How does elements & weakness work?

[Aeternull]

Hi all,
Moon questions here that are confusing me that I'd appreciate if someone can clear them up:

1) How is element damage calculated into the normal attack damage?
Example: attack 300 fire 200. Does this mean the weapon deals 200 fire damage out of the 300 and leaving only 100 as normal damage?
OR 300 normal + 200 fire (total 500 in the end) damage?
Or maybe it doesn't work like that and I hope someone can help me with this.

2) what's better, let's say a monster has 1 star as weakness against fire l. What would be better, a fire weapon or a non elemental weapon?

3) what does alignment mean under the monster weakness? Does it mean that those effects can be applied to this monster at the rate of the stars? (more stars = more likely to get effected)

That's all. Thanks in advance for reading and hopefully answering!

[Timbermaw]

1- it's 300 + 200
2- 1 star is not really a weakness. 2 star is like normal damage, only 3 star is weakness. For 1 star a non elemental weapon would be better if you don't have the 3 star element
3- Yes, more stars on status elements means the monster will be affected easier

[Callyste]

Originally posted by Timbermaw:

1- it's 300 + 200

Wow, no. It's way more complex than that.

Without going into detail:
1) Elemental damage value is bloated by a factor of 10 (so if you read 200, it's actually 20)
2) Elemental damage is flat, per hit, while raw is scaled depending on the move's "weight". Which is why (usually) fast-hitting weapons such as the Dual Blades or the SnS are better suited to elemental.

Edit: as for elemental weaknesses, the stars are an indication, but there's some actual values out there - Kiranico should have some of them.

[Timbermaw]

Originally posted by Callyste:

Originally posted by Timbermaw:

1- it's 300 + 200

Wow, no. It's way more complex than that.

Without going into detail:
1) Elemental damage value is bloated by a factor of 10 (so if you read 200, it's actually 20)
2) Elemental damage is flat, per hit, while raw is scaled depending on the move's "weight". Which is why (usually) fast-hitting weapons such as the Dual Blades or the SnS are better suited to elemental.

Edit: as for elemental weaknesses, the stars are an indication, but there's some actual values out there - Kiranico should have some of them.

You're right i oversimplified

[Callyste]

Originally posted by Timbermaw:

Originally posted by Callyste:

Wow, no. It's way more complex than that.

Without going into detail:
1) Elemental damage value is bloated by a factor of 10 (so if you read 200, it's actually 20)
2) Elemental damage is flat, per hit, while raw is scaled depending on the move's "weight". Which is why (usually) fast-hitting weapons such as the Dual Blades or the SnS are better suited to elemental.

Edit: as for elemental weaknesses, the stars are an indication, but there's some actual values out there - Kiranico should have some of them.

You're right i oversimplified

And even I have oversimplified, too :p
The damage calculation in Monster Hunter games is just so confusing.

[Voodoo]

Values shown on weapons are bloat values.
Elemental bloat value is always 10, so you get only 1/10th true element.
bloat values for weapons
Great Sword 4.8
Gunlance 2.3
Long Sword 3.3
Switch Axe 3.5
Sword & Shield 1.4
Charge Blade 3.6
Dual Blades 1.4
Insect Glaive 3.1
Hammer 5.2
Light Bowgun 1.3
Hunting Horn 4.2
Heavy Bowgun 1.5
Lance 2.3
Bow 1.2

so for example
240 raw 200 ice bow will only have 200 true raw and 20 true ice

Then to calculate damage of attack you need to know its motion value and these are listed on kiranico like the example here
https://mhworld.kiranico.com/guide/hammer
values shown are in %

then finally you need to look at what youre hitting and again kiranico is your friend
https://mhworld.kiranico.com/monster/vaal-hazak
again values shown in % for every damage type

Finally sharpness multipliers
https://mhworld.kiranico.com/guide/damage#sharpness

Raw damage is true raw x motion value x hitzone x sharpness multiplier
elemental damage is true element x hitzone x sharpness multiplier and sometimes elemental multiplier

elemental multiplier is generally a penatly to some multihit or very weak attacks like lvl1 quick shot from bow or double slash from duals, besides those elements arent affected by motion values.

[Callyste]

Originally posted by Voodoo:

lots of accurate stuff

Ah yes, motion value. That's the correct word I was looking for when I said "weight" :p

[Haga]

Originally posted by Callyste:

The damage calculation in Monster Hunter games is just so confusing.

There's no monster hunter series that have simple damage calculation. (except maybe monhunt stories is more simple because it is an jrpg)

Example of the formula used in Monster Hunter Freedom Unite (MHFU)

[Attack Power x attack move used x CRITICAL or Not x Weapon Sharpness x Enemy HIT ZONE x Enemy Defense depend on low rank or high rank x Enemy under RAGE or not x Weapon Class Variable]/[Weapon Class]=Total Raw damage

[Weapon Element x Element Sharpness Multiplier x Enemy Element hit zone x Enemy Defense depend on low rank or high rank x RAGE or not x Weapon Class Variable] / [10] = Total Element Damage

Total damage = Total Raw + total Element damage

2) non elemental, or we called it raw damage weapon will give you better damage. just use weapon with the highest star in weakness.
Use raw or elemental is depend which one you like.

3) yes. Each time you attack using weapon with debuff stat (poison, paralize, blast) there's a chance you deal debuff damage (unlike elemental which you have 100% chance to deal elemental damage). It will add up and when it past enemy debuff point, it will be debuffed.
If you leave it, the add up debuff will slowly goes down. When enemy healed from debuff, the enemy debuff point will raise, which make more difficult to be debuff again.
Btw it doesn't matter where you hit, the debuff damage will be the same, so just hit like crazy when using debuff weapon.

[Aeternull]

Thanks for all the replys guys. Still confused but a lot of things cleared up.

So you all said raw damage weapon over 1 star weakness. What about a 2 star weakness?

[Callyste]

Originally posted by lune:

Originally posted by Callyste:

The damage calculation in Monster Hunter games is just so confusing.

There's no monster hunter series that have simple damage calculation. (except maybe monhunt stories is more simple because it is an jrpg)

Example of the formula used in Monster Hunter Freedom Unite (MHFU)

[Attack Power x attack move used x CRITICAL or Not x Weapon Sharpness x Enemy HIT ZONE x Enemy Defense depend on low rank or high rank x Enemy under RAGE or not x Weapon Class Variable]/[Weapon Class]=Total Raw damage

[Weapon Element x Element Sharpness Multiplier x Enemy Element hit zone x Enemy Defense depend on low rank or high rank x RAGE or not x Weapon Class Variable] / [10] = Total Element Damage

Total damage = Total Raw + total Element damage

2) non elemental, or we called it raw damage weapon will give you better damage. just use weapon with the highest star in weakness.
Use raw or elemental is depend which one you like.

3) yes. Each time you attack using weapon with debuff stat (poison, paralize, blast) there's a chance you deal debuff damage (unlike elemental which you have 100% chance to deal elemental damage). It will add up and when it past enemy debuff point, it will be debuffed.
If you leave it, the add up debuff will slowly goes down. When enemy healed from debuff, the enemy debuff point will raise, which make more difficult to be debuff again.
Btw it doesn't matter where you hit, the debuff damage will be the same, so just hit like crazy when using debuff weapon.

Yes, I know all this. I've been researching about it a couple years ago to understand how it all worked. This is why I said it was so confusing :p