wanna do is move an army out, and SURPRISE! there's 3 enemy armies in the fog of war. If you have heroes all over the place, you can safely scout with them and make more informed decisions.

This mostly applies to factions who have heroes to spare. The Empire, Dwarves, High Elves, Bretonnia, etc. can have crazy high hero caps. A dozen Witch Hunters roaming the map is so nice. Tomb Kings, on the other hand... lot harder to get a lot of heroes there.
KaBandha May 27, 2021 @ 7:38pm 
I use assault units,block army and assassinate regularly.
Hands of the Shadow Crown (High Elves Assassin Hero) have a 100% to Kill any Lord or Wound a Legendary Lord, and is effective against when the End times begin. Have three of them at the Chaos wastes. When Archeon, Sigvald and Kholek spawn, Assassinate each of these Legendary Lords.

You've just Defeated Chaos and Stopped the end times.
Last edited by His Excellency, Peter File; May 27, 2021 @ 7:46pm
I use hero actions mostly to level heroes and occasionally to block armies either to catch up or get away. If I have a hero scouting somewhere on their own and I have spare gold and a suitable target there's no reason to not get the exp.
Xaphnir May 27, 2021 @ 8:18pm 
Depends on the race. Khainite assassins and Eshin assassins are the ones I use the most frequently, as they're the best assassins in the game and can easily clear enemy heroes that are being used on the campaign map against me. I also really like Goblin Big Bosses, as they have assassinate and block army, the latter of which is probably the most powerful hero action. Most other heroes that have it are spellcasters, meaning I'd usually rather have them in an army.
Originally posted by Sir Smashing:
Hands of the Shadow Crown (High Elves Assassin Hero) have a 100% to Kill any Lord or Wound a Legendary Lord, and is effective against when the End times begin. Have three of them at the Chaos wastes. When Archeon, Sigvald and Kholek spawn, Assassinate each of these Legendary Lords.

You've just Defeated Chaos and Stopped the end times.
Hands of the Shadow Crown are honestly the main reason why I love the Nagarythe faction (that, and I think the start position is fun).
Fendelphi May 27, 2021 @ 10:57pm 
If you look at how much damage a non-magic hero does during a battle, and then compare it to a high tier unit, they dont really do that much. Sure, they are effective at what they do, but it is not like they are essential for the army.
Usually their biggest purpose in an army, is stuff like replenishment buffs, trait-based army buffs and to duel enemy heroes and lords, or tank/dispose of otherwise dangerous enemy units.

As Powercow said, their strategic impact on the campaign map can be very influential. If you have an army of mostly monstrous unit or cavalry, the ability to make actual holes in walls makes sieges much easier with such armies, as it greatly reduces the bottleneck issue for such units.
Similarly, having 2-3 heroes doing Assault Units on an enemy army will often kill off whole units and severely hurt everything else. Even a low tier army can then finish off a high tier stack.
On the same note, assault Garrison from 2-3 heroes can really soften up a siege, making auto resolve or manual engagement much easier.

Even though I prefer mages in my armies, You usually only have 1-2 of them per army. Having 1-3 of them running around and gaining research speed will greatly speed up your progression through the techtree. And they also help dealing with enemy heroes in the area, which weakenes enemy armies.
On top of that, it is a great way to quickly level them up(this goes for all heroes really). It is not uncommon for the first character to reach level 40 to be a hero. If need be, they can temporarily be put into a nearby army for some extra firepower.

Overall, how effective a hero is on the campaign map, is depending on their combination of campaign skills. Example, Empire Captains are awesome on the campaign map, as they have both Wound, Assault Units and Assault Garrison. Having 2 of these running together with a Witch Hunter(for the option of Block) and a nearby army, makes any engagement very easy(first, assassinate enemy hero in army, then follow up with 2x Assault Units).
Aleera May 27, 2021 @ 11:29pm 
I use hero actions when I need them, or where they help immensly.

For example, a banshee hero as the Vampire counts, to soften up, if not completly destroy all towers and walls in a city, so I can actually use my bloodknights.
Another 2 heroes (useally necromancers) that I use for farm assasinations.

The only race where I don't really use heroes with their actions, is Dwarves. Their value is way higher imbedded into a army then on the field.
Empukris May 28, 2021 @ 12:11am 
Steal tech one as it is one of the few that you can spam repeatedly to farm that juicy diplomatic favour.
Scouting is the main job for my hero's. Can't afford to walk into 2 stakes on legendary difficulty.
Invisible May 28, 2021 @ 2:55am 
Search Ruins
fmalfeas May 28, 2021 @ 3:10am 
Assault Unit (singular) can be broken powerful.

Maxed out, it does around 50% damage. Consider going into a fight with Durthu or Kholek and their HP is already at half.

If you do it to a lord who has Lore of Vampires or Lore of Life, they'll burn most of their winds before the fight even starts, healing up.
Jeslis May 28, 2021 @ 3:12am 
@OP; a bit of wording about your post concerns me...

(You said "Usually I don't want to sacrifice a hero (who could be in an army) doing dumb stuff on the campaign map")
To confirm; you're aware that embedding a hero in an army does NOT protect them. You can (and the AI WILL) assassinate/wound embedded heroes.

You can see this yourself by initiating hero actions on an AI army with a hero embed; it will give you a list of actions (eg; Assault army units the lord OR Assassinate the Hero in the army)

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Date Posted: May 27, 2021 @ 6:31pm
Posts: 43