To Dev team - PLEASE FIX PVP BACKSTAB

[cannoliGun]

That's all I'm hopping.
PVP Backstab is just a cancer to this game.
It sucks the fun out ;(

[Rapax/希狐]

Absolutely forget it. That's never going to happen.

If they ever had an intention to fix something like that the would have said it and they won't dare to touch what is integral to the "Dark Souls Experience", even though people argue dead angles were a part of that.

[Chili]

this is why this game is dead

[cannoliGun]

They might fix it if we keep complaining.
This remaster version already got more patches them the original one on PC

[undakovrist]

Yeah, no. They're not going to "fix" backstabs.

[Hunubul]

Backstab can only be broken if there is lag. Do you know what else is broken if there is lag? Everything.

[Rapax/希狐]

Originally posted by The Frog Who Ate Ponion:

Backstab can only be broken if there is lag. Do you know what else is broken if there is lag? Everything.

normal attack: 400dmg, telegraphed, can be blocked, parried or dodged, leaves user open to a counterattack.
backstab: 1000dmg comes out on frame 1. Cannot be blocked, parried or dodged, leaves the VICTIM open to a follow-up attack.

Yeeeaaaahhh i would say your statement is... frequently discussed.

[Makko]

theres nothing to fix

[Hunubul]

Originally posted by _shiro96:

Originally posted by The Frog Who Ate Ponion:

Backstab can only be broken if there is lag. Do you know what else is broken if there is lag? Everything.

normal attack: 400dmg, telegraphed, can be blocked, parried or dodged, leaves user open to a counterattack.
backstab: 1000dmg comes out on frame 1. Cannot be blocked, parried or dodged, leaves the VICTIM open to a follow-up attack.

Yeeeaaaahhh i would say your statement is... frequently discussed.

You can easily avoid backstabs. You also get backstab immunity until you take action. If you get backstabbed it's because you left yourself open for it. Like attacking with heavy weapon, or using estus, or stuff.

If you get backstabbed in a weird way, like facing the enemy and BOOM backstab, that's lag. But spells and R1 spam is also freaking strong with lag, so the problem wouldn't be the backstab itself, but the lag.

[undakovrist]

Backstabs are literally not broken. They function exactly as they should with the design of the game's systems. Whether or not you like them or think they are too powerful is a separate issue, but calling then broken is simply wrong. Especially because as people have said, they are counterable and do not require any specific build to counter.

[Rapax/希狐]

Originally posted by undakovrist:

They function exactly as they should with the design of the game's systems.

Regardless of whether they are overpowered or cheap or whatever, this is just wrong.

Backstabs are a mechanic for stealth and agility. They are intended to punish people who are unattentive or overcommit with a directional attack or spell cast.

You are basically saying the backstab meta we have now was part of the game's visiion, which it is obviously not, because steps were taken to avoid a backstab meta in future games.

I could argue backstabs are bad, but I know I am not going to win any arguments with that, so I'll leave it be. I can just tell you that how backstabs are used right now is an absolute perversion of how they were intended to work.

[Makko]

Originally posted by _shiro96:

Originally posted by undakovrist:

They function exactly as they should with the design of the game's systems.

You are basically saying the backstab meta we have now was part of the game's visiion

backstabs arent meta tho if it was all we would see in tourneys would be gc havel moms

[Rapax/希狐]

Originally posted by Makko:

Originally posted by _shiro96:

You are basically saying the backstab meta we have now was part of the game's visiion

backstabs arent meta tho if it was all we would see in tourneys would be gc havel moms

Do we see tournes? The only ones I have seen were all havel moms and some desync wizards.

Prtety sure they are meta asf, but when i said backstab meta I meant the meta of backstabs as their own game.

[Orgazmo]

Originally posted by undakovrist:

Backstabs are literally not broken. They function exactly as they should with the design of the game's systems.

Literally may be not. But they become a center point of gameplay, make all other mechanic redundant. All builds stricts to meta, all at least a little experienced players base their builds on backstabbing and not getting backstabbed. (80% of PvP is enemy kiting/rolling behind/make gimmicky teleport moves to get backstabs or rolling like crazy when you get near. Other 20% just pure mages).

See the tournament videos: everyone fish backstabs or just staying as far as they could. And still they, the very blue blood of PvP, with knowledge of all exploits and gimmicks, half of the time got backstabbed from the front, from 10 meters, in midroll.

By the way, when you backstabbed by the enemy, standing in front of you and cant reach with Demon Spear, yep, thats literally broken. As well as shadow strikes, parry stabs, moveswaps,
invisible spells, etc. Yep, it's broken, yep, it should be fixed. From just doesn't care for it's 10 year old game. No surprise.

[cannoliGun]

Originally posted by undakovrist:

Backstabs are literally not broken. They function exactly as they should with the design of the game's systems. .

that makes no sense. Just go play DS3 and you will realise that the backstab system in DS1 is totally broken and wrong

[undakovrist]

Originally posted by _shiro96:

Originally posted by undakovrist:

They function exactly as they should with the design of the game's systems.

Regardless of whether they are overpowered or cheap or whatever, this is just wrong.

Backstabs are a mechanic for stealth and agility. They are intended to punish people who are unattentive or overcommit with a directional attack or spell cast.

You are basically saying the backstab meta we have now was part of the game's visiion, which it is obviously not, because steps were taken to avoid a backstab meta in future games.

I could argue backstabs are bad, but I know I am not going to win any arguments with that, so I'll leave it be. I can just tell you that how backstabs are used right now is an absolute perversion of how they were intended to work.

None of that is what I said and you even quoted the exact part of my post that is important here. The designer's "vision" is irrelevant in this case. Backstabs function exactly as they should within the game's systems. Hence, they are not "broken". They work as they should and do not glitch or break the game. If you can't understand that much then I'm sorry that you're dense but I'm not going to sit here and explain the game's systems, but there's plenty of people who work on reverse engineering this game for the sake of mods and better understanding the game who you could talk to if they have the time and patience.
But no, they are not broken even if you wish think that they are, and even if FromSoft did not imagine everyone to run around backstabbing everything and each other. Which they probably didn't honestly, but who knows.

Originally posted by Orgazmo:

Originally posted by undakovrist:

Backstabs are literally not broken. They function exactly as they should with the design of the game's systems.

Literally may be not. But they become a center point of gameplay, make all other mechanic redundant. All builds stricts to meta, all at least a little experienced players base their builds on backstabbing and not getting backstabbed. (80% of PvP is enemy kiting/rolling behind/make gimmicky teleport moves to get backstabs or rolling like crazy when you get near. Other 20% just pure mages).

See the tournament videos: everyone fish backstabs or just staying as far as they could. And still they, the very blue blood of PvP, with knowledge of all exploits and gimmicks, half of the time got backstabbed from the front, from 10 meters, in midroll.

By the way, when you backstabbed by the enemy, standing in front of you and cant reach with Demon Spear, yep, thats literally broken. As well as shadow strikes, parry stabs, moveswaps,
invisible spells, etc. Yep, it's broken, yep, it should be fixed. From just doesn't care for it's 10 year old game. No surprise.

I can barely understand a lot of what you're trying to say and a lot of your examples so I apologize for that but I guess there's a bit of language barrier between us. I'll comment on a few of your examples that I do understand to try to have them make more sense to you though, as some of them are not actually broken or even a glitch, but rather an exploit of the game's design.
Parry backstabs. These are not a glitch, no matter how much they seem like it. They are weird, and frankly pretty stupid, but they're an exploit of the animation priority system that is very much an intentional design choice. This actually exists in DS3 as well, but is much less useful because of backstabs being a two-stage throw instead of being instant.
Shadow Strikes? I'm assuming this is Ghost Strikes, which function similarly to Dead Angles. These happened in PtDE due to the angle of damage hitboxes actually being applied based off the angle your character was facing, rather than the actual location of the hitbox and angle relative to the direction it was moving. All spells could be dead angled for the same reason. Not a thing in Remaster.
Invisible spells, I'd probably consider them as an oversight in the netcode but I wouldn't blame anyone for calling it a glitch I think. If you cast a follow type spell before someone invades you, that information just isn't sent over to the other player, and that's why it happens. Really awful honestly and definitely something that should be fixed.
Moveswaps I would actually call a glitch, as weapons were not meant to have their moveset information changed in that way. Remaster fixes it. I think that's sad since they were more silly than actually useful, and the ones that could be considered useful would drain your entire stamina bar, but along with fixing moveswaps they also fixed permaswaps, tumblebuffing, and some other ♥♥♥♥ that really needed to be fixed.

edit for no double post

Originally posted by pralima87:

Originally posted by undakovrist:

Backstabs are literally not broken. They function exactly as they should with the design of the game's systems. .

that makes no sense. Just go play DS3 and you will realise that the backstab system in DS1 is totally broken and wrong

I've played all of the Soulsborne games and that doesn't mean anything. Them having different backstab systems does not mean one is broken, they're just different.