Why does Diligence Counter Sniper feel terrible?

[Kyowyn]

Who's idea was it to make it so the scope moves so unresponsive? Like the rest of me is at 75+fps and the gun moves in 25fps.

[Drusus]

Originally posted by Slapstick:

The horrible handling is why I don't use it. I like snipers and would love to have it as a primary, but it feels like swimming in molasses.

So, i see this complaint about a number of weapons I like to use and it makes me wonder two things:

1. Does no one take a knee/flop down to shoot?
2. Does no one take advantage of the recoil/handling benefits of Combat Engineer armor to further advantage taking a knee/going prone?

I'm not saying this is for every situation, but things like the Counter Sniper (even the vocally maligned Adjudicator), perform far, FAR better by leveraging some of those tools.

I have gear i use to run and gun and gear I use to engage from position I find. But to each there own, always.

(Note: I still believe even with the above stated a number of guns/grenades are way out of whack for comparative utility and value. There are some pretty valid objective criticisms of many weapons, like the DMR category in general, that deserve recognition too. My point above is not to dismiss any/all of those points, just to say 'hey, if handling is your concern, have you tried....)

[Markus Reese]

Originally posted by Drusus:

Originally posted by Slapstick:

The horrible handling is why I don't use it. I like snipers and would love to have it as a primary, but it feels like swimming in molasses.

So, i see this complaint about a number of weapons I like to use and it makes me wonder two things:

1. Does no one take a knee/flop down to shoot?
2. Does no one take advantage of the recoil/handling benefits of Combat Engineer armor to further advantage taking a knee/going prone?

I'm not saying this is for every situation, but things like the Counter Sniper (even the vocally maligned Adjudicator), perform far, FAR better by leveraging some of those tools.

I have gear i use to run and gun and gear I use to engage from position I find. But to each there own, always.

(Note: I still believe even with the above stated a number of guns/grenades are way out of whack for comparative utility and value. There are some pretty valid objective criticisms of many weapons, like the DMR category in general, that deserve recognition too. My point above is not to dismiss any/all of those points, just to say 'hey, if handling is your concern, have you tried....)

Isnt about knee or prone. Counter sniper legit feels like moving in slow motion. Regular diligence is responsive. Dominator has punch and precision and moves nicer.

Counter sniper though is limited when viable. Even with the buff.

[Dakota]

Originally posted by Drusus:

Originally posted by Slapstick:

The horrible handling is why I don't use it. I like snipers and would love to have it as a primary, but it feels like swimming in molasses.

So, i see this complaint about a number of weapons I like to use and it makes me wonder two things:

1. Does no one take a knee/flop down to shoot?
2. Does no one take advantage of the recoil/handling benefits of Combat Engineer armor to further advantage taking a knee/going prone?

I'm not saying this is for every situation, but things like the Counter Sniper (even the vocally maligned Adjudicator), perform far, FAR better by leveraging some of those tools.

I have gear i use to run and gun and gear I use to engage from position I find. But to each there own, always.

(Note: I still believe even with the above stated a number of guns/grenades are way out of whack for comparative utility and value. There are some pretty valid objective criticisms of many weapons, like the DMR category in general, that deserve recognition too. My point above is not to dismiss any/all of those points, just to say 'hey, if handling is your concern, have you tried....)

Everyone does that, but they're still far worse than the other guns when they do that. The fact that you basically need to do that to be effective with them at all kinda goes to show how bad the handling on them is when other guns can be used on the move fine and then become absolute powerhouses when prone.

[abcd]

common issue with larger-caliber sniper rifles. bore diameter has a greater effect on overall mass distribution and 'pointability' than barrel length does.

[Rincewind]

Originally posted by Kyowyn:

Who's idea was it to make it so the scope moves so unresponsive? Like the rest of me is at 75+fps and the gun moves in 25fps.

Well i hate to say this but....its because it is ♥♥♥♥♥ TERRIBLE...

[abcd]

Originally posted by Rincewind:

Originally posted by Kyowyn:

Who's idea was it to make it so the scope moves so unresponsive? Like the rest of me is at 75+fps and the gun moves in 25fps.

Well i hate to say this but....its because it is ♥♥♥♥♥ TERRIBLE...

might also be a texture issue, ie a 'personal issue.'

[Dain_Ironfoot]

Because it is terrible and they went overboard with the sluggish movement of sniper weapons and stuff like the eruptor. It's just too extreme like you are wielding a giant HMG bigger than the support weapon HMG.

[ERROR1018]

Originally posted by Resyled:

all the DMRs need like 30 damage across the board to even make sense and the way the Counter Sniper has terrible Ergo or whatever really doesn't make any sense it should basically be identical to the normal one just having higher recoil and longer reset.

the Adjudicator does 80 damage and flies all over the place when you fire it with this really sluggish reset and it just feels kinda bad.. the DEFENDER SMG does 70 damage, definitely weighs less, and literally doesn't move an inch recoil wise... what is the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ Adjudicator chambered in????

you can literally use the DEFENDER SMG as a more effective weapon since you absolutely beam things in the weakpoint and it has a huge magazine. The Adjudicator doesn't even have consistent recoil it bounces everywhere so you can't even really control it with practice and get good at using FA to kill Devs faster in CQC.. it sucks so much. If I'm going to shoot things at 'DMR' range I'm not even going to bother using the Adjudicator, it's a terrible DMR and a terrible Assualt Rifle, it does nothing well.

This is a good summary of why DMRs are so, so awful right now. They are worse than a SMG in every way, when in reality those two weapons have purposes that are completely opposite.

The best DMR in the game is the Slugger. That's dumb.

[abcd]

I think the advantage is mainly that it has a scope and bullet drop that makes it usable at 150+m, whereas the defender is unlikely to hit a weakpoint at that range.

you can literally kill entire patrols before they get close enough to hit you.

most of this 'dmrs are bad' talk comes from people trying to argue it should be an autocannon.

[Imnuktam]

All the weapons in that category feel horrible in the same way. Cant stand a weapon where you move your crosshairs to the next target and it takes 2 seconds til it actually gets there-.

Makes them just feel swimmy, slow and useless, and I am not sure why any of the guns are like that in the name of balance.

Devs need to come out shooting with us when we go and see how fast you can actually target to target and get a shot off at 100-200 meters.

[abcd]

Originally posted by Imnuktam:

All the weapons in that category feel horrible in the same way. Cant stand a weapon where you move your crosshairs to the next target and it takes 2 seconds til it actually gets there-.

Makes them just feel swimmy, slow and useless, and I am not sure why any of the guns are like that in the name of balance.

Devs need to come out shooting with us when we go and see how fast you can actually target to target and get a shot off at 100-200 meters.

I think part of the issue is that helldviers aren't marksmen; they conform to the <70% accuracy spectrum of the average soldier.

the in-game rifles are much easier to shoot than a real one.

[Markus Reese]

Originally posted by Imnuktam:

All the weapons in that category feel horrible in the same way. Cant stand a weapon where you move your crosshairs to the next target and it takes 2 seconds til it actually gets there-.

Makes them just feel swimmy, slow and useless, and I am not sure why any of the guns are like that in the name of balance.

Devs need to come out shooting with us when we go and see how fast you can actually target to target and get a shot off at 100-200 meters.

This. I love your term 'swimmy'! Describes it so well. It really isn't a balance thing and goes beyond feeling like a weighty weapon.

I think it if had the feel of the default Diligence but kept the heavier recoil, it would be fine.

[Imnuktam]

Originally posted by abcd:

Originally posted by Imnuktam:

All the weapons in that category feel horrible in the same way. Cant stand a weapon where you move your crosshairs to the next target and it takes 2 seconds til it actually gets there-.

Makes them just feel swimmy, slow and useless, and I am not sure why any of the guns are like that in the name of balance.

Devs need to come out shooting with us when we go and see how fast you can actually target to target and get a shot off at 100-200 meters.

I think part of the issue is that helldviers aren't marksmen; they conform to the <70% accuracy spectrum of the average soldier.

the in-game rifles are much easier to shoot than a real one.

Depends on the gun. I could (and have) hand my scar 16s with E-otech HWS on it to someone who has never shot a gun, and in 15min teach them enough that they could put down a decent looking and quick 6" grouping at 100m.

[AoD_lexandro]

CS is a great weapon. If you have trouble with it, you are using it wrong and have yourself in a bad position. It's easy to 1-shot/2-shot bots from 100m+ range and move between them smoothly picking off targets, I do it all the time. You should be scoping with it almost exclusively to make sure you are getting accurate fire.

At anything shorter than 50m use your sidearm.

[acosnil]

Originally posted by Okazaki Naoki:

Consider it ergonomic problem.
Larger / longer rifle tend to have this issue.
Game design aspect.

There's absolutely no reason to use it over a Scorcher.