The Senator.

[rojogames371]

The Senator is a revolver, presumably chambered in 44. Magnum, as of now, it currently penetrates heavy armor.
The marksman rifles, the Diligence, CS Diligence, and the Constitution, are chambered (presumably) in:
The Diligence:
a similar caliber to the Liberator, 7.62x39, 5.45x45, 5.56x45, or 223.
The CS Diligence:
7.62x51 or 7.62x54R
The Constitution:
7.62x54R or 30-06.
ALL of these calibers have more firepower than 44. Magnum, especially when you're shooting said 44. Magnum out of a gun with a 7 inch barrel at best. They should all penetrate the same amount of armor, or more.
So, one of two things is true:
The marksman rifles are underpowered, OR,
the Senator is overpowered.

[big knee]

i think the senator is fairly powered, i just think the semi-auto rifles are underpowered, the reason to use them is high damage high precision low fire rate weapons but if they can't go through armour they have little purpose compared to assault rifles or shotguns

[Little Leo]

Thats some high level gun nut stuff your yapping about. balancing a weapons damage and penetration around the bullet and not the gun is a cool idea I wish more games did. if the game was in capable hands with a similar minded gun nut on the team it would be possible but this is arrowhead we're talking about.

[Straph]

Originally posted by rojogames371:

The Senator is a revolver, presumably chambered in 44. Magnum, as of now, it currently penetrates heavy armor.
The marksman rifles, the Diligence, CS Diligence, and the Constitution, are chambered (presumably) in:
The Diligence:
a similar caliber to the Liberator, 7.62x39, 5.45x45, 5.56x45, or 223.
The CS Diligence:
7.62x51 or 7.62x54R
The Constitution:
7.62x54R or 30-06.
ALL of these calibers have more firepower than 44. Magnum, especially when you're shooting said 44. Magnum out of a gun with a 7 inch barrel at best. They should all penetrate the same amount of armor, or more.
So, one of two things is true:
The marksman rifles are underpowered, OR,
the Senator is overpowered.

The Senator and the CS Diligence both do their jobs well when used as intended. The Senator is excellent as a close-range sidearm for dealing with heavily armored enemies, while the CS shines as a precision-based primary weapon for targeting weak spots at range. If you’re looking for something that hits hard and works at range, the AMR is an incredible option that fills that gap perfectly.

For those who haven’t tried it, combining all three—Senator, CS Diligence, and AMR—in your loadout can create a well-rounded toolkit for any dive. Pair this with light armor and a jetpack for mobility, and you’ve got a highly versatile setup that allows you to adapt to a variety of combat situations. The Senator handles close-range threats, the CS provides precision at medium range, and the AMR is your answer to long-range devastation.

That said, I agree that the CS Diligence could use a slight tweak to make it more competitive with its counterpart, especially considering its recoil. A small boost to its punch would make it feel more rewarding to use without overshadowing other weapons. It’s not far off from being perfectly balanced, and a quick adjustment from the devs could bring it up to par.

For me, these three weapons feel complementary, and when used together, they really highlight the variety and flexibility Helldivers 2 has to offer. Give this setup a try and see how it feels—let me know how it works for you!

[rojogames371]

Originally posted by Straph:

Originally posted by rojogames371:

The Senator is a revolver, presumably chambered in 44. Magnum, as of now, it currently penetrates heavy armor.
The marksman rifles, the Diligence, CS Diligence, and the Constitution, are chambered (presumably) in:
The Diligence:
a similar caliber to the Liberator, 7.62x39, 5.45x45, 5.56x45, or 223.
The CS Diligence:
7.62x51 or 7.62x54R
The Constitution:
7.62x54R or 30-06.
ALL of these calibers have more firepower than 44. Magnum, especially when you're shooting said 44. Magnum out of a gun with a 7 inch barrel at best. They should all penetrate the same amount of armor, or more.
So, one of two things is true:
The marksman rifles are underpowered, OR,
the Senator is overpowered.

The Senator and the CS Diligence both do their jobs well when used as intended. The Senator is excellent as a close-range sidearm for dealing with heavily armored enemies, while the CS shines as a precision-based primary weapon for targeting weak spots at range. If you’re looking for something that hits hard and works at range, the AMR is an incredible option that fills that gap perfectly.

For those who haven’t tried it, combining all three—Senator, CS Diligence, and AMR—in your loadout can create a well-rounded toolkit for any dive. Pair this with light armor and a jetpack for mobility, and you’ve got a highly versatile setup that allows you to adapt to a variety of combat situations. The Senator handles close-range threats, the CS provides precision at medium range, and the AMR is your answer to long-range devastation.

That said, I agree that the CS Diligence could use a slight tweak to make it more competitive with its counterpart, especially considering its recoil. A small boost to its punch would make it feel more rewarding to use without overshadowing other weapons. It’s not far off from being perfectly balanced, and a quick adjustment from the devs could bring it up to par.

For me, these three weapons feel complementary, and when used together, they really highlight the variety and flexibility Helldivers 2 has to offer. Give this setup a try and see how it feels—let me know how it works for you!

I have used the CS Diligence + Senator pair, and I can agree that it feels AMAZING.*
It just never made much sense that the Senator can punch a hole in a Hulk and a rifle with a longer barrel chambered in a bigger caliber can't.**
*One of my best games EVER was with that pair of weapons. I was hitting Devastator headshots from 70+ meters without even trying.
Though, regarding the jump pack, I currently have dive bound to space. What should I bind the jump pack to?
**To elaborate, the CS Diligence could even be chambered in 338. Lapua Magnum, and if the Senator is in 44. Magnum, and can punch a hole in a Hulk, the CS Diligence should be punching holes in Bile Titans and Factory Striders.

[Andy]

Not sure how anyone can use the Senator with those godawful ironsights on it

[Evilphd]

The rifles are under-powered. Marksman especially. The Senator is a good clean up weapon. You are going to waste a lot of time and ammo trying to take down a charger, but it is satisfying popping a heavily damaged Bile Titan's face.

[Enforcer]

Originally posted by rojogames371:

confession:
headshotting hulks with the senator is dope.
and the senator does entirely too much damage, or the rifles don't do enough, but i don't care, because it's dope.

Rifles are too weak. Rifles should do more than any SMG or pistol.

[rojogames371]

Originally posted by Andy:

Not sure how anyone can use the Senator with those godawful ironsights on it

It doesn't have iron sights. It has two awkward metal bits on it, one of which is a red dot sight.

[rojogames371]

Originally posted by Enforcer:

Originally posted by rojogames371:

confession:
headshotting hulks with the senator is dope.
and the senator does entirely too much damage, or the rifles don't do enough, but i don't care, because it's dope.

Rifles are too weak. Rifles should do more than any SMG or pistol.

Rifles are too weak, or SMGs and pistols are too strong, or a mix of both.
Part of the reason for that is Arrowhead is trying to make it so there is at least one viable reason to use every single weapon in the game...
They apparently didn't consider that some of the weapons are just bad.

[rojogames371]

Originally posted by Evilphd:

The rifles are under-powered. Marksman especially. The Senator is a good clean up weapon. You are going to waste a lot of time and ammo trying to take down a charger, but it is satisfying popping a heavily damaged Bile Titan's face.

Don't you need an anti-tank weapon for a Bile Titan?
The Senator only penetrates up to and including heavy armor.

[Horny Buggirl]

Originally posted by rojogames371:

Originally posted by Evilphd:

The rifles are under-powered. Marksman especially. The Senator is a good clean up weapon. You are going to waste a lot of time and ammo trying to take down a charger, but it is satisfying popping a heavily damaged Bile Titan's face.

Don't you need an anti-tank weapon for a Bile Titan?
The Senator only penetrates up to and including heavy armor.

Thats the neat thing with the senator...you dont. You can take a titan down. Takes a while but you can do it. Sadly there is no achievment for it =(

[JenkemHuffer6969]

Senator buff is strong but equally makes it fun to use, those last ditch dives on to your back emptying the chambers until what ever pounces you dies, are epic. Equally counter snipers are ♥♥♥♥ and need mega buffs to even be considered usable.

[John Helldiver]

Originally posted by rojogames371:

The Senator is a revolver, presumably chambered in 44. Magnum, as of now, it currently penetrates heavy armor.
The marksman rifles, the Diligence, CS Diligence, and the Constitution, are chambered (presumably) in:
The Diligence:
a similar caliber to the Liberator, 7.62x39, 5.45x45, 5.56x45, or 223.
The CS Diligence:
7.62x51 or 7.62x54R
The Constitution:
7.62x54R or 30-06.
ALL of these calibers have more firepower than 44. Magnum, especially when you're shooting said 44. Magnum out of a gun with a 7 inch barrel at best. They should all penetrate the same amount of armor, or more.
So, one of two things is true:
The marksman rifles are underpowered, OR,
the Senator is overpowered.

people like you from the armory chat saying stuff is op is why the game failed before if i see you in game your getting shot for treason and ill remember your name

[Kyrth]

The senator should not be nerfed.

Heavy AP should be the norm for any weapon that currently has Med AP
(except for the revolver obvs)
Med AP should be the norm for any weapon that has Light AP

[Sleepy_Walker]

Originally posted by Little Leo:

Thats some high level gun nut stuff your yapping about. balancing a weapons damage and penetration around the bullet and not the gun is a cool idea I wish more games did. if the game was in capable hands with a similar minded gun nut on the team it would be possible but this is arrowhead we're talking about.

Actually every weapon in the game has a projectile call-out to an actual cartridge size and a lot of the pre-buffdivers patch was fairly closely keeping these projectiles in balance with each other in a way which was similar to real life. Not saying it was perfect, but the shotgun using bird shot was actually firing something as useless as bird shot in-game for a bit.

I would say blaming AH for not being gun-nutty enough is wrong. More like they started out that way and were crushed into conforming to various game realities, industry standards (doesn't make them good), and social tropes. The good thing is they are still hanging onto the gun/military core they started out with, just some bits have been more gamified than others.