New warbond will delete grenade launcher with that pistol

[Mikail]

Why should I even use grenade launcher?
This will only take 1 usefull slot, its kinda game changer for solo running scouts.

That granade pistol is overpowered.

Edit:
Sorry about your toy, but GL is tool to clear holes not for fighting at general.
GP - Does not take slot in your loadout, its not for fighting its tool like GL - It will destroy holes same way and it will save your modified grenades.

GL - Will take slot, grenades will bounce of enemies, it will destroy holes same way.

Why would you still take GL on holes? You need 80 grenades to clear 1 nest?

Now you getting knife to cut cake, why would you still use chainsaw to cut cake?

[Mikail]

Originally posted by Kalas Hydra:

Originally posted by Mikail:

I guess, for me its only tool to destroy holes.

the quasar canon can destroy holes ,the autocanon as well . the gl is really good at destroying holes but for me its disapointing that it doesnt have good enought armor penetration (inefective vs chargers and other enemies with heavy armor)
also the new weapons will be slow because they are 1 shot reload type guns (the crosbow looksl ike it can shoot multiple times in a row though)

These all are support weapons, not secondary.

[Buntkreuz]

Originally posted by Mikail:

Originally posted by Buntkreuz:

Yeah but your take was that the pistol replaces the grenade launcher, it doesnt.
And you now move the goalposts, thats weak.

Sure theres possibly a better choice than the grenade launcher (not really, as it depends), but Meta?
Dude i run MG and Supply Pack on HD(9) without any issues.
Following the meta i could pick "better" weapons, but theres not really a meta, especially not with two factions that need drastically different loadouts.
I love Gas on Bugs, its incredible.
Its even solid against Bots but i like my Strafing Run more because its more fun.

Wannabe experts on the forum want to keep their wannabe expertism i guess.
Feel free to feel like the Arc replacing the Grenade Launcher, but why would a totally different weapon slot (secondaries) replace a support weapon?

You realize you can just throw a grenade into a vent, right?
Does your "increased throwing range" now replace the grenade pistol?
Obviously not.

Or could you become the games best nest eradicator by bringing a throwing range armor, grenade pistol and a grenade launcher to a mission and just blow up everything?
You think in a category of what weapon replaces another, i think in a category of what weapon accomplishes another.
You get much further and have fun with the latter way of thinking.
Your small scaled "meta" attitude is not only false, its making the game far more restrictive for yourself.

Thats why anyone joining my lobby can bring whatever he/she wants.
And somehow we often bring supposed "underdog trash" like Napalm or Gas Strike and not only have fun, but also succeed on HD9.
But we dont play Meta, so how does that work?
A friend of mine is level 12 and only brings the starter MG and EAT, eagle and drone and still wrecks Diff.9.
Apparently "it just works".

The only difference between my MG loadout in Diff.9 and another persons Qasar loadout in Diff.9 is that i spend 6k shots during a mission but also kill the most enemies, while the other dude spends 180 shots and kills half as many.
But we both serve different roles.
I rely on him to do a few good shots on dropships and killing blows on tanks.
I deal with the entire rest.
Sounds like a good synergy. We dont replace each other.
He would be swarmed without me and i would face too many armored enemies without him.
I love when people bring a grenade launcher to clear waves (especially Scout Striders), but they should stay away from me.

Not reading manifesto, like i said.

Stay ignorant then. You are on aforum. Avoid any areas with text if you are that lazy.

[Mikail]

Originally posted by Buntkreuz:

Originally posted by Mikail:

Not reading manifesto, like i said.

Stay ignorant then. You are on aforum. Avoid any areas with text if you are that lazy.

I dont care about nonsence, use normal arguments not manifestos.

[Siodog]

Whatever Autocannon still best at everything

[Voodoochile]

Originally posted by 𝒞𝒶𝓈𝓊𝒶𝓁 Sinner:

It's a singleshot pistol vs an actual grenade launcher. I think I can see which one wins in the majority of engagements.

What do you even use the GL apart from closing bug holes & eggs? Why do you think the GP will do these jobs significantly worse to be worth it losing a support weapon for a GL instead? No mater how much worse it would be, it's literally going to be the ONLY usable secondary and if it can even do 10% of the job the GL was doing, no1 will pick the GL ever again, instead of rocking EATs or Quasar on his back

[Majorita]

Also, I can actually succinctly sum up that guy's entire argument. It's hard to argue because there's nothing to it, he said:

Originally posted by Buntkreuz:

I like the MG & Supply Pack on top difficulty.

I prefer picking 'non-meta' weapons & stratagems.

Maybe instead of thinking of pistol as replacing grenade launcher, think of it as complementing the grenade launcher because you could become ultimate destroyer of bug holes + factories with BOTH pistol and grenade launcher.

Now, this is fair. But, this doesn't really have anything to do with what we're talking about.

We're only talking about how the Grenade Launcher's role as the destroyer of objectives is possibly about to be superseded by a secondary anyone can carry.

Argue THAT point, please.

[CptVodka]

On the flipside.. you can take care of objectives without even sacrificing your secondary slot. They're called grenades.
Some armors get 6 of them.

I doubt the pistol launcher will have a very high amount of grenades and you need to reload between each of them. Considering you can chuck 4 grenades by hand, or even more of them with a launcher in like.. a second, closing just as many holes/factories if you've got the accuracy.

It simply won't fill the same role.

Also, the secondary slot is pretty important to me.
I run with an AT setup. Liberator Penetrator for the medium armor enemies, Recoilless for heavies and i really like my secondary machine pistol to deal with anything unarmored. The liberator penetrator struggles with high amounts of spread out hunters for example. Perfect use for the machine pistol, and likely a horrible use for the pistol launcher.

Originally posted by Queltis:

Originally posted by Mikail:

there is no point use granade launcher for fights, ammo just bounce of enemies

If you're bouncing grenades off of enemies it's because you're aiming it like a standard hand cannon instead of using it to ground skid or lob grenades into packs.

I haven't used the launcher much tbh.. But if i'm not mistaken, isn't there an R-setting for impact vs fused grenades? I think i overheard someone talking about that once

[Mikail]

Originally posted by Majorita:

Also, I can actually succinctly sum up that guy's entire argument. It's hard to argue because there's nothing to it, he said:

Originally posted by Buntkreuz:

I like the MG & Supply Pack on top difficulty.

I prefer picking 'non-meta' weapons & stratagems.

Maybe instead of thinking of pistol as replacing grenade launcher, think of it as complementing the grenade launcher because you could become ultimate destroyer of bug holes + factories with BOTH pistol and grenade launcher.

Now, this is fair. But, this doesn't really have anything to do with what we're talking about.

We're only talking about how the Grenade Launcher's role as the destroyer of objectives is possibly about to be superseded by a secondary anyone can carry.

Argue THAT point, please.

Ye, but topic is not about meta weapon, he just posting his manifesto to play nonmeta for no reason.

[Mikail]

Originally posted by CptVodka:

On the flipside.. you can take care of objectives without even sacrificing your secondary slot. They're called grenades.
Some armors get 6 of them.

I doubt the pistol launcher will have a very high amount of grenades and you need to reload between each of them. Considering you can chuck 4 grenades by hand, or even more of them with a launcher in like.. a second, closing just as many holes/factories if you've got the accuracy.

It simply won't fill the same role.

Also, the secondary slot is pretty important to me.
I run with an AT setup. Liberator Penetrator for the medium armor enemies, Recoilless for heavies and i really like my secondary machine pistol to deal with anything unarmored. The liberator penetrator struggles with high amounts of spread out hunters for example. Perfect use for the machine pistol, and likely a horrible use for the pistol launcher.

Originally posted by Queltis:

If you're bouncing grenades off of enemies it's because you're aiming it like a standard hand cannon instead of using it to ground skid or lob grenades into packs.

I haven't used the launcher much tbh.. But if i'm not mistaken, isn't there an R-setting for impact vs fused grenades? I think i overheard someone talking about that once

Ye, but now you can clear even biggest nests solo kinda ez, its so much better for scouts who running around map and clearing spots, so now you can do these and dont need your team behind your as.

[M200Chan]

Originally posted by Metalshock:

Crowd clearing weapons are; The Stalwart, the Machine gun, the Heavy Machine gun, the Flame Thrower, and the Grenade launcher. For the sake of arguing of when you would bring it, let's limit the conversation to those.

The Stalwart has a mobile reload, and the largest mag out of them, at 250. But it's only light armor pen and has a large time to kill, so it's practically useless even against Automaton infantry as even they have parts of medium armor classification. against bugs it's much better at clearing out the large crowds of smaller enemies, but the longer time to kill can cause problems some people would rather avoid.

The Machine gun has a decent sized mag at 150, and medium armor pen. The downsides are a stationary reload that doesn't allow for retreating, and a low amount of ammo in the reserve. It's great for providing support fire and dealing with both bots and bugs, even up to devastators and Hive guards. unfortunately for it, the stationary reload is the deal breaker for many Helldivers.

The Heavy Machine Gun is... not in a good place, but let's look at this objectively. It has a large amount of Armor Pen, and a short time to kill. The cons are the smallest magazine, sitting at 75, and an unreasonably large amount of recoil. It can kill even a Hulk, reportedly, rather quickly, but the small mag and the recoil is what makes some Helldivers move away from it.

The Flamethrower sits roughly in the middle for the amount of "Fuel" it has, and with the recent fire buffs, it does decent damage to anything within range. The range, however, is the biggest problem. You should not bring this against Automatons, because you will be shot dead long before you get into range. Against the bugs, however, it functions a lot better. Reasons Helldivers might dislike it include a bit of a "wind up" as the fuel initially ignites, and the tendency towards self damage, especially if you light up a target actively jumping at you.

The Grenade Launcher has a decent magazine size, explosive rounds means a single shot can kill a group of enemies, and at a considerable range if the user has an understanding of the Grenade's arch. The downside is the minimum range, as hitting a target within a certain proximity can kill the user, and the fact that the grenades bounce off heavy armor means the Helldiver needs to be careful to not accidentally hit allies nearby, or even themselves.

It's all about perspective, understanding the weapon, and knowing when and where to use it. No weapon is "only for base clearing", nor are they "entirely useless". It depends on both what you feel comfortable with using, and what the squad needs as a whole.

Very helpful write-up. While I'm a bots-only kind of guy (I hate fighting bugs so, so much) it's good to know that flamethrower is actually good against them - I've tried it against bots and it wasn't good enough.

[OKMB]

Do we even have publicly available stats for this weapon yet? How can we even compare the functionality of an unreleased weapon versus one we already have?

Wait for it to come out, then pick up your pitchfork if its a problem. Until then, all you can do is speculate and that is not going to help anyone.

[Mikail]

Originally posted by OKMB:

Do we even have publicly available stats for this weapon yet? How can we even compare the functionality of an unreleased weapon versus one we already have?

Wait for it to come out, then pick up your pitchfork if its a problem. Until then, all you can do is speculate and that is not going to help anyone.

Its grenade, it destroy hole why u need stats for this.

[OKMB]

Originally posted by Mikail:

Originally posted by OKMB:

Do we even have publicly available stats for this weapon yet? How can we even compare the functionality of an unreleased weapon versus one we already have?

Wait for it to come out, then pick up your pitchfork if its a problem. Until then, all you can do is speculate and that is not going to help anyone.

Its grenade, it destroy hole why u need stats for this.

Because there's a lot that goes into the difference between the Grenade Launcher, Grenade Pistol (unreleased) and other ways that can also clear holes - people forget that Grenades (anything that does damage), Eagle Explosives (Airstrike, 110mm pods, 500kg bomb, etcetera), Barrages, and a number of other call down weapons (like EATs, on 1:00 cool down with two dropping per pod) that can all do the same.

[Mikail]

Originally posted by OKMB:

Originally posted by Mikail:

Its grenade, it destroy hole why u need stats for this.

Because there's a lot that goes into the difference between the Grenade Launcher, Grenade Pistol (unreleased) and other ways that can also clear holes - people forget that Grenades (anything that does damage), Eagle Explosives (Airstrike, 110mm pods, 500kg bomb, etcetera), Barrages, and a number of other call down weapons (like EATs, on 1:00 cool down with two dropping per pod) that can all do the same.

Ye, all of this taking slot, secondary pistol does not.

[OKMB]

Originally posted by Mikail:

Originally posted by OKMB:

Because there's a lot that goes into the difference between the Grenade Launcher, Grenade Pistol (unreleased) and other ways that can also clear holes - people forget that Grenades (anything that does damage), Eagle Explosives (Airstrike, 110mm pods, 500kg bomb, etcetera), Barrages, and a number of other call down weapons (like EATs, on 1:00 cool down with two dropping per pod) that can all do the same.

Ye, all of this taking slot, secondary pistol does not.

Yes, and there's more that goes into the discussion as to whether it's advisable to take a secondary weapon that,

Does splash damage,
Has a single shot,
Has a (presumably) low total ammo count,
Has a seemingly slow reload

Whereas the Dagger has a Battery, Redeemer is good for instant "get away from me," Peacemaker is viable for singleshot accuracy, and all can be used at close range, with more shots, and a decent ammo capacity.

Let me put it like this - if I'm using something like the Diligence Countersniper, I'm going to want the Redeemer or Peacemaker for close-range, and not the GP. If I'm running a close-range Shotgun as my primary, I'll want the Peacemaker, Redeemer or Dagger. If I'm running mid-range (most ARs), then I would want the GP. It's also dependent on what my 3rd weapon is, and if it's explosive (like the EAT) then I wouldn't want the GP.