Lore question - Ulthuan underground

[Machine Spirit]

Back when TW2 was released a lot of players questioned why the Skaven and Beastmen couldn't use their respective traversal stances to get into Ulthuan and the people who know the lore said it was because Ulthuan is a floating island, so it doesn't have an underground and therefore there are no beast paths or underways.

If that is the case, how am I able to make under empires in Ulthuan? Is this an oversight on the devs part and we shouldn't be able to establish under empires or is there another reason as to why Beastman, Skaven (and possibly wood elves and dwarves, I've never tested it) cant use their traversal stances inside Ulthuan?

[Dr_Kira]

You can because it's a game and needs balance first. And the stances of underground and all that jazz would make all the elven gate useless, it fits the lore but more importantly it's balanced to not be able to use it.

[Machine Spirit]

Originally posted by Kayami Kira:

You can because it's a game and needs balance first. And the stances of underground and all that jazz would make all the elven gate useless, it fits the lore but more importantly it's balanced to not be able to use it.

My under empires make the gates useless, I've already levelled several settlements inside Ulthuan using Doomspheres.

[Dr_Kira]

Originally posted by Machine Spirit:

Originally posted by Kayami Kira:

You can because it's a game and needs balance first. And the stances of underground and all that jazz would make all the elven gate useless, it fits the lore but more importantly it's balanced to not be able to use it.

My under empires make the gates useless, I've already levelled several settlements inside Ulthuan using Doomspheres.

your underempire takes time and money to invest and might be nerfed who knows, a whole army going thru tho ? no cost just benefits and you dodge the massive garrissons.

[Machine Spirit]

I think it maybe an oversight on the devs part. I like how the skaven cant tunnel around inside Ulthuan when I am playing as High Elves, but whatever is stopping them in the lore seems to be at odds with the Skaven being able to extend the under empire inside Ulthuan.

[Dr_Kira]

Originally posted by Machine Spirit:

I think it maybe an oversight on the devs part. I like how the skaven cant tunnel around inside Ulthuan when I am playing as High Elves, but whatever is stopping them in the lore seems to be at odds with the Skaven being able to extend the under empire inside Ulthuan.

I doubt it's an oversight it's a bit too big... I mean they thought of making all the "teleport" paths not work but not undercity ? I very much doubt it. I mean you might be right tho I've got no way to know either but it jsut seems like a gameplay thing to me, losing a moving stance is not that bad but losing a whole part of your race mechanic like undercity is a bigger deal.

[Deeyourelf]

My Korean headcanon is that the Old Ones built Ulthuan using chunks of the bottom of the ocean that they raised up, which took out a chunk of the bottom of the underempire and left caverns and pockets that the skaven can burrow into if they make it to Ulthuan

[Calculus]

Ok... skaven can create undercities in galleon's graveyard... so i would say that is just an oversight because nothing has skaven undercity immunity.

[Darklordnj]

GW’s opinion on the matter is that if Skaven could make it to Ulthuan somehow, they can make an undercity. Other than that it’s a game.

[KoboldUtopian]

I think the lore is that the underway travel uses old tunnels built by dwarfs etc long ago. They are extensive throughout the old world and new, but never build in Ulthuan.

[Gorwe]

Originally posted by CoerciveUtopian:

I think the lore is that the underway travel uses old tunnels built by dwarfs etc long ago. They are extensive throughout the old world and new, but never build in Ulthuan.

Don't think this is necessarily true. What you are talking about are the Deep Warrens etc, not necessarily Undercities. But yeah, Skaven(and Dwarfs and Greenskins) shouldn't be able to use their Tunnel Stance where there is no Underway.

[Anvos]

Undercities make sense, especially in the northern blasted lands where nature's power would be weak, the skaven's problem building one would always be the actually getting that foothold in the first place. Mind you the only lore way I'd see this happening (without an End Times type scenario) would be the skaven being intentionally helped set up by the Druchii during an invasion, so when that one fails the skaven can get to work preparing to undermine the coastal defenses for the next invasion.

Underways not working make sense, as you either need time to tunnel them or a preexisting dawi road network.

Beast Paths not working pretty much falls into the elves have been the masters of Ulthuan for long enough there really isn't truly primal forests left on the island, much like without End Times the Empire would eventually clear cut so many forests to feed their growing industry that Beastmen would naturally be driven back.