Install Linux if you want to play HD2 but you don't want a AC Tool with low level Kernel rights?

[Kobold]

If this is the case, then i found a solution, get rid (after time) of the Spy OS Win10/11 and install for example Manjaro/KDE (recommend by Valve) or other Distro's. For the first steps in Linux there is also recommendation to use Mint/Cinnamon.

Buy Helldivers2 in Steam and just install it through Steam/Proton and nProtect GameGuard won't get Kernel Access, because it doesn't has native Linux support.

Most FAQ's around Linux, Install & Gaming included in this Guide. AMD and Nvidia GPU's working today under Linux (AMD GPU's even better than my nvidia 2080Ti).

With Microsoft NEW Service Agreement to scan & use all (AI/Hatespeech/Advertising) your locale stored files, its a middle finger to the normal user. Set a clear sign to Microsoft to ♥♥♥♥ off and install Linux. Get your Privacy and control back!

Microsoft and this Rootkits (designed for Microsoft Products) own's your PC right now.
Show them you are not a sheep.

https://forum.manjaro.org/t/are-kernel-level-anti-cheat-like-in-helldivers2-for-example-a-security-issue-for-linux/156620

Linux is gaming ready today, we no longer need Microsoft! I'm mainly use Linux since almost 4 years now, as gamer! I have Win10 installed and used it only for VR Gaming today.

You don't have to decide between Linux or Windows, you can also use both and find the middle way between both worlds, you can do a slow progression, no one is forcing you!

Helldivers2 Steam Linux User Info's:
https://www.protondb.com/app/553850

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Information/Overview if you interested to try out Linux:

I just can recommend to everyone who is deciding to get his feet wet, instead jumping straight into Linux water, to buy another external/internal SSD (250-500GB should be enough). So you can easy decide which OS you want to boot when you start your PC and with a hotkey (for my Bios its F12) to choose which HDD/SSD you wanted to boot from, without messing around with dual boot function between Windows and Linux.
"You always need a additional USB Boot-Stick to install, same as installing Windows"

I bought 4 years ago a Samsung Portable SSD T5 (500GB) which performs really good and i can't even see the difference between my Linux Laptop which has a M.2 SSD.

"For (little) testing you can even install Linux on a USB stick, if you don't have the money for a second internal/external SSD, i think the bare minimum should be a 30-50GB USB Stick. Some people maybe try Virtual Machine, but a VM never gives Linux the performance as a native installation, at least not without advanced VM Settings!"

In the early phase i switched regularly between Win7 and Linux which gave me a good feeling for a better transition, to find program's for Linux that replaced my program's under Windows.

Distro (Fundament 40%) & Desktop Environment (Surface 60%):

Some Distributions allows to choose several different Desktop Environments. Depends on the liking and the eye candy or the age on your Hardware. I was in shock after i realised how much stuff rely on the DE and not the Distro.

So choosing a Desktop Environment (DE) is also a big decision, there are really beautiful DE's out there and you can (you don't have too) adjust them "MODDING" them, specially KDE has really good functions with Transparency Taskbar with Blur effects or to archive your old/retro Win2k or Win7 looks.

Youtube could probably give you a quick peek, KDE easy GUI Modification (no terminal needed) and I never was running into a single bug on my Rolling Release from this Layouts: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJzfaqRLfpY

Budgie and Cinnamon DE's has probably also good layouts.
XFCE, LXQt and Mate DE's are for older hardware or just less RAM hungry.

Debian(noob)/Red Hat(Soldier)/Arch(Veteran) and their Distro's:

To choose a Distro is another Story, it depends on the Hardware (age) and Packages (age) that are available. A Rolling Release gets always the newest Kernel Updates (Device Drivers) for better performance/newer Hardware but that's require little bit more time for maintaining the OS. The support for Official Repositories, Flatpaks, AUR, AppImages and Snap's shows the amount of Package's/Program's for your Distro.

The Package Manager (GUI) like Pamac for example take care of that Packages. You just search your Progam's name> select it>click on apply to let it install, after that it shows up in your Taskbar. You can activate additional support for Flat/Snap/AUR under properties, that's not activated as default.

Some Distro's just give more freedom then others, while Mint is good for unexperienced users and mainly for people who just want to quick running their games, browse, print and don't care about adjustments... it also has its limitations.

So when you choose a Distro, get aware how old the package are... specially for gaming performance the Arch Tree and the Distro's that are based on Arch is the Ultimate gaming goal but probably at least Manjaro is only recommend for beginner who is willing to learn more. Red Hat Distro's like Nobara are in the middle. Debian Distro's are older but more stable.

I think its fair to say that some Distro's from Debian/Red Hat/Arch doesn't always follow the Big Tree Agenda and wants to make something special. Its your choice to chose, same as buying a car.

Arch Vanilla is the hardest Distro in Linux, while Manjaro (Arch) protect the user's and delay (per default branch) for 1-3 Weeks the packages when there are still bugs around that can't be fixed at the moment, downside in this situation's. People who using "heavily" AUR Packages (AUR not activated per default) are running into problem's, because AUR Updates won't get delayed.

Youtube Streamer's don't like that idea about package delay and downvoted Manjaro while at the other hand, they are unaware (incompetent) that you can switch Manjaro Branches between Stable (default), testing & unstable. The last branch are recommend for heavily AUR usage. https://wiki.manjaro.org/index.php/Switching_Branches

Terminal:

Yes, a Terminal Window is sometimes needed for Linux and is a mighty tool, but you can reduce it to a bare minimum and a lot functions are there as a simple Graphics User Interface (GUI), the most Youtube beginner video's still fool people with information that they need to install/adjust all possible settings inside a Terminal, but in most situations its a lie. With a few mouse clicks the Package-Manager will install/remove or update "almost" everything at just one place.
KDE Partition Manager (or GParted) are visually more userfriendly as the integrated Windows11 Tools today!

Disable Bios Features:

Its recommend that you disable "Fast Boot" when using Linux, you probably run into issues sooner or later because of this feature.

Also Keep in mind, that the whole Arch Tree don't give official support for "Secure Boot". Deactivate "Secure Boot".

Win11 user's are forced to activate TPM/Secure Boot in Bios, while Win10 User's are free to chose, Microsoft wants to control the PC Boot and steal your local passwords with TPM Cloud storage. This has nothing to do with security its only advertising from Microsoft, its a hardware dongle from Microsoft and it gives Microsoft (not you) the security, so its a verification process and is designed against free and open source.

Pre-Install Tip, if you don't want to use Dual Boot on a Single Drive:

Disable your Windows Drive while installing Linux, you can do that in Bios and disable the SATA Ports or unplug the power connector from your drive's. This gives you 2 advantages, first you can't do a mistake with your partitions/files while you installing.

Second there is no connection between Linux/Windows. Keep in mind to do the same (vise versa) when you re-install Windows in future. Of course you can activate your Windows Drive after you done with the install.

Install with USB-Bootstick:

You can Download the Image (ISO) File from your chosen Distro, create a Bootstick with Ventoy,Rufus or Etcher (But Etcher has shady telemetry). What can be confusion, that you may see 2 times the same Linux Boot option shown in your Bios from your fresh created Bootstick.

One entry is for "Legacy BIOS also called CSM" Boot and the other is for "UEFI BIOS also called EFI" Boot. If you selected the wrong you will later see while installing on the drive a error, no big deal no dmg will happen... just try the other Boot-entry then and it should work.

Nvidia user's should use Nvidia Proprietary Driver:

The most Distro's has used per default the Free (reversed engineered) Nvidia driver called "Nouveau" while the driver is good for older GPU's like nvidia 1060-1080Ti (Pascal) and will doing a goodjob for normal Browsing/Media. https://nouveau.freedesktop.org/FeatureMatrix.html

It's not the first choice for gaming!!! Most Distro's has a simple UI to switch between this driver's. For Manjaro it is in Taskbar>Settings>Manjaro Settings Manager>Hardware Configuration.

Setup Linux Steam/Proton:

1.Steam should be Pre-installed in most distro's but it can easily added with your Visually Package Manager from your Distro. Search it/Select it and click apply, that's it. Steam looks 97% identical to the Windows Version.

2.Activate Proton in Steam: Open Top left Steam>Settings>Compatibility and choose Proton Experimental. Also activate the 2 Steam Play Switches! You only need a EXT4 Partition (instead NTFS) for maximum user experience and just install your games in your Steam Folder (default location is your Home Partition) or create a second library (same as in Windows to install on a second drive/another partition) more user friendliness isn't possible... In Steam its 1:1 the same feeling as under Windows. Around 80% of Steam Games works Plug & Play, the other's needs "maybe" a Steam launch command>Properties from your Steamgame and copy+paste it from ProtonDB Webpage, less then 3% of Steam Games will not run!

Wayland (NEW) vs X11 (old but still strong):

There is at the moment a big development change around the "Linux Display Server" inside the most DE's. Wayland will probably replace X11 over time and it will improve rendering performance.
AMD actually support Wayland better than Nvidia. While the most Program's still just working better under X11 right now, but this will change in future.

Its possible that you run into a Blackscreen with only a mouse cursor at the moment, when you using Nvidia. In KDE you can switch between X11 and Wayland at the bottom left of the Login Screen (SDDM).
From my viewpoint you may want to use Wayland for AMD GPU's and X11 for Nvidia, but it should be your choice. There is no right or wrong at this moment.

A little NTFS Warning just in case:

NTFS is a MS-Windows (emulated) Filesystem in Linux and could lead to data corruption, but "reading" files should be no problem. Better to mount it as Read-Only just in case. When you want to transfer data between MS-Windows and Linux use a (recommended) exFat Partition or Fat32.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

(Optional) Holding Hand's Install Linux Video Guide (Mint+Gaming):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyT4wfz5ZMg
(but with 4x critics from my side:)
1. Not telling about disabling Fast Boot
2. Using Balena "Etcher" has inbuilt Telemetrie, better is Ventoy.
3. Later he recommend to install Proton low level Kernel Anti Cheat Software
EAC or Battle-eye. This is against his own agenda to be against Kernel AC.
4. He failed with the explanation about the nvidia freedriver.

Win10 support end's at the end of 2025:

Older Hardware like (AMD) Zen1 or (Intel) Skylake don't have TPM and the newest Win11 Update 24H2 reject this system and bypassing is no longer allowed.

FPS Performance comparison Arch vs Win11:

https://www.computerbase.de/2023-12/welche-linux-distribution-zum-spielen/2/
(no need to watch part1 /its outdated):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g5r1KSmOVss

Personal Manjaro Experience:

I had my first time with Linux (Red Hat "Caldera") as i was 14 years old, i uninstalled it pretty quick because nothing was running and it was very complicated this was 1997 (around Diablo1 times) and i saw nothing what Linux would give me at this time.
Windows wasn't all this years no data harvester but this changed finally with Win10.

Linux has developed greatly in the past 23 years. (But the outdated Rumor's from Windows user's, that Linux sucks are still there.)

So i started my real journey with Linux around 2020 collecting information about the big 3 Linux Tree's (Debian, Arch and Redhat) and it was a close decision between Mint and Manjaro the big difference im a Tech Nerd (not a coder) and i don't mind to learn and maintain my system. You get stable release (Kernel) updates every 2-3 Weeks pretty easy to install in the Package Manager UI and sometimes there are .pacnew files (config files, in general only 5 per year) or little bugs to fix and its required to look in https://forum.manjaro.org/c/announcements/stable-updates/12 the Forum to fix them, won't take long and they are rare but even as bloody noob i could pretty quick handle it. It was like destroying the final boss in Doom and i was total happy to archive the first experience and fight the little bug for Super Earth and Democracy, and that i don't need a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ MS Developer to get the job done xD

When i use my PC/Laptop around 12hours per day, i only spend maybe 1-2min with the Terminal per week average, no big deal for a average use case. Linux in general has really awesome driver support, you would be surprised even to boot into a Linux live environment how instant your PC is running without doing anything at all.. my yaw dropped to the bottom as the first time i booted from my Manjaro KDE (Full ISO)USB Stick and opened the filebrowser (called dolphin) to watch 30sec later Star Trek Voyager per drag+drop from NTFS drive in VLC Player, in a Linux OS without even installing it WTF.

My printer was instant running also, the sames goes with many other devices, "almost" everything just works. My Creative Soundcard X-fi was running instant, but my new Creative Soundblaster AE-5 is another story and required Alsamixer but still it was working with Forum help and this super Linux Brains which reversed Engineered the creative driver for my AE-5 Soundcard holy crap... take this Duke Nukem 3D Boss yaaay :D

It took me 6month to learn the most advanced stuff around Linux (like FSTAB, GRUB, Alsamixer, Timeshift, Pacman and most used Terminal Commands), when i remember how many years i need to learn the most stuff from MS-DOS, Win3.11, Win95... to Windows10 the road had stones too.

Im 40years old now and i could do it to learn Linux, you can do it too.

DONATION:

Don't forget to Donate Money to the smaller Open Source Projects and don't play the greedy card, this social coders need to eat too and they have a Soul... not like this closed source Demons :D I donated the last 3 years around 400€ and split the money to around 12 Open Source Projects.

[GatoMancer]

İlk olarak D. Flame tarafından gönderildi:

But when it reaches out look for a Windows file, it doesn't exist, and does Linux let it escalate its privileges like Windows does?

No. It does not. The Linux security model on the kernel and other admin accesses is very strict.

[GatoMancer]

İlk olarak HighBall tarafından gönderildi:

Vulkan is like OpenGL

Actually, Vulkan IS OpenGL, its the next iteration of the tech.

[LongTimeAgo]

İlk olarak HighBall tarafından gönderildi:

It's really a great time to give Linux a spin. Everything is shockingly easy these days. Nvidia usually was a pain point for new users, but the open source driver as of a couple days ago is reported as, "ready for primetime." Soon that will end up in all the distros. I think is a huge win for Nvidia fans out there.

Helldivers 2 is running smooth as hell under Linux in case anybody was wondering that.

I've been trying Ubuntu for a week now and did some test runs with games.
My experience so far: Much better than I expected at first, but still a ton of work to make it work perfectly on a (gaming) laptop.
My specs are an i7-12700H, RTX3070Ti. Even though the system is 2 years old (as of 2 days ago), it's still 'too new' for certain stuff in Linux/Ubuntu.

Some stuff I encountered along the way:
- My interest was in trying Manjaro, but I had to opt for Ubuntu because of the Secure Boot/UEFI commitment with dual booting W11. (Yes there are ways around it, no I dont have enough experience or time to do so.)
- Ubuntu Install was just too damn easy. I was amazed with how smooth this went and how it picked up all 'drivers' and Lenovo Legion laptop settings + fn key functions in one go.
- The most tricky (and time consuming) part was getting the "Nvidia Optimus" to work properly. But somebody in the Linux community made its own "nvidia tool" which works... Somewhat well.
- The Nvidia driver that is automatically installed does not work.
- The Nvidia driver that is recommended/not-beta/tested is actually slightly too old for the RTX3070Ti (mobile).
- The Nvidia drivers that are newer, tested, but not recommended are not able to be installed, or when they work, provide a ton of issues.
- >sudo sudo sudo sudo sudo sudo sudo sudo sudo sudo sudo sudo sudo sudo sudo sudo. A lot of work needs to be done from the command line Terminal. There is a huuuge community that provides all the proper commands that basically do everything you need, but you need to find it (your exact problem/wish) first.
- As a thoroughbred and licensed Windows Engineer, I have gained a ton of respect for how Ubuntu is in some ways far superior and really well done.
- As a thoroughbred and licensed Windows Engineer, I am shocked with how much stuff (and mainly because of so much Terminal usage) feels like we're still in 1995 in Ubuntu.
- My first test game under Proton Experimental was trying out Trepang²: It works really damn well, but less FPS than under Windows. I expect this to be a Nvidia Driver issue.

TL;DR: All in all it took about 16(?) hours to get a properly functioning Ubuntu that is able to run games under Proton, via Steam, on an Nvidia + Intel laptop, that is still not perfect, But is close to it and fully customized (including a fully customized grub2 menu, that also took a few hours to understand).

I am genuinely suprised and I am loving how I need to figure out a ton of stuff. I also dont mind working from the Terminal, but a little more leeway and things to be done via the GUI would come a long way in helping new people also opt for Linux distro's.

I am planning on sorting out the SSD's on my PC and make a dedicated NTFS 1TB partition and a dedicated 1TB EXT4 partition on my 2TB SSD.

Hope my experience helps others' as well. Feel like I gained a ton of Linux experience simply by doing this on my own laptop.

[KenHasegawa]

Is it necessary to install Linux on a second hard drive or can I also work with partitions? Does AC still have access to my Windows system despite using Linux?

Does it run out of the box under linux or under Proton?

[MattyjRulz]

My experience getting Linux Mint game ready seemed pretty easy with good frame-rate results so far from my testing since Thursday. Just took me Thursday evening to get it all setup and ready for steam to run it's many updates on each game.

I dual booted from my main HDD so it's split between WIn11 and Linux.
I enabled nvidia-driver-525 (one version below the recommended) through the Driver Manager.
And I just had to make sure my games were on an ext4 partition before I could run them properly, so the nvidia driver downgrade may not have been necessary.

I'm on a desktop running an AMD CPU 5800X and nvidia 4070ti.

I enabled the fps counter from the steam overlay and was getting 70-90 fps in HD2, with graphics settings at max (motion blur = 0), and the render scale = quality.
- I'm using proton experimental.

The main difference from Windows is before launching a game it takes 30 secs - 1 min to prepare the vulkan shaders.

With grub I like to just set the following and leave the result default, so I have more than 10 seconds to choose what to boot into, and I can actually read the options on a 4k screen:
- GRUB_TIMEOUT=-1
- GRUB_GFXMODE=640x480

[HighBall]

İlk olarak KenHasegawa tarafından gönderildi:

Is it necessary to install Linux on a second hard drive or can I also work with partitions? Does AC still have access to my Windows system despite using Linux?

Does it run out of the box under linux or under Proton?

You can also work with partitions.
AC will not have access to your Windows system.
Under Proton, Steam will handle this for you. Enable the use of Proton in Steam from the settings->Compatability menu. From your Steam library, just select Helldivers 2, click install. Click play.

[LongTimeAgo]

İlk olarak KenHasegawa tarafından gönderildi:

Is it necessary to install Linux on a second hard drive or can I also work with partitions? Does AC still have access to my Windows system despite using Linux?

Does it run out of the box under linux or under Proton?

I did a shrink on C:\ my 1TB SSD that was Basically all for Windows, so that Windows now has 750GB and Ubuntu 250GB.

Just beware: Windows has the habit of putting the recovery files, Page file and Kernel logging at the end of the C:\ partition so shrinking is limited. You need to turn off all of those before you can shrink all of your free space. (You can turn them back on after you have shrinked/shrunk the partition)

After that though, Using Ubuntu installer via USB instantly recognizes the unused free space and makes it an EXT4 partition to install Ubuntu on. It also installs the Grub (2) bootloader so that you can choose what OS to start when starting your PC.

[Kobold]

İlk olarak MattyjRulz tarafından gönderildi:

My experience getting Linux Mint game ready seemed pretty easy with good frame-rate results so far from my testing since Thursday. Just took me Thursday evening to get it all setup and ready for steam to run it's many updates on each game.

I dual booted from my main HDD so it's split between WIn11 and Linux.

Since user LongTimeAgo is so in love with Ubuntu, because of his Secure Boot/TPM MS-Downgrade feature (sorry im hostile against M$, please forgive me) thats he wants so much... i wanted to ask you, if you have this 2 features also activated in BIOS and used now with Linux Mint? I would your Gaming Performance would be better under Mint as under Ubuntu.

Because with Mint you can freely choose the Kernels, at least as far as i know... please someone correct me when my information is wrong.

İlk olarak MattyjRulz tarafından gönderildi:

I'm on a desktop running an AMD CPU 5800X and nvidia 4070ti.

I enabled the fps counter from the steam overlay and was getting 70-90 fps in HD2, with graphics settings at max (motion blur = 0), and the render scale = quality.
- I'm using proton experimental.

And you can expect even better fps after time... Proton Experimental get regularly updates.

Its worth to wait 1-2 month to get really good performance support... there are not many games where you have more fps in Linux as under Windows. You can find good Youtube Linux (mangohud overlay) VS Windows (MSI Afterburner overlay) comparison Videos.

While under Windows, you can expect to get less and less performance (this excluded fps increase from the game developer patches of course), because of the additional spy telemetrie and windows don't care about gamers. It is the opposite when you gaming under Linux.

[LongTimeAgo]

İlk olarak Kobold tarafından gönderildi:

Since user LongTimeAgo is so in love with Ubuntu, because of his Secure Boot/TPM MS-Downgrade feature (sorry im hostile against M$, please forgive me) thats he wants so much...

It's not that I am "in love" with the feature, nor do "I want it so much"... At this point in time I find the hassle of completely reïnstalling and/or reconfiguring my Windows 11 setup a pointless endeavour that is easily solved by just going for a UEFI/secure boot signed Linux distro... So Ubuntu in this case.

With the added benefit that the distro itself has apparently one of the easiest care-free installs of most of the distro's, with plenty of help, tooling and more found in various places on the web.

In the future? Who knows, but you cant expect a Windows engineer, nor can you expect an average, or even an above-average user to completely to immediately take a deep dive in to another, sometimes even less supported, Linux distro, with their fragile, expensive and/or signed hardware. Thats just completely unreasonable, even though it's admirable if they did.

[HighBall]

İlk olarak Kobold tarafından gönderildi:

Because with Mint you can freely choose the Kernels, at least as far as i know... please someone correct me with my information is wrong.

You can get Mainline kernels[kernel.ubuntu.com] with Ubuntu as well. You can also get ppa's for various kernels.
I usually use LinuxTKG[github.com] to compile my own kernel. It's a script that will build an optimized gaming kernel for your CPU and add features that haven't made it to the Mainline Kernel yet. Same people that do WineTKG and ProtonTKG as well.

[Kobold]

İlk olarak LongTimeAgo tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Kobold tarafından gönderildi:

Since user LongTimeAgo is so in love with Ubuntu, because of his Secure Boot/TPM MS-Downgrade feature (sorry im hostile against M$, please forgive me) thats he wants so much...

... easily solved by just going for a UEFI/secure boot signed Linux distro... So Ubuntu in this case.

With the added benefit that the distro itself has apparently one of the easiest care-free installs of most of the distro's, with plenty of help, tooling and more found in various places on the web.

Please this is not true... there are many other distro's out there, with the same easy way to install as Ubuntu. And Ubuntu has it big issue... investigate around the Amazon Ubuntu Deal... Ubuntu has no longer good reputation for several years now and many people "no longer recommend" to use Ubuntu.

Just a little example video from this famous linux streamer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lr8iMnuW6aw

[LongTimeAgo]

İlk olarak Kobold tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak LongTimeAgo tarafından gönderildi:

... easily solved by just going for a UEFI/secure boot signed Linux distro... So Ubuntu in this case.

With the added benefit that the distro itself has apparently one of the easiest care-free installs of most of the distro's, with plenty of help, tooling and more found in various places on the web.

Please this is not true... there are many other distro's out there, with the same easy way to install as Ubuntu. And Ubuntu has it big issue... investigate around the Amazon Ubuntu Deal... Ubuntu has no longer good reputation for several years now and many people "no longer recommend" to use Ubuntu.

Just a little example video from this famous linux streamer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lr8iMnuW6aw

You are a treasure trove of Linux info.
I will have a look and see if switching is a good idea.
Thank you.

[LongTimeAgo]

I just completely wiped Ubuntu, installed Linux Mint (since it supports Secure boot as well) and wow. I think I am in love.
Still need to tinker a bit with the Nvidia Optimus settings (again), but I can use my Ubuntu experience on this seemlessly.

[ConnorTheCone]

Yeah, the game works perfect on LInux mint. I think that you only need to do tweaks if you plan to play the games that you have already installed on a windows partition.

The game has those white lines but i would not consider that a problem lol.

[LongTimeAgo]

İlk olarak ConnorTheCone tarafından gönderildi:

Yeah, the game works perfect on LInux mint. I think that you only need to do tweaks if you plan to play the games that you have already installed on a windows partition.

The game has those white lines but i would not consider that a problem lol.

Iḿ still waiting for the devs to remove nPGG before making the purchase. However, since the devs have taken a sort of "silent" route on the whole AC debacle, I'm preparing for a scenario where more (terrible) Kernel AC's are being added to games and I can just use a proper Linux distro for those, while leaving my W11 'safe and secure' for the other stuff.

However, with the advancement of Linux over the past couple of years... There is also a chance I will never touch W11 again. But thats still out of the question for now. ;)