What are people's opinion on Arch-Tempered Elder Dragons?

[Bacon]

I honestly feel like Arch Tempered monsters are a waste of content and feel more like filler than anything else really. I feel that most people will agree with me when i say that it'd be better to have one or two more BRAND NEW monsters (We only got 3 new monsters in the whole base game up to this point, one of which is not only from an older MH game but is basically a blue Teo with a few new attacks) instead of all this Arch Tempered crap. I understand that making 2 brand new monsters would take more time and resources and thus take longer to release in between content updates but at least the roster of monsters to hunt would be a little bit bigger than it is now.

Don't get me wrong not all Arch Tempered monsters are complete trash (Zorah Madaros is an actual fight now compared to what we got in the story XD) but for the most part a good 80-90% of 'em are basically as follows: Here's an elder dragon with more health,deals more damage, MAYBE HAS ONE NEW ATTACK IF WE'RE LUCKY, and gets a literal shiny new coat to show for it. We got that instead of possibly cool and interesting new monsters for the majority of the base game -_-.

I will honestly say that i'm pretty hard set on my opinion but i'm curious what other people think about this.

[Dark3nedDragon]

Then I guess you won't like Iceborne

Considering that it will mostly just be a remix of monsters from old games, returning, and then mainly after that ending up as fighting the same old monsters from before in the base game, this time with slightly different mechanics and behaviors, better looking armor, and that's about it.

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Most of the AT fights are a joke, most fights in the game are a joke, most of life is a joke (whoops got too real here for a sec)

The real question is, whether or not you are SOLOING the fights for AT or not, as that's a completely different story than doing them in a group (honestly randoms make it harder than solo)

Monster Hunter has a similar system to (except with less RNG) WoW, you do the (exact) same mission over and over, grinding out gear, then use that gear to grind out more missions, then use those completed missions to grind out more gear, in the pursuit of fighting something in order to grind out more gear

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Arch Tempered Monsters aren't bad, they are at least more challenging and punishing than the weaker versions.

What people forget, is that the difference between fighting Teostra, and Arch Tempered Teostra (for the first time, each), is that you have a LOT better gear when fighting AT Teostra than you did to fight Teostra, you know more about the mechanics of the fight, a lot better array of skills, streamstones, weapons, armors, items; in general, it is not even comparable to the difficulty that solo'ing the first Elder Dragons is.

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Arch Tempered are where the monsters should be at, ALL of them, they shouldn't be so easy to kill either, ideally something like Behemoth is more equitable, and Extremoth instead of Tempered monsters. Arch Tempered Monsters should be like if Extremoth did double damage.

That's just my thoughts though.

[JebKerman]

Originally posted by Satan:

Arch Tempered Monsters aren't bad, they are at least more challenging and punishing than the weaker versions.

They're just more punishing though. They just beat you harder if you slip up. punishment =/= challenge.

Rathian to Pink Rathian, and Rathalos to Azure Rathalos, Diabolos to Black Diabolos is closer to what they should have been.

[Joeynator3000]

From what I've heard, they're just...crap...just like normal tempered. I know it wasn't perfect, but I just miss the freakin' virus from 4U. Apex was fine, despite the infuriating weapon bouncing crap. But at least some of them changed things up by mixing their movesets with other monsters and even gain some new moves. I think SOME AT monsters did add new moves, but...barely.

But yeah, I just miss the virus, screw Tempered monsters and the Hypers from the Generations games.

[Mr.Hmm]

I like it, its harder content but fun :).

[Bacon]

Originally posted by Satan:

Then I guess you won't like Iceborne

Considering that it will mostly just be a remix of monsters from old games, returning, and then mainly after that ending up as fighting the same old monsters from before in the base game, this time with slightly different mechanics and behaviors, better looking armor, and that's about it.

-

Most of the AT fights are a joke, most fights in the game are a joke, most of life is a joke (whoops got too real here for a sec)

The real question is, whether or not you are SOLOING the fights for AT or not, as that's a completely different story than doing them in a group (honestly randoms make it harder than solo)

Monster Hunter has a similar system to (except with less RNG) WoW, you do the (exact) same mission over and over, grinding out gear, then use that gear to grind out more missions, then use those completed missions to grind out more gear, in the pursuit of fighting something in order to grind out more gear

-

Arch Tempered Monsters aren't bad, they are at least more challenging and punishing than the weaker versions.

What people forget, is that the difference between fighting Teostra, and Arch Tempered Teostra (for the first time, each), is that you have a LOT better gear when fighting AT Teostra than you did to fight Teostra, you know more about the mechanics of the fight, a lot better array of skills, streamstones, weapons, armors, items; in general, it is not even comparable to the difficulty that solo'ing the first Elder Dragons is.

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Arch Tempered are where the monsters should be at, ALL of them, they shouldn't be so easy to kill either, ideally something like Behemoth is more equitable, and Extremoth instead of Tempered monsters. Arch Tempered Monsters should be like if Extremoth did double damage.

That's just my thoughts though.

First off i don't mind old monsters like Narga and Tigrex are coming into world (honestly if Iceborne really was just mostly filed with monsters from the old games i wouldn't mind, depending on who'd they be of course). Second it doesn't really matter weather or not i'm soloing AT monsters if i don't really WANT to fight them in the first place.The whole MH and WoW comparison kinda falls apart when you factor weather or not you WANT to do the same mission over and over and over again. I definitely agree that they should be this difficult (thinking about it now and it would have been really funny to see what an AT Anjanath would have been like XD) but i think you sort of miss my point here.

The reason why i say that most of the AT content is trash is because it's a lazy way to pad out the game over the course of it's live span so far. Again i think you can agree that it would have been better if we got a few new monsters instead of recycled but tougher elder dragons

[Erudax]

Originally posted by Joeynator3000:

From what I've heard, they're just...crap...just like normal tempered. I know it wasn't perfect, but I just miss the freakin' virus from 4U. Apex was fine, despite the infuriating weapon bouncing crap. But at least some of them changed things up by mixing their movesets with other monsters and even gain some new moves. I think SOME AT monsters did add new moves, but...barely.

But yeah, I just miss the virus, screw Tempered monsters and the Hypers from the Generations games.

Have you actually fought any of them? Take off your nostalgia goggles and go do it. With the exception of AT Kirin which is just a beefed up Kirin that can easily oneshot you, all of them are changed in a way. And with the current level of powercreep in the game, they are the only ones that provide a sense of challenge outside Extreme Behemoth.

[JPM岩]

Originally posted by Eru:

Originally posted by Joeynator3000:

From what I've heard, they're just...crap...just like normal tempered. I know it wasn't perfect, but I just miss the freakin' virus from 4U. Apex was fine, despite the infuriating weapon bouncing crap. But at least some of them changed things up by mixing their movesets with other monsters and even gain some new moves. I think SOME AT monsters did add new moves, but...barely.

But yeah, I just miss the virus, screw Tempered monsters and the Hypers from the Generations games.

Have you actually fought any of them? Take off your nostalgia goggles and go do it. With the exception of AT Kirin which is just a beefed up Kirin that can easily oneshot you, all of them are changed in a way. And with the current level of powercreep in the game, they are the only ones that provide a sense of challenge outside Extreme Behemoth.

Kirin does get a new move, but its a multiplayer only one; it's homing lightning bolt can target all players, not just 1

Originally posted by Joeynator3000:

From what I've heard, they're just...crap...just like normal tempered. I know it wasn't perfect, but I just miss the freakin' virus from 4U. Apex was fine, despite the infuriating weapon bouncing crap. But at least some of them changed things up by mixing their movesets with other monsters and even gain some new moves. I think SOME AT monsters did add new moves, but...barely.

But yeah, I just miss the virus, screw Tempered monsters and the Hypers from the Generations games.

The biggest problem with the Frenzy/Apex besides the bouncing, was that it made you stronger for attacking, which is the whole point of the game; So, yes, it's amazing you make yourself stronger, but then, that takes away a lot of the difficulty when the thing youre fighting makes you stronger

@OP:
I like the idea of Tempered and Arch Tempered; tempered honestly eases players into Master Rank, without completely throwing in new everything left and right; it makes players think a little harder
ATs I really enjoy because it's an actual taste of Master Rank: same old monster, but with more HP, hits harder, and gets a new attack to learn; plus, you're rewarded with armor that to the average player, doesnt mean much, but to a player that looks into getting stronger, can use it properly
Also, the argument of "we got ATs instead of new monsters" is a big "no ♥♥♥♥ sherlock" kind of thing, because they have to make everything from scratch, where 4U and Gen recycled almost everything; we also now know that Iceborne, aka Master Rank, and the free content updates were being developed at the same time, so the effort to monsters besides Jho, Kulve, Luna, Behemoth, Leshen and Ancient Leshen so heavily being put towards Iceborne, which honestly, 5 monsters is about average for the DLC monsters being added later (4U had added HR/GRank versions of preexisting monsters, and then the 3 fatalises, and Gen added the 3 fatties and Chaos Gore)