Dragon Element vs Elder Seal

[Tessa]

Getting into the elder dragons now and noticing a trend among dragon weapons. High dragon elemental weapons tend to have low elder seal while low dragon element weapons have high elder seal.

Which would be better to focus on? Does the higher elder seal make fights easier so its worth the damage trade off?

[Seamus]

Elder Seal is pretty unreliable. Go for whatever gives you the best damage.

[Lack of Stuff]

Dragon element is sub-optimal on Elder Dragons. So you are either using a high dragon elemental weapon on the Raths / behemoth and Elderseal is worthless or you are running high raw and elderseal for EDs and ignoring the Dragon element.

[Xilo The Odd]

it also depends on the weapon a bit. elder seal is kinda like blast from my understanding, you slowly build it up on the target and eventually get a free flinch + elder mantle downgrade.

though the mantle downgrade can sometimes last all of 5 seconds when they turn around and flex their magic at you again.

that said if your focusing for dragon damage, the seal level isnt relevant, most elders arent that weak to dragon and the ones that are, typically your using other weapons to fight them that arent as element focused. (like Zorah)

that said, down the line we might see more elders that are weak to dragon, the best bet would likely be a Vaal weapon with average seal and average dragon element, and then buffing the elder seal to high if you want to focus a dragon element + high seal set. but thats purely dependent on what we get in iceborne.

who knows? we may get fatalis and maybe elder seal will work on em. theres also alatreon.
i forget what oroshi kirin was weak to, mighta been thunder or dragon its been ages since i've dealt with him.

[Ficelle]

Elderseal helps to keep the monster special in check, but it doesnt remove it totally
It helps and is noticeable

At the same time, killing the monster faster will also achieve the same goal, less special attacks


It all depends on how fast you can do it

If it is a struggle, 20+ minutes, probably go high elderseal to help
If you are fast, 10- minutes, go with the higher kill speed weapon, even without elderseal


Anyway, Nerg weapons are pretty much always good to make
They are all good, easy to make and come with high raw and high elderseal
Rarelly the best of the best, but cheap and effective against pretty much everything from the get go, even dragon immune mobs du to their high raw

[jrubz]

elder seal is really only viable on Val Hazaak, if your weapon hits enough times, it keeps him flinch locked and keeps his gas to a minimum if it keeps procing. But dragon damage on him is actually locked. For some odd reason they decided to give him 0 dragon vulnerability on most of his weakest parts until they break. After the break happens though, it barely beats fire in terms of damage.
Best case for val is to have 1 with a jho elderseal weapon (meaning the dragon is just bonus damage later while all of the raw gets the job done) and 3 other fire weapons for damage (provided they work the best for their class).

[Holografix]

what's flinch locked?

[Venusgate]

Only time I consider building dragon element is the Rathian family and deviljho.

Elder seal is kind of rarely noticeable alone, but if you have two hunters with high seal, you can basically cancel out the elder ability as long as you're both hitting fairly often. Quite nice against Vaal, Kushala, and Teo/Luna. Harder to tell with Kirin. Worthless against Nerg.

[tehRein]

Originally posted by Xilo The Odd:

it also depends on the weapon a bit. elder seal is kinda like blast from my understanding, you slowly build it up on the target and eventually get a free flinch + elder mantle downgrade.

though the mantle downgrade can sometimes last all of 5 seconds when they turn around and flex their magic at you again.

that said if your focusing for dragon damage, the seal level isnt relevant, most elders arent that weak to dragon and the ones that are, typically your using other weapons to fight them that arent as element focused. (like Zorah)

that said, down the line we might see more elders that are weak to dragon, the best bet would likely be a Vaal weapon with average seal and average dragon element, and then buffing the elder seal to high if you want to focus a dragon element + high seal set. but thats purely dependent on what we get in iceborne.

who knows? we may get fatalis and maybe elder seal will work on em. theres also alatreon.
i forget what oroshi kirin was weak to, mighta been thunder or dragon its been ages since i've dealt with him.

elderseal is like exhaust actually
every elder dragon has an aura bar and when you hit them with weapon that has elderseal you slowly drain their auras and when it value drops to 0 you pop the aura away
there is only one weapon that doesn't deal dragon dmg and has elderseal and it's power smasher 2
I've tested it with smart overlay and it seems that "DRAGON" phials doesn't deal dragon dmg nor visable/hidden BUT it dragon phial value apply on elderseal and makes it work like ailment

[tehRein]

Originally posted by terra-the-gamer:

Which would be better to focus on? Does the higher elder seal make fights easier so its worth the damage trade off?

https://steamcommunity.com/app/582010/discussions/0/1734342161868893659/?l=polish

[♋Phenex]

Unless you're using a ranged weapon, deviljho weapons are typically the best dragon element melee weapons which also come with high elder seal so you literally just build deviljho weapons for whatever weapon you use the most if you need a dragon weapon.

Otherwise you ignore elder seal completely and use a high raw weapon or element that the monster is weakest too.

[Charcharodonto]

Originally posted by Holografix:

what's flinch locked?

Flinching happens if you deal enough damage vs a monster part. Against the legs the monster will usually trip. Against wings, tails, body the monster will flinch, interrupting it's attack and making it stand still for a moment.

Flinch locking is alternating this damage vs various parts, to keep the monster in one place and preventing it from attacking.