Are Helldiver units cannon fodder?

[Blozzy]

I saw how they treated these elites looking childish with all those patriotic democratic nonsense they spout about in those videos.

I'm new to the game and i don't know bout the lore but are Helldivers the real deal? We know theyre capable but expendable too. Are there tougher military branches?

[NaRf]

We are meat for the grinder, but told we are exceptional.

[Hexagoros]

Originally posted by Blozy:

I saw how they treated these elites looking childish with all those patriotic democratic nonsense they spout about in those videos.

I'm new to the game and i don't know bout the lore but are Helldivers the real deal? We know theyre capable but expendable too. Are there tougher military branches?

Do we look like we're doing Cannon Fodder things?

Look at what's on screen, and then answer the question yourself.

And yes, "elites" get sent on terrible missions, where high casualty rates are expected, all the time. Look at both World Wars, and today's War in Ukraine, etc.

Being "elite" doesn't mean being sent on "safe" missions where no one dies.

Spoiler: There is actually an off-screen faction of Super Earth Cannon Fodder, the infantry branch of the SEAF (Super Earth Armed Forces).

[Forblaze]

Originally posted by Hexagoros:

Do we look like we're doing Cannon Fodder things?

It's the reason our arsenal is stratagem based. All you gotta do is throw the glowing ball at the bile titan and the actual professionals up in space will take care of it for you.

And if it kills you? Well, the next rube can have a go at it. You missed and got your friend blown up? Well it's a good thing you're so brave and aren't bothered by that.

[Meatbug]

It pretty much shows you right at the beginning (when doing the tutorial) that the average age is 18,7 years.
Combat readiness is 27,1%.
Patriotism rating is 97,4%.
They also have a hellidver production quota they apparently need to meet,

So much for the question of being "elite".

[Hexagoros]

Originally posted by Forblaze:

Originally posted by Hexagoros:

Do we look like we're doing Cannon Fodder things?

It's the reason our arsenal is stratagem based. All you gotta do is throw the glowing ball at the bile titan and the actual professionals up in space will take care of it for you.

And if it kills you? Well, the next rube can have a go at it. You missed and got your friend blown up? Well it's a good thing you're so brave and aren't bothered by that.

How does that make us "rubes?"

The primary function of the most elite troops in WWI (the Storm Section) was essentially to infiltrate enemy lines, clear defensive positions with grenades, and then coordinate artillery fire on Allied trenches. Did that makes those men "rubes"?

In today's War in Ukraine, the primary responsibility of the most elite troops on both sides is to coordinate drone and artillery strikes.

I think you're definition of "elite troop" is essentially "Hollywood Rambo."

Originally posted by Meatbug:

They also have a hellidver production quota they apparently need to meet,

So much for the question of being "elite".

Every modern military on earth has "quotas" to meet.

[LunaticMethod]

The Helldivers are only deployed in groups of up to four. They are given personal command of spaceships that are designed around this deployment tactic. They're the best of the best that get the absolute last word in Super Earth's arsenal, but they receive basically no training, and instead experience trial by fire with the intention that losses will be quickly and efficiently replaced.

Couple this with the fact that their engagements generally happen between 100 meters and melee range at heavily fortified locations due to the Helldivers' outrageously perilous lightning-strike battle doctrine, and it goes a long way to making them look weak.

They're glass cannons. Capable of immense destruction, but extremely fragile. It's all down to skill and luck, which Liberty did not distribute equally.

So... I don't think they're meant to be cannon fodder, but Super Earth's logistics are meant to support the possibility that they may need to die like cannon fodder.

[Alex]

They are more like expensive precision ammunition.

[Meatbug]

Originally posted by Hexagoros:

Every modern military on earth has "quotas" to meet.

Not the point of my comment.
If you want to feel elite, you do you.
The game says otherwise though.

[Forblaze]

Originally posted by Hexagoros:

How does that make us "rubes?"

The context of the setting.

for what it's worth, I'm not the one that jestered you

[Ramses101]

Originally posted by Aethrys:

Originally posted by Ramses101:

You mean weapons that could hold enought ammo to finish a mission or bring firepower strong enought to fight off a titan? I mean you have to earn a rocket launcher which you toss right after

Ammunition is heavy. What you're carrying is probably already a bit too heavy for a realistic combat load after adding a support weapon.

Bruh theres literaly a booster that makes you carry all ammo and grenades ^^ they just dont care to give every helldiver a full set, you might die after all so why not wait and see.... richard bit the dust but edward will call in supplies

[Grampire]

I think the problem I have with the lore is the lead time for production.

18 years is the average time to create, correct? That's a material weakness in their supply process, especially if they're just expendable units. On any scale, finding "willing" units that take that long to mature is an oppressive restriction.

Plus it means you'd have to do an amazing job at limiting information to support the indoctrination for almost 2 decades, difficult if the survival rate is so low. You would literally have to prep the units their entire life. If you're going to do that, why not also offer then cheap training in place of schooling or something to make them more effective/increase their expected battlefield mortality?

The Starcraft universe handled this with the Terran faction by basically pumping recruits/convicts full of cheap drugs that dull pain and make them hyperviolent and unafraid of dying.

It's obviously satire that we're not meant to think to hard about and find mildly unsettling/humorous, so I won't press too hard. Just a bit of a gap in the narrative for me.

[MoistGamer]

Think about it. The whole concept is ridiculous. Aside from the rescue scientist missions. Everything else just calls for complete and utter destruction. These shells couldve just been filled wth explosives instead of human beings. There is no reason to have a human being on the surface most of the time. "Launch the ICBM". What??? its not even going to a different planet. Its going to the one YOU LANDED ON. how about just blow it up from orbit? Kill X number of bugs? NUKE FROM ORBIT. Terminate the illegal broadcast? Youre gonna make me land, then throw a pokeball that calls down an orbital strike from the SHIP I JUST DROPPED OUT OF anyways?!?!?! What a dumb waste of time. Again, just drop it in from orbit.

Problem solved, planet nuked, the Helldivers solution in search of a problem woudlnt need to exist, except for rescue scientist missions in which case a dropship would suffice yeah? And they could board our ship and just takeoff instead of running into... a building with a glowing doorway?

For the record I think the game is a blast. The "helldiver" concept is ludicrous though.

[Forblaze]

Originally posted by Grampire:

I think the problem I have with the lore is the lead time for production.

18 years is the average time to create, correct? That's a material weakness in their supply process, especially if they're just expendable units. On any scale, finding "willing" units that take that long to mature is an oppressive restriction.

Plus it means you'd have to do an amazing job at limiting information to support the indoctrination for almost 2 decades, difficult if the survival rate is so low. You would literally have to prep the units their entire life. If you're going to do that, why not also offer then cheap training in place of schooling or something to make them more effective/increase their expected battlefield mortality?

The Starcraft universe handled this with the Terran faction by basically pumping recruits/convicts full of cheap drugs that dull pain and make them hyperviolent and unafraid of dying.

It's obviously satire that we're not meant to think to hard about and find mildly unsettling/humorous, so I won't press too hard. Just a bit of a gap in the narrative for me.

Yeah, but look at how many worlds they have colonized. That's a lot of population.

It's also implied that the government controls the terminids, and that the war with them is completely manufactured. Having an outside enemy is what's valuable.

[DoktorFar]

Originally posted by Blozy:

I saw how they treated these elites looking childish with all those patriotic democratic nonsense they spout about in those videos.

I'm new to the game and i don't know bout the lore but are Helldivers the real deal? We know theyre capable but expendable too. Are there tougher military branches?

I think they pretty much are yes. Think of every time that you died in the mission... cannon fodder, and a new one's ready to dive down to replace... I mean "reinforce" you.

[Evil Gnome]

I think Mr.Bix said it best "the helldivers are simultaneously super expendable and the best of the best, kind of like space marines"