Whose fun 6 max mags on sickle was ruining?

[Mister Sir]

While the title is not serious, the question it brings up is. I hardly ever even need to reload on sickle but still, it looks like with every patch devs just can't help themselves but lower the amount of fun someone can be having.

Whats fun is shooting hordes of enemies, not running around looking for ammo for the guns that take more than a mag to even kill certain targets.

I am well aware how balancing can be a tricky thing to do and I do appreciate the fixes that they give us, such as explosions not pulling you in but then things like slugger happen, which just leaves you asking.... why? Like whose fun quasar ruined? A weapon I ran for first week of it's release and never touched again when going vs bots cause autocannon and EAT just outperform it.

So weird, I swear.

[Animal Al]

I didn't like the Sickle nerf. I would have been happier maybe with four mags, but three is really pushing it. And the extra 5 seconds on the quasar cannon sucks when you're being chased by a bile titan. Bad moves.

[benis]

There's a type of player that would find 1 meta with power creep and revolve their entire play style around it.

They should know better, but it's a crutch for them. It inflates their ego to the point where they depend on it.

You kick it from under them and they scream on the ground, "I've been nerfed and I'm washed."

[CipherΞHawk]

Yep bad move by the devs on this one!

[dyra55]

It didn't need that much anyway, i'm fine with it, it's one of the better nerfs they could've done to it, and due to how often it was used it was too good for what it offered, it needed some sort of a downside

[AnemoneMeer]

Originally posted by Bogged:

There's a type of player that would find 1 meta with power creep and revolve their entire play style around it.

They should know better, but it's a crutch for them. It inflates their ego to the point where they depend on it.

You kick it from under them and they scream on the ground, "I've been nerfed and I'm washed."

This is pretty much it. The weapon is designed to have the player play around the Heat mechanic, with extra ICE being either consumed as punishment for failure or in order to maximize short term DPS a limited number of times.

People were just treating it as a ballistic weapon that happened to also reload for free between engagements. Which is not the design intent.

[Danny Gayvito]

I don’t how you guys even got to the point of “reloading” more than twice.

This nerf literally does nothing to me.
They didn’t touch anything else.

[EvolutionKills]

I was playing a civilian evacuation mission solo, and I had a Sickle and Autocannon against Terminids (the map had Bile Spewers, so it was a fortuitous combo). I wanted mobility so I took the stamina booster instead of drop-pod optimization, so I went in with only 2 heatsinks.

Boy howdy, do you feel the pressure when you're trapped in a high intensity environment like that, threatening to be overwhelmed by trash mobs, and trying to balance running away to conserve heatsinks.

And you know what? In the moment, it did suck.

But it also made me seriously consider taking the Sickle for that scenario in the future. If I'm going to be trapped with my back against the wall, I would rather have a weapon with finite ammo that I can mag-dump when needed and not feel bad about it. This experience had me thinking about how much more effective I would have been, had I taken a Liberator or Defender and just said 'F*CK IT!' in full-auto, then run by the supply drop whenever I was almost out.

That was almost certainly the point. On a cold planet, or fighting the Automatons, or any other mission type with more open space and the potential for more breathing room and down time to allow for the Sickle to catch it's breath? It's still a fantastic weapon, and remains one of the hands-down best picks for primary. But now its more restrictive ammo economy gives rise to situations where other weapons become more compelling options. I managed to make it work, but almost the entire time I was wishing I had brought something else with me. That is not necessarily a bad thing.

[Sleepy_Walker]

Originally posted by AnemoneMeer:

Originally posted by Bogged:

There's a type of player that would find 1 meta with power creep and revolve their entire play style around it.

They should know better, but it's a crutch for them. It inflates their ego to the point where they depend on it.

You kick it from under them and they scream on the ground, "I've been nerfed and I'm washed."

This is pretty much it. The weapon is designed to have the player play around the Heat mechanic, with extra ICE being either consumed as punishment for failure or in order to maximize short term DPS a limited number of times.

People were just treating it as a ballistic weapon that happened to also reload for free between engagements. Which is not the design intent.

I think this is absolutely correct.

I was very excited for the sickle, but then when I played with it a bit I realized that I didn't even need to bother with the heat mechanic. It had just as many ICE boxes as other weapons had magazines. I could completely ignore the heat mechanic and just play it like a liberator, or I could play with the heat mechanic and maybe burn through a couple ICE packs that I would quickly replenish because I needed grenades, stims, and support ammo anyways.

Reducing the reserve ammo was a good move, for both scythe and sickle, and impresses on the player to only overheat the weapon when really necessary or when sufficient supplies are nearby.

[Midas]

Sickle was amazing, and completely invalidated not only the scythe, but many other automatic primaries. It was expected to get some kind of nerf, and going from 'basically unlimited' to 'mostly unlimited' is about as tame a nerf as we could have possibly got. Now the scythe has the POTENTIAL to at least beat the sickle in the area of sheer ammo duration, if nothing else.

[Mister Sir]

I think people really missing my point, it's not specifically sickle thats the issue, it's constant hefty nerfs. It sucks when you have something good and then game just takes it away from you.

There tons of weapons that just straight up feel bad in this game and devs seem to wanna bring all weapons to that level rather than raise up the bad ones to greatness.

[Volcanuz.-]

Originally posted by Bogged:

There's a type of player that would find 1 meta with power creep and revolve their entire play style around it.

They should know better, but it's a crutch for them. It inflates their ego to the point where they depend on it.

You kick it from under them and they scream on the ground, "I've been nerfed and I'm washed."

Enjoying a gun doesn't mean it is powerful or is power creep you have no idea what you are talking about with balance at all. The reason those guns were more used is due to how they were reliable, any gun even the "meta" guns were all only used because they were RELIABLE. Not Strong, not overpowered. Reliable.

They are basically making primary weapons useless on purpose and it sucks. It isn't just the ones that got nerfed but every primary is becoming garbage to the point i feel i might need to bring 2 weapon strats just to keep up with large mobs and hoards. The issue is they are trying to force us into the backpack help a friend meta play style to deal with stuff like that which just feels horrible.

People like you are just mad that people can, using their brains, actually complete the hardest difficulty and want all the nerfs possible so only a tiny tiny amount of the playerbase can even chance win a high difficulty match if they are lucky. People like you are why games fall into the pit of bad game balance because you guys cry about "meta" when there is no freaking meta its not a damn PVP game with Esports on the line.

This game is meant to be a fun mess around with friends not some stupid esport game which needs constant nerfs or balances to things because they feel better than the other garbage systems/weapons in the game. Either they need to fix strats to feel better, buff the weaker weapons to be in line with what you call "meta" or stop in general. They are just making the audience dislike the game more not make it more fun.

[Mister Sir]

Originally posted by Bogged:

Originally posted by Mister Sir:

There tons of weapons that just straight up feel bad in this game and devs seem to wanna bring all weapons to that level rather than raise up the bad ones to greatness.

Let's say you had 100 elements and there's 1 outlier.

You only had to change 1 thing to get the outlier in-line with the rest.

Do you change it, or do you go after the other 99.

Which is more work.

Yeap, I see where you are going with this but cutting corners is often associated with bad results. Which we are getting now, Like yeah, devs have buffed a few weapons quite well, but there is a slew that is just borderline useless, and I would like to kinda change. Like who the F uses explosive crossbow pre or post nerf?

[Siberian Shaman]

I think 4 mags and 3 extra seconds would be a perfect balance

[Huevote]

Any player worth their salt especially on Helldive will reload the sickle MULTIPLE times when a bug breach occurs or when taking out nests. I get the sickle completely overshadows all other AR's but taking away 3 mags is a huge nerf for Helldive players.

[Mister Sir]

Originally posted by Siberian Shaman:

I think 4 mags and 3 extra seconds would be a perfect balance

I think railgun not having to take 15 shots to take down bile titan would be cool too, slugger having it's stagger, quasar not having absurd recharge time, fire dmg working for everyone and not only the host, etc.