Firefighting "turret" help needed

[Recel]

I've started to design a firefighting boat, and instead of the water cannon I wanted to actually build my own turret for it, but ran into multiple issues.

At first I simply put down a pivot on the deck and built from there, but I ended up not liking the design, because even if I try to compact it, it's simply too tall due to the seat. I also would love to access the turret from within the ship. So I had and idea to create it in a way like tanks.

I made a custom door frame on the hull and the bottom of the turret and sunk the turrets interior through the opening and connected it to a pivot below. However, as I should have guessed, the game doesn't recognize this as two "seals" on each other, but as two large holes. It only works until water, for any reason, reaches the "turret ring", which after it floods rapidly with no amount of pumps keeping it dry.
Than I thought I'll make the turret airtight and have a door on both the lowered part and the ships interior allowing access. However, this still leaves the gap between unsealed, meaning I take on water traveling between the turret and the hull. A smaller issue is also that the turret could only be accessed in its default rotation.

Another big issue I'm having is with water pressure. I can't get the hoses to fire water out, they only trickle out of them. One pump or ten makes no difference. To make the turret smaller, instead of using a fluid pivot for the arms, I'm using a small pivot and connect the water pipes leading to the hose with the fluid wire block. Can that be an issue?

The design I'm aiming for might not be really possible with how the game works, but I thought I'd ask here. Maybe someone with better design skills has a good idea to make it work.

[Ra-Ra-Rasputin]

What you're describing is possible, but i'd prefer to take a personal look at it. Could you upload the vehicle? I'll see what i can do.

It's also fine if you don't want to for any reason, then i'll mock up something for you, i suppose.

[Recel]

I'm actually mocking up another prototype. I figured I'll use rails and docking doors.

Basically, when the seat is occupied the docking doors close, unlock and the turret assembly slides forward by one block, which allows the pivots to rotate without collision. When you leave the seat, the turret returns to a 0 rotation, than slides back and docks again.

Will need to fiddle a lot with a microcontroller. Will see how it works.

[Ra-Ra-Rasputin]

I do have something relevant in the somewhat unsorted mess of my workshop uploads:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1998669324

It shows a few different pump setups and their effectiveness.

[Recel]

Thank you!

[Recel]

Run into another minor issue I'd like to ask help with.

So, since the turret is quite flush with the hull, there is no need for the elevators to rotate downwards. Simply clamping the input works, but than there's this "dead zone" in the movement if the seats input is negative.
I thought about having the seat input connected to two memory registers, find the difference between the two and shifting an up-down counter set to 0-2 with a start of 1. However for that to work one of the memory registers has to lag behind on the input. Any way to make that work?

Also, I might upload the mock up turret, but I wouldn't like it to be modified.
I find working and solving these challenges, even if with some help, one of the most fun parts of the game. Uploading it and having someone throw back a "finished" design would ruin the fun.

EDIT: realized I'm silly, and wouldn't need memory registers in the first place. But I'd still need to make one of the inputs lag behind.

[Recel]

Okay, I decided to upload it. Might be easier to work with if you can actually view the damn thing.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2020803955

The design needs some overhaul. I realized while building it that I need less space for the turret to rotate in than I initially thought, so I could have more space in the turret.
The whole sealing and door mechanics are not made yet, so you can't really climb out for now unless you put it back in the workbench.
I'm trying to design the microcontroller in a way that I can configure some things easily, so I can reuse it for other creations (and of course the final design that goes in the future boat).

[Ra-Ra-Rasputin]

Well, i'll take a look at that after i've had my look at a certain plane.

I believe it's a classic case of overthinking the issue based on what you said previously. For instance if you have delays moving the turret downward, why not simply set the sensitivity to 100% and divide the input so it isn't too fast to use?

[Recel]

I'm not sure if I changed that before or after I uploaded, but the way I have it set up now is that I take the seats input, connect it to a Memory Register which is connected to a rapid blinker.
Than I compare the original input with the Memory Register, which is lagging behind by 0.1 seconds. Depending on which is greater it shifts an Up-Down counter to adjust the elevation. So now the Up-Down counters increments become the elevation speed. And sadly, I can't dynamically change that.

I could do that to the Azimuth though.

Also, yes, I think I do have a tendency to overthink things.

[Ra-Ra-Rasputin]

Here you go, i "somewhat" simplified how it's wired up.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2020931715

The whole on/off return thing doesn't work with the elevation, but it should be easy to re-implement.

[Recel]

That is simpler than what I did.

I reimplemented the sliders, but than I realized my main problem. The way the turret activate has to go in a certain order, which is easy enough. However when you deactivate it it has to go in the exact opposite order. And I don't know how to do that.

EDIT: Would timing it with Capacitors work?

[Ra-Ra-Rasputin]

Capacitors are good when you have expected, fixed motion or need delays, they're very hard to utilize in something like this.

If you're having trouble figuring out how to reverse one routine, make two routines. There's plenty of space in the microcontroller grid. To me it sounds like all you need is a pair of switchboxes that set the rotation and angle of the turrets to default (0), then perform a check that both are at 0, and only then retract the turret.

[Ra-Ra-Rasputin]

Actually, my hands are idle playthings. Let me have a shot at making it wholesale.
Note that i'm only making this because i'm interested in the little challenge, i think it's much better for you to learn the loops of the microcontroller yourself. Consider this as a "cheat sheet" on making it as compact as possible.

I'll edit this post with an upload once i'm done.

[Recel]

Actually, there was something which isn't variable time. And that is the opening and closing of the docking doors.Though I only needed two capacitors to make the rails and the magnets wait three seconds so the doors can close before the assembly moves forward.

Backwards the rails check the turret angles before moving, and the magnets turn on when the turret starts moving backwards, locking at the end.
The doors check if the turret is active or not and if there is a seal.

My only remaining issue is setting the turrets back to zero. Since I can't read the position of the compact rails, only its speed through the Up-Down counter, I can't tell the position of the turret. Should I ever want/need a longer rail system for it, or build it more confined, I can't just have it turn on/off if the rail is at speed.
I could try to change the system to the bigger rails to be able to read such information, but with that the turrets size also increases.

The only idea I have is to measure distance manually with a Property slider. Assuming the rails speed is in meter per seconds, I could count how long it takes for it to reach the end and wire that to a timer.

EDIT: I updated the workshop to my current design if you feel like looking at it. All its missing is the turret reset microcontroller part

[Ra-Ra-Rasputin]

You know that part about editing it? I lied.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2021191739

Took longer than i expected, but then i was working on it being compact and simple. The microcontroller comes with a grand total of 6 connections as a whole on its logic board. I cross-wired the docking doors so that they open automatically once they form a seal. The turret also won't retract until it reaches 0 rotation.

Also i took a look at it again, but the one i can load from workshop is the same i'm already subscribed to!

[Recel]

Originally posted by Ra-Ra-Rasputin:

You know that part about editing it? I lied.

Took longer than i expected, but then i was working on it being compact and simple. The microcontroller comes with a grand total of 6 connections as a whole on its logic board. I cross-wired the docking doors so that they open automatically once they form a seal. The turret also won't retract until it reaches 0 rotation.

Also i broke the squirting part, but that's not really the complex thing here anyway.

I can't look now, but won't the sealing cause trouble when the turret disconnects? Since it dislodges it self instantly, while the doors take a few seconds to close. Or does the game considers a closing door already sealed?

Also, odd you see the old one. Maybe the workshop didn't update it yet/properly?