Why Lost Izaleth is so unfinished?

[crack smoker2014]

The first boss of the location is the easiest boss in the game, the second one is a reused Stray Demon, the third one is incredibly unfair, annoying yet still easy and the Bed of Chaos is the Bed of Chaos. Were they running out of time this much?

[patrixilentius]

Originally posted by The Great Brambino:

Another big factor is the team's experience creating these Souls games. Demon's Souls took 3 years to complete, and they were only given about 2 years to finish the original Dark Souls without the DLC. Compare that to Dark Souls 3's 2 year development cycle, which is a much more polished release.

I'm not sure I understand. Your point is that with more experience they learned how to release more polished games after a shorter development process?

[The Great Brambino]

Originally posted by patrix666:

Originally posted by The Great Brambino:

Another big factor is the team's experience creating these Souls games. Demon's Souls took 3 years to complete, and they were only given about 2 years to finish the original Dark Souls without the DLC. Compare that to Dark Souls 3's 2 year development cycle, which is a much more polished release.

I'm not sure I understand. Your point is that with more experience they learned how to release more polished games after a shorter development process?

Yes exactly, but that's only one small reason in an ocean of others certain parts of the late game seem rushed.

[patrixilentius]

Originally posted by Harrison Ford:

People are complaining about the Skull Lantern, which literally lights the way with blue orbs to guide your path?

I never noticed that. I had to start the game a moment ago to see these orbs in action. That's complete news to me. Thanks!

[crack smoker2014]

Originally posted by The Great Brambino:

The entirety of Lost Izalith is the only area in the game where enemies are copy+pasted all over the place, making it pretty obvious the dev team was rushed or completely uninterested in the area.

My two cents is that Bandai Namco rushed Fromsoft to complete the area to meet some deadline. Bamco is known for stuff like this, and it's no wonder they would rush a small developer like Fromsoft before the Souls series really took off in 2011.

Another big factor is the team's experience creating these Souls games. Demon's Souls took 3 years to complete, and they were only given about 2 years to finish the original Dark Souls without the DLC. Compare that to Dark Souls 3's 2 year development cycle, which is a much more polished release.

You know i actually thought that they used the Lost Izalith's enemies as bosses because they were running out of time but it seems like the opposite, they just reused the bosses as enemies. Quite interesting

[patrixilentius]

Originally posted by incolhoz:

Originally posted by The Great Brambino:

The entirety of Lost Izalith is the only area in the game where enemies are copy+pasted all over the place, making it pretty obvious the dev team was rushed or completely uninterested in the area.

My two cents is that Bandai Namco rushed Fromsoft to complete the area to meet some deadline. Bamco is known for stuff like this, and it's no wonder they would rush a small developer like Fromsoft before the Souls series really took off in 2011.

Another big factor is the team's experience creating these Souls games. Demon's Souls took 3 years to complete, and they were only given about 2 years to finish the original Dark Souls without the DLC. Compare that to Dark Souls 3's 2 year development cycle, which is a much more polished release.

You know i actually thought that they used the Lost Izalith's enemies as bosses because they were running out of time but it seems like the opposite, they just reused the bosses as enemies. Quite interesting

In terms of lore it makes perfect sense, though. It's Dark Souls version of "hell", the place where demons come from. They were trapped there for some time, but then found a way and started escaping to the surface. There they became bosses, because what else they could do. It makes sense, but when you're playing the game you just feel like you're fighting copy-pasted enemies and you are basically right.

[CB]

they could've added enemies that are already in the game for better variety down there. the fire dogs belong. the cragspiders belong. hell, throw in a few torch hollows.

the fat demon statue things are the worst enemy in the game and they're everywhere.

[patrixilentius]

Originally posted by CB:

they could've added enemies that are already in the game for better variety down there. the fire dogs belong. the cragspiders belong. hell, throw in a few torch hollows.

the fat demon statue things are the worst enemy in the game and they're everywhere.

I agree with everything, except for the hollows: I think there should be no humanoid enemies in Hell. Only hellish monsters.
Those petrified turds are a disgrace. Good thing they never escaped to the surface. They would be even more embarassing walking on streets or in woods.

[CB]

the torch hollows thing was sort of a joke. you know, because they have some fire on them. but part of me does think a few black knights down there would make some sense. lore-wise, wasn't that their jam? trying to bust up chaos demons?

the demon statues are so unfinished they don't even have a loot table.

but also i mean -- the taurus demons and capra demons just end before you get down to lost izalith. and even enemies like the stray demon fit down there in some way -- isn't that where they basically came from? maybe just have like, two. just for contrast with the demon firesage. i'm just saying, it's the source.

[patrixilentius]

Originally posted by CB:

the torch hollows thing was sort of a joke. you know, because they have some fire on them. but part of me does think a few black knights down there would make some sense. lore-wise, wasn't that their jam? trying to bust up chaos demons?

the demon statues are so unfinished they don't even have a loot table.

but also i mean -- the taurus demons and capra demons just end before you get down to lost izalith. and even enemies like the stray demon fit down there in some way -- isn't that where they basically came from? maybe just have like, two. just for contrast with the demon firesage. i'm just saying, it's the source.

Oh, there should be Black Knights galore down there. With some fire effects on them too. Fighting you AND the demons. That would absolutely make sense lore-wise.

[Call Sign: Raven]

I kept thinking how awesome it would be if they used a variation of Flame Lurker in Lost Izalith, but as a standard enemy that you fought on the lava sections after acquiring the orange ring.

[patrixilentius]

Originally posted by Harrison Ford:

I kept thinking how awesome it would be if they used a variation of Flame Lurker in Lost Izalith, but as a standard enemy that you fought on the lava sections after acquiring the orange ring.

That's actualy a great idea. I'm sure there's a mod somewhere which did just that.
Speaking of mods, Harrison, how did you like Tales of Drangleic? I've finished it yesterday, along with all DLCs, and had an awesome time with it. Made the game a lot better in almost every regard in my opinion.
That agility, oh, that agility...

[Call Sign: Raven]

Originally posted by patrix666:

Originally posted by Harrison Ford:

I kept thinking how awesome it would be if they used a variation of Flame Lurker in Lost Izalith, but as a standard enemy that you fought on the lava sections after acquiring the orange ring.

That's actualy a great idea. I'm sure there's a mod somewhere which did just that.
Speaking of mods, Harrison, how did you like Tales of Drangleic? I've finished it yesterday, along with all DLCs, and had an awesome time with it. Made the game a lot better in almost every regard in my opinion.
That agility, oh, that agility...

If someone mods Flame Lurker into Dark Souls, I'll **** my pants.

I'm glad you enjoyed it, but I found that it wasn't for me. I gave up after lighting 3 primal bonfires, I just couldn't get past the Rotten, he felt way too cheap. Overall, I found the experience to be rather rough around the edges. I think it would have benefited from more time in the oven, honestly.

[Call Sign: Raven]

Also, now that I looked into it, someone modded Dark Souls 3 to included a Flame Lurker fight with 2 Flame Lurkers at the same time in the Vordt arena. Yikes. That's at the very end. This is NOT my video, heads up the commentary is kind of on the annoying side.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yiaK5FTI0k

[patrixilentius]

Originally posted by Harrison Ford:

I'm glad you enjoyed it, but I found that it wasn't for me. I gave up after lighting 3 primal bonfires, I just couldn't get past the Rotten, he felt way too cheap. Overall, I found the experience to be rather rough around the edges. I think it would have benefited from more time in the oven, honestly.

That's a pity, I was completely enamored by that mod. I find it hard to return to vanilla DS2 now, because I will lose all that delicious agility and fast estus drinking.
But The Rotten was a bit too fast, the modder ever admitted it. It was very hard to get him, but I managed with a summon. One of the toughest bosses in that version. Other than that, it was great fun and I didn't see many problems with it at all.

[Call Sign: Raven]

Originally posted by patrix666:

Originally posted by Harrison Ford:

I'm glad you enjoyed it, but I found that it wasn't for me. I gave up after lighting 3 primal bonfires, I just couldn't get past the Rotten, he felt way too cheap. Overall, I found the experience to be rather rough around the edges. I think it would have benefited from more time in the oven, honestly.

That's a pity, I was completely enamored by that mod. I find it hard to return to vanilla DS2 now, because I will lose all that delicious agility and fast estus drinking.
But The Rotten was a bit too fast, the modder ever admitted it. It was very hard to get him, but I managed with a summon. One of the toughest bosses in that version. Other than that, it was great fun and I didn't see many problems with it at all.

I actually really enjoyed some of the other fights that I encountered up to that point. Dragon Rider and Ornstein were both a highlight for me.