Better to confederate other High Elfs, or keep them as trade partners?

[Coldhands]

Outside of a couple HE factions who have massive aversion to Tyrion's faction (F those guys) would you say a HE player is better off trying to trade with the rest of Ulthwan, or conquer most/all of it?

[gachi is manly]

As Teclis I kept Tyrion as my trade partner all game. He was giving me 1.5-2k gold per turn in income and I didn't really want to bother with Ulthuan anyways.

[Pink]

I think we are better off keeping them as trade partners for 2 main reasons:
- Lots of free cash with low maintenance (you might need from time to time to help them solve a conflict so that you don't loose that trade partner)
- It helps you keep your lands concentraded and makes it easier to defend when you do a ritual.


I get about 2000 - 4500 per turn per HE faction that I trade with right now.

My biggest error on my current HE campaign was to expand south... and to confederate with a few nations streching my forces all over the place.

[Macros]

There's one exception, though: I feel like you should probably confederate with Tor Elasor if you get the occasion.

It starting position is three islands, each with a port (good money), with the elven colony bonus (even more money) and two tradable resources (all of the money!). Since it's in the middle of nowhere, you don't even have to defend it - unless you're at war with the Last Defenders, who might cross the sea to get you.

[Coldhands]

^That's one of the southern HE factions, right? I'm thinking I'll end up confederating with one of them so I can strike at the skaven more easily, and set back their rituals.

[AsianBackFrip]

I confederated with everyone except Tirinoc. I view it as: more access to tradeable materials = more money trading with everyone else

[Pink]

Yes, I forgot about those guys. Get them! They are a gold mine. And even if one of those cities end up being a ritual site, they are easily defendable (as long as you place walls there)

[Pink]

Oprindeligt skrevet af AsianBackFrip:

I confederated with everyone except Tirinoc. I view it as: more access to tradeable materials = more money trading with everyone else

Except that if you rely on trade with other Lizardmen factions, later on you will loose all your trade partners. While the High Elfs will stick with you.

If you want the trade resources, you are probably better off conquering those cities from someone else and then trade with the Elfs.

[AsianBackFrip]

I kept trade with Amon, Loremasters, some humany looking nation to the south and some other ones that managed to keep all the exports at 100% no lizardmen, though I see what you mean. Things could have gone differently

[TaurusBully]

If you wanna beat the Vortex race you should confederate.


If not, keep most as training partners.

[Darkaiser]

Oprindeligt skrevet af TaurusBully:

If you wanna beat the Vortex race you should confederate.


If not, keep most as training partners.

This pretty much sums up my philosophy as well. As the Skaven and the DE, I always prefer to have one enemy I can Raid. As the HE, I want to keep all the money at home. I may trade with other Player races for the first 2-3 Vortex Rituals but after that I shift my econ to get ready for those partners going away.

Sadly, I didn't do this on my first playthrough and my econ crashed before the end. Live and learn.

[Froz7y]

With high elves i use a lot of diplomacy.

With rat men, i just spread Skaven taint.

Same as for Dark Elves, spread Chaos Corruption.

For Lizard men. Just brute force!!

[LuNi]

You get so much from trading that I would keep them as trade partners.

[LuNi]

Oprindeligt skrevet af Macros:

There's one exception, though: I feel like you should probably confederate with Tor Elasor if you get the occasion.

It starting position is three islands, each with a port (good money), with the elven colony bonus (even more money) and two tradable resources (all of the money!). Since it's in the middle of nowhere, you don't even have to defend it - unless you're at war with the Last Defenders, who might cross the sea to get you.

Build Elven embasy for even more money from ports. That region is extremely lucrative for elves.

[Aenarion]

- do you need an army to defend them? If the answer is yes, run a mile, upkeep will cost you much more than you gain
- are they actively fighting your enemies? Again, if the answer is yes, it's probably best to leave them in place and let the AI's cheats work for yiu for a change.
- do you make as much or more from trade with them than their economy is worth? (Check using the relevant tabs, don't just guess!) Again, yes means don't touch - better to have the no-strings-attached income.

Only if you answer no to all questions should you confed.

If I look at Tor Elasor, for instance, they have a nice economy, 4k gold under AI management and probably I could get it to 5-6k if I took it on. Nice deal, right?

Nope, I'd lose 2k per turn from trade AND 8k per turn or more upkeep for an army to defend it. And I'll need an army to defend it at least in the late game as i think last defenders are hard coded to be at war with you after the 4th ritual, and before that you have skaven and even the wood elves in that general area that are a pretty big threat on very hard or legendary. So confederation just doesn't add up.

[Pink]

After 4th ritual all main factions seem to hard coded to be at war, except your other half. Which is why I say that I rather keep the HE as trade partners since in late game we will be short on them if we confederate.

I can still trade with minor lizardmen, humans and dwarfs. But during late game that is it and that alone doesnt give that much money. Certainly not as much as I get from my Elf friends. Plus you risk losing the lizard trade if the mains confed with all the minor factions.

And I would say that if you want to win the Vortex race, you don't need to confederate and you should avoid expanding to much, or risk being over exposed to the incoming hordes and random intervention armies plus the necessary upkeep to deploy armies everywhere.