Vampire counts are snoooooooze Zzzz fest

[JiMMy]

I got bored just burning through turns, tech is slow and weak, building are EXPENSIVE, units are EXPENSIVE and upkeep is too high. By turn 150 i have 6 stacks of tier 5 and 3 units and have to face 19 stacks of chaos and even though i have conquered all the empire with skeleton spam going against great swords and other empire doom stacks still my income is only 5k? how many more turns do i have to sit and burn until i can get a decent income?

This is booooooooooooring stuff mate!

Edit: Forgot to add that growth is also too slow despite me building the growth buildings and hero trait farming and all still feel like i am massively handicapped in terms of assets to AI factions around me on hard difficulty.

[[88th] ColPresumptuous]

... units expensive, upkeep to high... Vampire Counts...

What?...

[Xicsess]

So, you don't go 18 turns, free skeleton upkeep? Push a necro/wraith out to farm blood kisses from enemy heroes? Grab the +25% research hero, -50% hero upkeep hero and then just grab 1-2 good armies and spam skel stacks?

[Wh♂♂par]

Even if you don't want to do the above, you can get high tier units easy by resurrecting them from battle sites. No need for the high-tier buildings, and that's also why they're so expensive.

You can just instantly raise them, instead of having to wait min. 1 turn.

[yuzhonglu]

Get the free upgrade tech for skellies, and go all skelly armies.

With 1 Necromancer or Shadow mage.

Very cheap armies. And effective.

[JiMMy]

Originally posted by Xicsess:

So, you don't go 18 turns, free skeleton upkeep? Push a necro/wraith out to farm blood kisses from enemy heroes? Grab the +25% research hero, -50% hero upkeep hero and then just grab 1-2 good armies and spam skel stacks?

What difficulty are you playing? free skeleton armies get outdated quick and although it is doable it become a chore to always be undergunned. I did limit the reikland to a single sack city and farmed grimbane on all my generals.

[JiMMy]

Originally posted by yuzhonglu:

Get the free upgrade tech for skellies, and go all skelly armies.

With 1 Necromancer or Shadow mage.

Very cheap armies. And effective.

i went with that sterategy, turn 19 free skelies but depending on difficulty setting they become obsolete quick.

Free skellie armies is what everybody say but nobody talks about diffusion of magic where i pay 35% extra upkeep for only 6 stacks.

I need to have those stacks or my flanks will be open to constant raid and attacks from AI.

[yuzhonglu]

Then you're not bringing along necromancer or shadow mage. Or you're using them wrong.

It's not the skellies who are supposed to get lots of kills, you know.

[Sn3z]

CA did slow down the growth abit and yeah Vcounts cost for buildings is expensive. I haven't play Vcounts in ages I must try them again to see if there's any potential changes which couldbe made but tbh CA have their plate full atm with dwarfs/Bretonnia(the little nice tweak they did was good but you know we actually need a rework), I can't imagine them wanting to make changes to Vc.

What really put me off of them is the zero upkeep(this frankly shouldn't even be in the game its a trap on higher difficulty's, zombies can be free upkeep but just not skeletons) building the military buildings need more incentive I think they give ranks but its not enough.

[JiMMy]

Originally posted by yuzhonglu:

Then you're not bringing along necromancer or shadow mage. Or you're using them wrong.

It's not the skellies who are supposed to get lots of kills, you know.

I use all the good spells like wind of death, penumbral pendelum... etc but still i never said its impossible i just said its boring to fight long siege battle with ineffective troops and constantly cheese magic

[yojimbo1111]

Isabella vampire team is fun, but skele stacks do get boring

[yuzhonglu]

Oh. Well. Play some other faction then 'cuz the Counts are basically "kill them with magic and use skelletrash" faction.

[Xicsess]

The heroes in most vampire count armies are the real mvps. Terror breaks units quickly, and having some bats/hounds can make sure everything gets off the field. Skeletons suck, but all of the healing buffs from a necromancer help a ton (and summoning crappy zombies to back attack). Typically, I have two stacks, mostly skeletons with some fast units to push things off map. -50% upkeep heroes, free upkeep skels and push expansion as hard as possible until it becomes way too hard to win battles with skel stacks.

[JiMMy]

Originally posted by Sn3z:

Well just two things here CA did slow down the growth abit and yeah Vcounts cost for buildings is expensive. I haven't play Vcounts in ages I must try them again to see if there's any potential changes which couldbe made but tbh CA have their plate full atm with dwarfs/Bretonnia, I can't imagine them wanting to make changes.

What really put me off of them is the zero upkeep(this frankly shouldn't even be in the game its a trap on higher difficulty's, zombies can be free upkeep but just not skeletons) building the military buildings need more incentive I think they give ranks but its not enough.

VC are really slow in comparison to newer factions, even with Empire its really fast to get the economy going but with VC most good stuff unlocks at tier 5 and there is a clear lack of good tier 4 units.

Free skellies sound like such a big deal but on any difficulty higher than normal they are quickly outmatched by empire factions greatsword, halbardiers spam. They are only cannon fodder to slow down the enemy while you use magic. The great counter to empire greatswords are crain wraith but they are expensive in VC economy.

[JiMMy]

Originally posted by yojimbo1111:

Isabella vampire team is fun, but skele stacks do get boring

Yes exactly, its doable but sucks to always be undergunned. Woodelves in comparison can field way nicer archer spam armies that melt everything and does not need much macro.

[JiMMy]

Originally posted by yuzhonglu:

Oh. Well. Play some other faction then 'cuz the Counts are basically "kill them with magic and use skelletrash" faction.

Going to try the pirate factions, on otherside of the map next, got sick of empire preaching sigma