The Gelt campaign is absolutely insane

[Karl Power]

So I'd really like to play a Golden Order campaign. I really like Gelt and the bonuses he provides for his faction and his army.

But a Golden Order campaign runs like this for me (I've played three so far):

I defend Fort Soll and take the orc settlement to the south and west.

By around turn 10 there is war with the Vampires.

I destroy about one enemy stack every 2-3 turns. Nevertheless they just keep coming and coming.

I frantically haste from one end to the other of my three-region realm trying to fend off the neverending hordes of attackers.

Building-wise I prioritise growth, money, and a temple because of the massive Vampire and Skaven corruption. It takes an eternity to grow my 2- city starting province and build up. Whether I fund some other elector counts' battles and try to keep the empire together or whether I ignore the constant 2,000$ expensive expeditions: My economy is utterly crippled; Imperial authority goes down constantly no matter what I do and causes unrest and money loss.

By turn 30 the entire south of the Empire is Vampireland.
By turn 50 the Orcs arrive from the south, in my last playthrough with 4 full stacks with tier 2-3 units with armour/weapon buffs. Against which I could field Gelt and his army of starting units + archers + swordsmen. There is no chance I have of winning at that point.

I can handle superior numbers, and to a degree I can handle superior quality of enemies. But this campaign has you going against superior numbers AND superior quality enemies from turn 1.

I realize that some campaigns are designed to be more difficult but this is insane. So I have three questions:

1.
Have I had bad luck in the Vampires taking over the empire and the orcs coming straight at me with all their power, or is that the usual occurrence in Gelt campaigns?

2.
Which buildings and which units would you prioritize?

3.
What do you do to maintain imperial authority? Is it better to ignore the battle events or to pay the exorbitant prices?

[senate]

Dark Venom has the capitol not the dwarves.

[DaBo81]

The idea about using Fort Sol to milk battle income is a good one, but really tedious.
Some campaigns are much harder than others, Gelt's campaign is comparable to Skarsnik's or Belegar's IMO. His starting province just isn't as wealthy as Reikland, there's no Marienburg to grab either. Nuln is a good city to take though, plus it fits well with his LL skills.
I think I'll have another crack at the Gelt campaign. I expect it'll be harder than before as CA added in Drycha.

[senate]

Don't uncover Drycha and you shouldn't have a problem.

[JODEGAFUN]

DaBo81 eredeti hozzászólása:

The idea about using Fort Sol to milk battle income is a good one, but really tedious.
Some campaigns are much harder than others, Gelt's campaign is comparable to Skarsnik's or Belegar's IMO. His starting province just isn't as wealthy as Reikland, there's no Marienburg to grab either. Nuln is a good city to take though, plus it fits well with his LL skills.
I think I'll have another crack at the Gelt campaign. I expect it'll be harder than before as CA added in Drycha.

No Drycha makes it easier, she can struck the VC very hard.

[senate]

They're both at war with Ostermark right ? Drycha and VC ?

[JODEGAFUN]

senate eredeti hozzászólása:

They're both at war with Ostermark right ? Drycha and VC ?

Drycha is at war with Ostermark, Mannfred starts with NAP, Vlad neutral.

[Big Moustache]

I find Gelt start more difficult than Teclis start. But searing doom is cheap af and kills 100's each battle. Build a sorcerer first, recruit and demolish for a temple. You need extra magic for seering doom. I always end turn in ambush next to the settlement. Ai is dumb enough to keep falling for it. Rush Vlad first and Manfred is no more threat. If you take to long to eliminate Vlad, you get into a stalemate because others wardec and come play along.

[Skarath]

It's not difficult at all. You are spending too much time fighting the orcs over Karak Hirn. Be more aggressive, don't give them the time to build up.

In relation the the vampires, once they take Averheim, that's your cue to attack. By that point you will have Seering Doom costing 1 WoM. All sieges from that point onward are trivial with Gelt, just don't get caught out of position in an open field vs multiple vamp armies.

[Empukris]

It is the usual unfortunately, Gelt campaign is not easy. Your priority in Gelt campaign is to kill the vampire more than anything else. Whether it will become easy or very hard just depends on that point. If they overtake the whole empire than you will have much bigger problem. The issue is the greenskin will continuously attacking so you have two front playing him and you need to defeat the vamp with 1 stack only. He is not a skarsnik campaign still far easier. Skarsnik before the grom update is the hardest campaign mainly due to broken greenskin replenishment rate and totally inferior greenskin unit. Gelt is still far easier than that nightmare of a campaign.

I did not try Gelt yet after Drycha but I can imagine it to be much harder but your priority will not change, kill the vampire asap.

[franz]

guys git gut !

[Tricky]

For me the best I've done it recently is to rush from turn 1. Buy a second lord. Hire basic bows only.
Kill Orks in province then orks in mountains, then rush skaven in near elves.
Then Nuln province.

Dont take a turn without attacking or moving to attack something. Recruitment can be handled by other lord.

Abandon mountain province's if you cannot stop from revolting, or just raise from the beginning and hope the Dwarfs ruin dwell. Nuln province is your money.

It shouldn't take to long to do the above then turn with an army and a half on vamps. Can get artillery from Nuln province quite early. Just build and carry to your army's.

If to many empire get taken out early its going to be a massive problem. So rush rush rush, and be lucky.

[Tricky]

Oh and I've been finding that Boris the Tod is now quite quite likely to go to war with KARL Franz, and mess things up. So rushing the Empire confed is advised as quickly as possible also.

[Sgt. Barnes]

Just make any artillery and magic, this should be enough on any difficulty as empire factions, dwarfs and pirates, plus some other. Other units should defend artillery, therefore cavalry usually is a bad choice and no need to waste cash on them. however pistol and rifle cavalry are possible to use. Mostly cheap infantry with shields+halbediers (they are very good at defence). Its really important to have also captains for tanking and taking hits. I played vh difficulty when update on empire was released, before changes allowed to spend excess of prestige. In 60 turns got a lot of lands an powerful armies without ANY problem. When i first made rocket artillery (turn 40 maybe dont remember) campaign became too easy and boring. Overall you need to kill vampires, using fort as defence and later defeat Kislev and another factions possibly those who attack you. When it is possible, organize expedition south of fort to get Tilea, Estalia and later desert territories. By that time it is good to have rockets for sure, to wipe out stacks with no problem. Vampires are basically nothing as AI, they cant even effectively reach artillery. Only lizardmen can pose some threat maybe. Or strong scaven armies in numbers.

[DaBo81]

So I was having a bit of a go on the Gelt campaign again and it reminded me how frustrating the Empire campaigns are. Being tasked to protect all the other shires but the ingrates won't even sign trade agreements or NAPs, let alone give military access. Getting scenario battles that spawn another army (messing with your income) and tasking you to fight an unfavourable battle. Losing imperial authority every time a derpy AI count gets killed off. For all Skarsnik's problems, he doesn't have to deal with all that BS.
The tipping point for me, where I lost interest in the campaign, was when Karl Franz declared independence from the Empire (on 4 loyalty) - it's such a stupid campaign TBH. You're surrounded by other Empire factions and dwarves, but they're all pricks.
Then there's the map, lots of mountains and rivers to block movement, but orcs can just tunnel in.
I could press on with the campaign as I have several cities, but the prospect of fighting Franz as an imperial faction just kills the lore for me. I thought loyalty needed to hit 3 or less for possible secession but none of it is explained clearly. Does anyone know what the chances for secession are at different loyalty levels?

[JODEGAFUN]

DaBo81 eredeti hozzászólása:

So I was having a bit of a go on the Gelt campaign again and it reminded me how frustrating the Empire campaigns are. Being tasked to protect all the other shires but the ingrates won't even sign trade agreements or NAPs, let alone give military access. Getting scenario battles that spawn another army (messing with your income) and tasking you to fight an unfavourable battle. Losing imperial authority every time a derpy AI count gets killed off. For all Skarsnik's problems, he doesn't have to deal with all that BS.
The tipping point for me, where I lost interest in the campaign, was when Karl Franz declared independence from the Empire (on 4 loyalty) - it's such a stupid campaign TBH. You're surrounded by other Empire factions and dwarves, but they're all pricks.
Then there's the map, lots of mountains and rivers to block movement, but orcs can just tunnel in.
I could press on with the campaign as I have several cities, but the prospect of fighting Franz as an imperial faction just kills the lore for me. I thought loyalty needed to hit 3 or less for possible secession but none of it is explained clearly. Does anyone know what the chances for secession are at different loyalty levels?

If Karl drops under 4 something went really wrong. After killing the orcs and the Skaven i just raid Wissenland so they drop to 1 and revolt, you take them and bump your prestige after that to make Karl like you. Gets him to 7 fast. And always side with Reikland in any case, all the other Electors does not matter. And refuse to help Wissenland, those guys shall revolt, otherwise those fcs do it when your army is somewhere else.