anyone feel that sickle might not get any buff?

[EvilZombie]

i know its already good but i just wonder thats all

[Chaosolous]

What does it need buffed?

It's a very solid choice already.

[LoveTruffle]

Didn't it get a better zoom? It's in a really balanced state. The only planets they're not great on are hot planets with how fast they overheat on them.

[𝔐𝔞𝔩]

If its already good, then why buff it?

[PVT.Blueberry]

it got nerfed ages ago in ammo capacity, its a decent pick still.

[Cereen]

Originally posted by LoveTruffle:

Didn't it get a better zoom? It's in a really balanced state. The only planets they're not great on are hot planets with how fast they overheat on them.

That was the Scythe, and the zoom function doesn't work at all.

[Huevote]

Originally posted by EvilZombie:

i know its already good but i just wonder thats all

It's the best primary weapon in the game for bugs and a solid choice for bots, although I would like to see it's magazine nerf reverted and a laser sight.
SICKLE GANG

[Parker9044]

I would actually like to see it get medium pen and lower the damage. There's too many gear checks for LAP weapons.

[LoveTruffle]

Originally posted by not_cara:

Originally posted by LoveTruffle:

Didn't it get a better zoom? It's in a really balanced state. The only planets they're not great on are hot planets with how fast they overheat on them.

That was the Scythe, and the zoom function doesn't work at all.

Still, sickle works great.

[Parker9044]

Buff:

-Add MAP (Medium-Armor-Penetrating).
-Add +2 Mags (5 Heatsinks total).
-increase ROF (Damage at least 5 ticks A second)
-Increase Accuracy/recoil control.
-Increased Stagger.
-Increased Damage (100, "Think tiny plasma shots that bore through enemies").

Nerf:

-Remove/Reduce Incendiary effect. (what little fire damage it has, will be a break point for 'most' medium Bots/Bugs)
-increase heat build up (Less overall firing time, more reloading heat sinks!).
-Reduce Projectile velocity by 15%

Overall Effect:

5 ticks X 100 damage = 500 damage a sec. 4000 damage, for an 8 second heat sink.

This is comparable to the 275 of the Dominator, which is a MAP weapon. It has 15 rounds.

15 X 275 = 4125 Damage per magazine.

"Balanced, as all things should be" - Arrow Head Studios

[Parker9044]

Originally posted by Sotanaht:

The Sickle is already the strongest Light armor piercing primary weapon. The problem is it's light armor piercing. No amount of buffs will make it worth bringing over a medium weapon without increasing it to medium AP.

So basically they would need to make Light AP desirable, without invalidating Medium AP in the process. That seems like a very difficult thing to pull off.

They should have redesigned armor tiers like this.

Hell Divers 2 Armor Redesign

Levels 0-10.

Each Level has 100 durability.

Light

Levels 1-3

Light armor Weapons will do 100% damage at 1, 75% at 2 and 50% at 3.

Medium and Heavy will instantly break the armor as if it wasn't there.

Medium

Levels 4-7

Light armor weapons will do 25% damage at 4, 15% at 5, and 10% at 6.

Medium armor weapons will follow lights pen vs light armor. (100% damage at 4, 75% at 5 and 50% at 6.)

Heavy armor weapons will get a 100% health pool damage increase, against all lesser tiers.

Heavy

Levels 8-10

Light armor Weapons will do 5% at 8, and bounce off anything higher.

Medium armor weapons will do 25% at 8, 15% at 9, and 5% at 10.

Heavy armor weapons (Explosive) will reduce armor effectiveness by 3 tiers if it doesn't break.

Non-Explosive Heavy will penetrate and deal 75% at 8, 50% at 9 and 25% at 10%.

Enemy Armor Design Philosophy

Armor should be given the highest priority near 'weak-points' such as surrounding the head or chest. Limbs should always be Light to Medium.

Heavy enemies should have a light spot that has a huge health pool, but should still be able to be killed with LAP's or under-effective weapons, albeit time consuming.

Agree or Disagree and why?

[Chaos]

I rather have a rework that turn it into actual Sickle from HD 1.

Very high accuracy.
Very low recoil.
High damage.
High "weakspot" (I guess it go by durable damage these day?) multiplier.
Medium fire rate.
Medium heatsink cap (still 3 ice max tho)

No this stalwart but laser things.

[Sotanaht]

Originally posted by Chaos:

I rather have a rework that turn it into actual Sickle from HD 1.

Very high accuracy.
Very low recoil.
High damage.
High "weakspot" (I guess it go by durable damage these day?) multiplier.
Medium fire rate.
Medium heatsink cap (still 3 ice max tho)

No this stalwart but laser things.

HD2 doesn't really have a mechanic they could use to give weapons increased "weakspot" damage. Enemies have a variety of damage zones which may be weaker or stronger than the "main", but none of them are specifically tagged as a weakspot. Where most games would have headshots do 2x damage, HD2 gives the head 1/2 HP. But also the legs have their own HP, the butt has HP, the arms and armor plates have HP. There's no universal "weakspot" mechanic for a weapon to exploit.

In order to give a weapon high weakspot damage they would have to manually add a "weakpoint" tag to every single relevant enemy just for that weapon. Which honestly doesn't sound like that much work when I think about it but it's definitely more than they are likely willing to do.

Durable damage is what happens when you hit something with the same Armor rating as your weapon's Armor Penetration. Completely unrelated system. They could make a weapon that did 100% of its normal damage as durable damage, and that would definitely be unique (basically it would function as if it were 1 AP higher than it actually is against enemies it can already damage, except that it can't damage enemies with 1 more armor, so it's an all-or-nothing gun). That wouldn't really do what you want though.

[Parker9044]

Originally posted by Sotanaht:

Originally posted by Chaos:

I rather have a rework that turn it into actual Sickle from HD 1.

Very high accuracy.
Very low recoil.
High damage.
High "weakspot" (I guess it go by durable damage these day?) multiplier.
Medium fire rate.
Medium heatsink cap (still 3 ice max tho)

No this stalwart but laser things.

HD2 doesn't really have a mechanic they could use to give weapons increased "weakspot" damage. Enemies have a variety of damage zones which may be weaker or stronger than the "main", but none of them are specifically tagged as a weakspot. Where most games would have headshots do 2x damage, HD2 gives the head 1/2 HP. But also the legs have their own HP, the butt has HP, the arms and armor plates have HP. There's no universal "weakspot" mechanic for a weapon to exploit.

In order to give a weapon high weakspot damage they would have to manually add a "weakpoint" tag to every single relevant enemy just for that weapon. Which honestly doesn't sound like that much work when I think about it but it's definitely more than they are likely willing to do.

That explains why the laser support weapon is hot trash.

[Omoe]

Originally posted by Chaos:

I rather have a rework that turn it into actual Sickle from HD 1.

This would be really nice honestly, I was thrown off when I pulled the trigger on the HD2 iteration only to discover it's got a spool-up and a delay before it cools-down.
HD1's sickle had high burst damage in exchange for high heat generation per shot, which encouraged controlled bursts rather than panic-firing, so I'd like to actually see that rather than this weird laser LMG - don't get me wrong I like it, but I'd prefer it if it wasn't wearing the face of another gun.
Remove the weird spool-up so it fires like a conventional rifle, reduce the cool-down delay (I wouldn't actually want it removed, HD1's sickle (and by extension all laser weapons) would cool down immediately the moment you released the trigger, so you could just ignore the heat mechanic by just tapping the trigger super fast, which was a bit silly), and reduce heatsink size enough to make people pay attention to heat management, and reduce that spread (why does a laser rifle have spread?). Do those and then I'd consider it worthy to bear the Sickle's title.
I mean, the description even says it's designed to fire 'in short bursts', so make it do that, rather than have an LMG pretending to be a rifle. I get the feeling the team behind item descriptions and the team behind weapon design weren't quite on the same page here.

[Sotanaht]

Originally posted by Red Jack:

Originally posted by Sotanaht:

HD2 doesn't really have a mechanic they could use to give weapons increased "weakspot" damage. Enemies have a variety of damage zones which may be weaker or stronger than the "main", but none of them are specifically tagged as a weakspot. Where most games would have headshots do 2x damage, HD2 gives the head 1/2 HP. But also the legs have their own HP, the butt has HP, the arms and armor plates have HP. There's no universal "weakspot" mechanic for a weapon to exploit.

In order to give a weapon high weakspot damage they would have to manually add a "weakpoint" tag to every single relevant enemy just for that weapon. Which honestly doesn't sound like that much work when I think about it but it's definitely more than they are likely willing to do.

That explains why the laser support weapon is hot trash.

No, the laser cannon just has really low damage. 350/200(durable) damage per continuous second (and another 50 fire). Compare to the HMG which does 150/35 damage per bullet, but it can fire WAY more than 1 bullet per second. At the max fire rate, that 35 damage per bullet comes out to 437.5 damage per second, more than double the durable damage of the laser, and against armor 3 it's doing 1875 damage per second compared to 350 for the laser.