Mount or on-foot?

[Groppeta]

400 hours and since the beggining i wanted to ask this, are mounts good in all cases? i can relate there are good and bad things, mounts decreases your melee skills, they mare you more vulnetrable to antilarge units and to range units.

Lets put an example, is Archeon better in mounts or on foot? i know that mounts gives you way more hp and DPS, but they lower your armour, leadership and melee skills.

Thanks

[zacharyb]

It depends on the Lord and how you use them, and whether you're fighting a siege battle. If you don't rely on the Lord for killing stuff and use them mostly for spells or their leadership aura then a mount is a good idea. Also depending on what your Lord is going to be fighting it may be useful to put them on mounts so they can't get knocked around.

I personally prefer Archaon on foot.

[Groppeta]

Thanks for answering, im doing chaos campaing and i love lords that fight with his men in the frontline (like grimgor or archeon and many more) but i feel that giving them a mount will make them more vulnerable

Originally posted by zacharyb:

It depends on the Lord and how you use them, and whether you're fighting a siege battle. If you don't rely on the Lord for killing stuff and use them mostly for spells or their leadership aura then a mount is a good idea. Also depending on what your Lord is going to be fighting it may be useful to put them on mounts so they can't get knocked around.

I personally prefer Archaon on foot.

[Ulthwé]

I hate giving horses or charriots, I feel like it makes heroes too vulnerable. I most puts mounts for mages who don't fight or for generals or heroes who got great mounts like necrosphinx, dragons or flying mounts!

[big stupid jellyfish]

Monstrous mounts such as griffons or dragons are pretty much always worth it. You tend to get more HP, AP damage and bigger splash attacks in return for a bigger hitbox and a bit less melee defense.
Horses are a bit of a mixed bag. They are good for casters who need to avoid combat or for characters like Tyrion who have such high stats that losing a bit of melee defense doesn't really hurt them and it allows them to chase down their targes quicker.

Using mounts will also prevent your characters from being knocked down. This generally means that they will take a bit more damage as units become immune to damage when they are lying on the ground, but they also won't be interrupted if they get hit by something big while they are casting spells or using an ability.

Originally posted by zacharyb:

It depends on the Lord and how you use them, and whether you're fighting a siege battle.

Why would you ever climb the walls with your lord? A melee lord can knock down the gates super quickly and he won't get exhausted like he would scaling the walls.

[zacharyb]

Originally posted by big stupid jellyfish:

Monstrous mounts such as griffons or dragons are pretty much always worth it. You tend to get more HP, AP damage and bigger splash attacks in return for a bigger hitbox and a bit less melee defense.
Horses are a bit of a mixed bag. They are good for casters who need to avoid combat or for characters like Tyrion who have such high stats that losing a bit of melee defense doesn't really hurt them and it allows them to chase down their targes quicker.

Using mounts will also prevent your characters from being knocked down. This generally means that they will take a bit more damage as units become immune to damage when they are lying on the ground, but they also won't be interrupted if they get hit by something big while they are casting spells or using an ability.

Originally posted by zacharyb:

It depends on the Lord and how you use them, and whether you're fighting a siege battle.

Why would you ever climb the walls with your lord? A melee lord can knock down the gates super quickly and he won't get exhausted like he would scaling the walls.

There are many reasons why you would make your Lord climb a wall, a lot of those reasons may be cheesy though.

For non cheese reasons there may be a Lord/Hero causing you problems that are up on the walls and you can't destroy said walls or you don't have the Artillery/Warp Grinders to do it. I try to take out certain Caster Lords/Heroes as fast as I can because some of them can do some real damage.

Sending a Lord to help take the walls can sometimes be very helpful, and don't forget Lords/Heroes can use Siege Towers to get on walls. Also while defending having a Lord helping the wall defense can be useful. Plus during sieges the AI tends to put their Lords on walls so sending your Lord after them makes sense.

There are also Lords that have AOE abilities that may knock the enemy off the walls which can be very useful for taking down stronger units. Those are just a few reasons why you would want to get a Lord on the wall.

[rovers14]

Originally posted by Groppeta:

400 hours and since the beggining i wanted to ask this, are mounts good in all cases? i can relate there are good and bad things, mounts decreases your melee skills, they mare you more vulnetrable to antilarge units and to range units.

Lets put an example, is Archeon better in mounts or on foot? i know that mounts gives you way more hp and DPS, but they lower your armour, leadership and melee skills.

Thanks

To simplify things, in open field it is almost always better to have a mount. In siege battles, flying mounts are extremely good but anything ground based is more of a detriment than a bonus. You want to be able to get them on the walls to fight tough enemies and most of the time there's not enough space inside a settlement to make use of the added speed. This is why flying mounts are amazing, because they can go straight over the walls and land on top of them to get rid of dangerous units super early.

In open field, you want a lord that is able to be moved wherever you need him the most, and you need them to get there quickly. The value in this is much greater than the extra damage you will take from anti large units or archers, especially if you have a healer. There's also the added benefit of a higher mass. Higher mass units are much easier to pull out of combat when needed, and they will not get repeatedly knocked down by larger units. Lords on chariots are actually amazing, especially tomb king chariots. They are extremely easy to pull out of combat and can rack up huge numbers of kills simply by charging into blobs of enemies over and over again, aka cycle charging. This will turn a caster lord into a melee beast as long as you don't leave him in combat, you gotta pull him out and get ready for another charge ASAP!

[Xaphnir]

Originally posted by big stupid jellyfish:

Horses are a bit of a mixed bag. They are good for casters who need to avoid combat or for characters like Tyrion who have such high stats that losing a bit of melee defense doesn't really hurt them and it allows them to chase down their targes quicker.

Lords and heroes usually don't even lose stats when you put them on a horse.

I find it almost always beneficial to put lords of heroes on a mount if you can. Even if their best mount is a horse, the increased mobility is incredibly valuable, far more valuable than any drawbacks.

[chronobomb]

For any spell caster Lords, mounts are important. Being able to kite the enemy with spells before the battle can win many matches before first contact is made.

For Flying mounts, there is almost no downside unless you have only one flyer and are taking on a flyer heavy faction. They will goon your lord and you will spend the entire match running from them. Otherwise you get to choose every engagement your Lord is in.

While playing VCounts, you never have to worry about Vlad getting goon'd while Isabella and her vamps can get surrounded and killed on their mounts. Off their mounts, Vampires are very hard to kill.

So it depends on your play style, and where you want to focus your micro. I wish the game had a dismount option like Shogun 2.

[Groppeta]

Well thanks for the tips guys, i just got a battle with my chaos army, 1/4 chosen units 1/4 chaos warriors and then chaos knights, 1 of the monstruos charriots and 2 hellcannons. I was vs 2 full empire armies and they got really good units but thanks to my chariot, chaos knights and exalted hero on a FLYING mount i won the battle (well obviously the chosen units are super tanky) i have archeon on foot with the chosen and the exalted hero flying all arround the battlefield taking their arty first and then the ranged units with bows and guns. So yes, it can depend as you guys says, archeon on foot was inmortal and got 300 kills melee/firespells but the hero on the manticore got the same or more kills and was the key of the victory because otherwise the arty and guns would destroy my frontline. So ill get mixed mounts and on foot. TY

[RCMidas]

It really depends on what the mount is.

Equines are decidedly mediocre, but then, what do you expect in this universe? Useful only for Heroes who get nothing better and who need to be mobile in fights. Sticking Tyrion on his horse makes him a worse duellist in terms of pure mechanics. Sticking Archaon on his horse makes him a more lethal spellcaster, and doesn't really hurt his combat prowess.

Unicorns (such as for the Fay Enchantress) and stags (which I believe the Wood Elves get) count as equines in this scenario. Cold/Horned Ones for Dark Elves and Lizardmen are tougher but slower equines in this scenario.

Chariots are micro-intensive but a significant step up in quality if you are good at micro. Always go for chariots with the Tomb Kings. You want your Heroes to be as mobile as possible for either Liche Priest spellcasting, construct bonuses from Necrotects, or just to make your Tomb Princes more effective in general.

Corpse Carts fill a similar but super-slow and super-melee-vulnerable niche for Vampire Counts Necromancers. You'd almost be better off just leaving them unmounted at all times. At least that way you are less of a ranged target and can escape melee more easily through masses of zombie fodder.

Terradons for Skink Heroes are interesting, being fragile and super-mobile. Probably not worth it on the Skink Chiefs, but pretty good for the Priests. Pegasi and Hellsteeds are similarly mobile and fragile for those races who get them.

Flying monstrous beasts such as griffons, manticores, and dragons are varying levels of powerful and terrifying. Griffons/hippogryphs are absolutely worth it for the Empire/Bretonnia, Manticores are similarly good for Chaos Heroes, and dragons are ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ dragons! Why aren't you picking them? Just be careful about enemy ranged, especially armour-piercing gunners or cannons.

Terrestrial monstrous beasts like stegadons, carnosaurs, prometheans, etc are basically the land-equivalent of dragons. They tend to be much slower, but extremely powerful and durable. Still vulnerable to armour-piercing and anti-large ranged though.

[chronobomb]

At a glance the necromancer Corpse Cart might seem like a bad idea but it is actually very powerful for your tar pit units. It allows the Necromancer's to generate a +6 HP/sec regen on the Balefire cart which allows even more healing as well as make them have better stats to last longer. Not great for elite units but for Skelly armies it can make them last a long time.

This is additive for your units that already have regen.