Upkeep increases for each lord is insane(ly bad)!!!!

[Snoff]

I am playing on legendary as Lizardmen (Krog-Gar), currently turn 146. It is fun and all, but the increase in upkeep for every army I got is just insane. On legendary it increases by 15% for each lord past your first. That is not fun, and credits bad and boring strategies. Best bet is to always have full 20-stacks, instead of spreading your army up a little. With four armies it's an 45% increases, and just going from 3 (2 full stacks to 1 half stack) is a tremendous burden.

The problem with this is, as said, it promotes constant full stacks. It is less strategy and less fun. In Total War Warhammer 1, I recall playing dwarf, and finding it fun to split up my armies to fend off attacking orcs from several angels. You didn't always go for that full stack, but instead maybe went for something between 7 and 16 stack armies, When♥♥♥♥♥♥hit the fan, like Grimgor, you tried to stack em up again before battle (that is how I did legendary up till you confronted chaos). It is way more rewarding having to split up armies to fight off the attacker who strikes at several fronts, but in this game, it is not the best strategy. Instead it is all 20 stacks armies, as the cost increase for each army past your first is just insane.

If the developers want less armies on legendaries, simply reduce the increase upkeep cost for each army, but maybe increase it even more for each units. The level of penalty is too much, and makes the game less tactical, and promotes big blobs and nothing else, wich seems conterintuitive to tactical gameplay.

If any developers listen, please consider changing this.

[Sumbi]

15% Upkeep is too much for this big map. I agree with you.

[HeLLfire]

Constant full stacks? That's the normal way. Atleast the way i play on normal.
It's close to impossible to take a capital with a good garrison, and\or lord garrisoned in it if not. And the AI almost always field full stacks even on normal, unless he's lost some on the way to where he's going and can't reinforce.

Legendary difficulty to me, is for those guys who's either masochistic or just a tactical and strategical genius. it's supposed to be hard and painful. :P

[Snoff]

HeLLfire původně napsal:

Constant full stacks? That's the normal way. Atleast the way i play on normal.
It's close to impossible to take a capital with a good garrison, and\or lord garrisoned in it if not. And the AI almost always field full stacks even on normal, unless he's lost some on the way to where he's going and can't reinforce.

Legendary difficulty to me, is for those guys who's either masochistic or just a tactical and strategical genius. it's supposed to be hard and painful. :P

Yeah you need that 20 stack for taking capital garrisons, but in between there is rebelions, which you can't truly eliminate in legendary (it takes lots of turns to get a region up and going). When defending, walls plus a small stack army is often enough to fend off any invader. This is heavily penelized on legendary. Against skaven early on, at least as Lizardmen, you don't need 20 stack armies to defeat their expendable armies.

Yes legendary is supposed to be hard, and it truly is, but not fub in the way it's currently implemented. I am ok with all the bonuses the enemy gets, but being forced to go for big blobs instead of splitting up your forces seems counter to tactical playing.

[HeLLfire]

The problem is that the difficulty is related to modifers (gold\diplo\upkeep\order\stats) and not much to actual AI getting "better" in actual tactical or strategical combat, except for having those bonuses as well as more units and better\expensive units.

[Qinshi]

Snoff původně napsal:

I am playing on legendary as Lizardmen (Krog-Gar), currently turn 146. It is fun and all, but the increase in upkeep for every army I got is just insane. On legendary it increases by 15% for each lord past your first. That is not fun, and credits bad and boring strategies. Best bet is to always have full 20-stacks, instead of spreading your army up a little. With four armies it's an 45% increases, an just going from 3 (2 full stacks to 1 half stack) is a tremendous burden.

You are complaining because legendary is 'to legendary'.
If you cant handle it, go play on very hard.
The game was meant to be played on Normal. Not on legendary.

[Snoff]

HeLLfire původně napsal:

The problem is that the difficulty is related to modifers (gold\diplo\upkeep\order\stats) and not much to actual AI getting "better" in actual tactical or strategical combat, except for having those bonuses as well as more units and better\expensive units.

I know that the AI doesn't get better. Instead the public order is way worse for you, while way less for AI, they get less upkeep in addition to loads of bonuses I don't know. I am OK with that, as making a proper AI is next to impossible, not to mention the cost. Thus they have to use these methods.

All this is fine, but I don't want to be this heavily penalized for having several armies. They could instead increase the upkeep even more for each unit if they fear to many armies. There are ways to make it more difficult without dumbing it down, as it is done with the crazy amount of upkeep cost for each army past your first.

[Qinshi]

The best way to do it:
Play on normal and use MODS that increase the aggressiveness & income for the AI faction.
Without the penalties for your own factions.

[Red Bat]

You can take most minor settlements with around 8 troops depending on your lineup. There are a few rare occasions when you can do it with about 2 units.

The actual province capitals need more, but you don't always need full stack armies unless you are relying on low tier Skaven troops.