How Duke Nukem Forever's multiplayer works (Connection/ping)

[StarNukem]

Alright, so many people are throwing out the term "cheater" on DNF because they can't hit the player normally, or they die in one shot by certain players. I'm going to try to explain how DNF works based on it's connection and based on the research I've acquired.

Ok, let's get this straight. Duke Nukem Forever has P2P netcode (Peer 2 Peer) which means that all players in the server moshpit connections together like a big mixing pot and the median ping is determined for the server, etc etc. I will explain that further.

So Duke Nukem Forever has a ♥♥♥♥♥♥ up version of P2P. Instead of giving laggy players the disadvantage, it gives them a huge advantage if you know how to compensate the lag. Let me try to explain the basics of P2P real quick. Ok, so let's say you host a server and you are playing with one player. Your ping is 30 and your opponent's ping is 150. Now, combine the two to make 180. Divide it by 2 and you now have the median ping. Which is 90 and that means that you and the other player are on equal grounds connection wise. Except the host gets advantage in DNF because of poopy netcode. I could explain that, but it's just even more writing to this essay.

Now let's say you connect to a dedicated server with a ping of 30. You have a normal ping of 100 and your opponent has a ping of 200. That means you add all of the pings 200+100+30=330. Divide that by 3 now (because there are 3 pings) and you get 110. That means the player who is closer to the median ping will have the best possible connection, right? WRONG!!! Since DNF's netcode is coded to compensate for lag, it OVERCOMPENSATES and gives laggy players an incredible advanatage.

Ever noticed how it's hard to hit someone who has a high ping? You can't shoot them directly, right? Yeah you have to aim a little bit behind the player. That's because the server is telling you (the user with good ping) that your enemy is right in front of you, but because he is lagging, he's actually 2 feet farther ahead. Based on ping, he can either be farther or closer to where he is on your screen. It's all about compensation.

From a laggy player's PoV, it's harder for them to hit you but easier for them to kill you. Making sense yet? Of course not! Let me break it down. The laggy player will have trouble hitting you, but when he does, his shots register in bursts due to his lag. So, sometimes you'll see that a player killed you through the wall. That's because the shots are delayed and they came in bursts. Sometimes it seems like he only shot once, but on his screen, he shot twice, three times, and so on. Combine laggy players who can't be hit easily but can kill easily, and you have DNF's ♥♥♥♥♥♥ netcode.


Some players in the Duke Nukem community have this problem. Unstable pings. This means their ping is always changing, and the server can't keep up with them. Like, one second the player's ping is 200 and the next it's 600. You do the math in your head. If his ping is unstable, your game will be unstable regardless of your ping. Some players are able to manipulate their lag in a thing called a "lag switch" and the only player's who have them are Dave and Nathan. (Those are their real names because they change their names frequently on here). You'll know them when you see their silent, rapid fire guns.

Anyway, I hope this helps you guys. If you have any questions (Because this discussion is a bit patchy) please leave a comment below and I'll try to answer it the best I can.

[Challenge.Hunter]

Maybe this sort of explain some things, but there are still a few other elements that infuriate some gamers. For example, all the TNT fetishers as I call them (in short, people who love RPGs, Devastators and Pipe Bombs) When they get into action, any match becomes unplayable. And there is more - Hundreds of times I was getting into action, when all of a sudden a Pipe Bomb appeared right in front of me and killed me. Like, how the hell did he know I was coming through that route? No Ping thingie would explain that.

[bullerbuller7]

Because they have played the level more than a hundred times and they expect people to come there.

[Challenge.Hunter]

Originally posted by bullerbuller7:

Because they have played the level more than a hundred times and they expect people to come there.

Well I kinda doubt it. There's a difference between throwing grenades like crazy, and throwing them at the exact moment.

[FragMac_forever]

Well when I play online in an infinte ammo match there're basically two instances where I use pipbombs. 1. Places where players tend to be. You know, places with certain weapons, powerups or choke points. 2. To cut of a players path. I see them running a certain direction and I throw a pipebomb to a point where they are likely to end up.
I agree that pipebombs are used way too much, but in a game with infinite ammo mutator you have to learn to use them or you will be pretty much dead last.

The problem I have with Multiplayer is that everyone suspects everone else to be a cheater and people block each other and thus the number of player goes down even more. What I would love to see in DNF is some sort of Anti-Cheating-Software so people can trust each other that the game is played fairly. I myself have been called a cheater numerous times and been blocked by players even though I never used a cheat in my life in a multiplayer match. But that'll never happen, since support for this game is non-existant.

[StarNukem]

Same here. The real cheaters claim to use their cheats against skilled players and attempt to justify their cheats with the phrase "giving the hackers a taste of their own medicine" when truthfully, you're only using them to make yourself look good. Beating a pro player with cheats only proves that the skilled players are "skilled" in the sense that it takes hacks/cheats to beat them. But it gets annoying when 4 ripper modders roll in and start busting out the mods. It's no fun for anyone! How can you take a pleasure in cheating, especially on a game like Duke Nukem Forever? I use cheat codes in single player games because it's fun to have god mode, noclip and infinite ammo and completely dominating the SP. When it comes to multiplayer, if I'm not good at the game, I just stop playing and find another game.

[FragMac_forever]

I was playing some DNF today and had a lot of fun. Then in come Blue_Knight, later on Sakarra and as a response two players on the other teams started cheating. Long story short: the whole game went down the drain in minutes. It's so aggravating.

[Nada]

Thanks for a better explanation. Pretty hard to get good at a game that you can't actually play.
I've always had a problem with MP, and I wrote it off to a poor connection, and also I usually play real late so I'm up against high-pingers already.
So I've improved my connection (as much as I possibly can) and it's pretty good now, but I still seem to be at a great disadvantage, can rarely kill with the pistol, can't rocket jump at all (but can if noone else is in the game). The fewer players in the game, the more playable it is and I pretty much hate playing it with more than 4. Also, the ones that you find playing are usually real good because they play it a lot more than me, they've memorized all the maps, they camp out with the big weapons and steal all the power ups.
I look young but I've been playing MP games for a long time, not every day but I've played DN3D over a direct dial connection, how many players can say that?
Anyway, this does help explain why I get killed with 1 or 2 pistol shots. It doesn't explain why I usually don't see or hear the laser trip mines until I get right on top of them.
How about some strategy tips on how to deal with these issues, are you guys afraid to reveal your secrets? All I ever find is people complaining about it. Funny how I can't even find a good MP video of DNF, there are some out there, but I've never seen one by an actual good player.

Thanks

[StarNukem]

The reason for you not hearing the trip mines is because most buildings in DNF have somewhat of a sound barrier, that upon entering a building you will hear it when you explode, but on the outside of the building there is no sound. If you place the mine on the doorway, like most players do, you will more than likely hear the noise, but if you place the mine inside of the building, you're not going to hear it from the outside, and vise versa. (If you're in the building, you won't hear it on the outside). Pro players have picked up on that and use it to their advantage now, along with some other tricks. I might post a guide soon on how to be good at Duke Nukem Forever lol, but maybe not. This game is pretty much learning by immersion, but you can ask for help at any time and some players, like myself, would be happy to help.

[Dennis Stamp]

Strange. I rarely had lag-related problems when playing DNF online, but lag-related problems make the experience of playing DN3D online problematic at best.

[Nada]

Originally posted by StarCraftZerg:

The reason for you not hearing the trip mines is because most buildings in DNF have somewhat of a sound barrier...

I'm well aware of the sound radius, thats not the issue. It's lag, and if there are fewer than 4/5 players then it isn't so much an issue.

[Nada]

Well, seems the reason I wan't hearing the trip mines is because of my on-board sound card. Now I have the X-Fi that uses it's own processor for surround EAX, so now I hear them before I walk into them.

[Herr Brosum]

Originally posted by StarCraftZerg:

Alright, so many people are throwing out the term "cheater" on DNF because they can't hit the player normally, or they die in one shot by certain players. I'm going to try to explain how DNF works based on it's connection and based on the research I've acquired.

Ok, let's get this straight. Duke Nukem Forever has P2P netcode (Peer 2 Peer) which means that all players in the server moshpit connections together like a big mixing pot and the median ping is determined for the server, etc etc. I will explain that further.

So Duke Nukem Forever has a ♥♥♥♥ed up version of P2P. Instead of giving laggy players the disadvantage, it gives them a huge advantage if you know how to compensate the lag. Let me try to explain the basics of P2P real quick. Ok, so let's say you host a server and you are playing with one player. Your ping is 30 and your opponent's ping is 150. Now, combine the two to make 180. Divide it by 2 and you now have the median ping. Which is 90 and that means that you and the other player are on equal grounds connection wise. Except the host gets advantage in DNF because of poopy netcode. I could explain that, but it's just even more writing to this essay.

Now let's say you connect to a dedicated server with a ping of 30. You have a normal ping of 100 and your opponent has a ping of 200. That means you add all of the pings 200+100+30=330. Divide that by 3 now (because there are 3 pings) and you get 110. That means the player who is closer to the median ping will have the best possible connection, right? WRONG!!! Since DNF's netcode is coded to compensate for lag, it OVERCOMPENSATES and gives laggy players an incredible advanatage.

Ever noticed how it's hard to hit someone who has a high ping? You can't shoot them directly, right? Yeah you have to aim a little bit behind the player. That's because the server is telling you (the user with good ping) that your enemy is right in front of you, but because he is lagging, he's actually 2 feet farther ahead. Based on ping, he can either be farther or closer to where he is on your screen. It's all about compensation.

From a laggy player's PoV, it's harder for them to hit you but easier for them to kill you. Making sense yet? Of course not! Let me break it down. The laggy player will have trouble hitting you, but when he does, his shots register in bursts due to his lag. So, sometimes you'll see that a player killed you through the wall. That's because the shots are delayed and they came in bursts. Sometimes it seems like he only shot once, but on his screen, he shot twice, three times, and so on. Combine laggy players who can't be hit easily but can kill easily, and you have DNF's ♥♥♥♥♥♥ netcode.


Some players in the Duke Nukem community have this problem. Unstable pings. This means their ping is always changing, and the server can't keep up with them. Like, one second the player's ping is 200 and the next it's 600. You do the math in your head. If his ping is unstable, your game will be unstable regardless of your ping. Some players are able to manipulate their lag in a thing called a "lag switch" and the only player's who have them are Dave and Nathan. (Those are their real names because they change their names frequently on here). You'll know them when you see their silent, rapid fire guns.

Anyway, I hope this helps you guys. If you have any questions (Because this discussion is a bit patchy) please leave a comment below and I'll try to answer it the best I can.

***BS***

[StarNukem]

Oh look everyone, Kater showed up to explain how the netcode works! Ok Kater, spotlight is yours! Let's hear what you think then...