Revolver has heavy pen, cool, but why can't some primary too?

[Trig_Zero]

i think the Dominator could use it
"Jet powered projectile" sure sounds it hit hard, but not as hard as the revolver as far as i can see
and the ammo casing size is definitely bigger than the revolver's

[Wutever]

Escrito originalmente por Trig_Zero:

Escrito originalmente por Wutever:

The only reason Senator having AP4 is somewhat acceptable balance wise is because it has below-average accuracy, mediocre DPS, low ammo per reload, slow reloads and limited ammo capacity in general. Giving a primary AP4 without it being a flamethrower or other weapon with significant downsides would be extreme powercreep.

fair point
but how about the primaries with low ammo, slow reload, and less than ideal accuracy when at medium range?
i can think of a couple already

Only one would be the Slugger, and it makes no sense to have an AP4 shotgun.

No to mention that it has an infinite magazine size and 76 slugs total. That's not exactly restrictive.

Dominator has extremely high DPS and the reload is not slow if you reload before empty.

[Tezcatli]

Escrito originalmente por Trig_Zero:

Escrito originalmente por Tezcatli:

Because other guns with heavy penetration would be too strong. Though I feel a case can be made for the slugger. But they'd need to lower the damage to compensate while giving it a niche.

why does it have to be a niche tho
irl guns with more penetration usually just means it does more damage
of course, reality can vary depending on how the projectile becomes after going through armor but we don't have those
not to mention irl we have many different types of ammo made of different material that allows them to perform the way they're designed, if we can have that, i'd not complain too

This isn't IRL. it's a video game. They have to create a niche for each weapon. So that there's a reason to use it over other weapons. And with them adding another shotgun, one with swappable ammo. The Slugger could use something to make it distinct, but not overpowered.

[Little Leo]

Escrito originalmente por unless specifically stated:

I feel like the Eruptor could use ammo toggle to switch to heavy pen ammo but with no shrapnel.

I hope the programmable ammo feature isn't a one off thing and they do more with it in the future.

[Trig_Zero]

Escrito originalmente por Tezcatli:

This isn't IRL. it's a video game. They have to create a niche for each weapon. So that there's a reason to use it over other weapons. And with them adding another shotgun, one with swappable ammo. The Slugger could use something to make it distinct, but not overpowered.

tbf its the devs who kept saying they wanted realism in the game
at least they stopped when escalation of freedom happened back then

[Inardesco]

Escrito originalmente por Trig_Zero:

i think the Dominator could use it
"Jet powered projectile" sure sounds it hit hard, but not as hard as the revolver as far as i can see
and the ammo casing size is definitely bigger than the revolver's

Given that Railgun only has medium pen on safe charge, it makes 0 sense for Dominator to get it, when the railgun hasn't.

[黒人]

To answer your question:

The sweatdivers will not allow it. They hate fun.

[Wutever]

Escrito originalmente por zidj:

Escrito originalmente por darkblade:

the dominator is still one of the best weapons for the bots, the AMR would have less AP then the dominator then, like wtf.

The AMR is AP4. Refresher on AP4 weapons:
- Autocannon
- Laser Cannon
- Antimateriel Rifle
- Heavy Machine Gun

& Even if dominator was AP4, it deals 275/90 durable vs AMR's 450/180 durable damage.

With twice the mag capacity, twice the total ammo capacity and you spawn with it when you die. And, unlike the AMR, it has heavy stagger. Despite all that it still has more than 1k DPS. Something many AP2 primaries can only dream of.

Fell in a hole with the AMR? Too bad, that's gonna be up to 10minutes of you not having a role-defining gun. Fell in a hole with the AP4 Dominator? FREE SUPPLY BOX, YIPPEE.

Yeah, that's definitely not severe power creep...

[voces junior]

Eruptor with a AP4 programmable ammo

[Midnight]

Cause the design philosophy of sidearms so far is them having a specific but limited utility.

AP4 gun? Great utility to have. The limit? 6 shots total, 40 spare and a slow reload. Gives the gun a great niche.

Dominator already has a niche, is much less limited and giving it AP4 is just power creeping it closer to a boring do-everything gun. Mind you that giving it AP4 would also double its damage on everything AP3. So you're also asking for 100% damage buff on all targets it's already great at killing.

[Konnor1224]

LETS JUST MAKE EVERY GUN KILL EVERYTHING! WHY EVEN MAKE THE GAME CHALLENGING AT ALLL...... i cant stand these people....

[Little Leo]

Escrito originalmente por Konnor1224:

LETS JUST MAKE EVERY GUN KILL EVERYTHING! WHY EVEN MAKE THE GAME CHALLENGING AT ALLL...... i cant stand these people....

No jester for you. this is one of the most civil discussions I've seen in this cesspit.

[Underfell Sans]

Escrito originalmente por Frost Spectre:

Dominator would make sense to have that, the Gyrojet bullets are slower than other guns bullets.

Maybe even Slugger needs that buff, since we're getting new Medium Penetration shotgun as far as I know that shoots bunch of flechettes that are said to penetrate armor, which would imply Medium AP, as Light AP is technically no AP.

reduce the mag cap by half and add heavy pen. boom done

[Blackout Blake]

The dominator is a literal Bolt Rifle in the Helldivers universe. It would make sense to give it some pretty decent armor pen since it is one of the slower and bulkier weapons. AMR has precision and rewards a skilled hand, Dominator is more of an explosive weapon for breaking armor and enemies in two.

[voidCaster]

Escrito originalmente por Konnor1224:

LETS JUST MAKE EVERY GUN KILL EVERYTHING! WHY EVEN MAKE THE GAME CHALLENGING AT ALLL...... i cant stand these people....

Every gun should be able to damage OPEN VENTS and EXPOSED JOINTS and GLOWING SOFT UNDERBELLIES. Giving enemy units a "weak point" with an armor rating is dumber than what you just puked up on the forum here.

[Wulfen]

I know we had this big ol' stink about weapon balance, but i believe giving heavy armor pen to a primary would throw the entire primary/support weapon/stratagem balance out of whack.

The balance of weapons right now feels really good. I don't think this game should become a "primary weapon for literally everything" kind of game by introducing heavy armor pen to them