Helldivers vs ODSTs

[Blozzy]

Who got better training, weapons and combat experience? Ima leave out startagems cause that's just not fair

[Babyfaced Beauty]

Wiao people actually arguing about the design of the lore, rather than which is more fun and what gets played more time wise?

HD2 > Halo, by numbers and stats. If you want to be a fanatic, by all means, there's nothing to argue about. Might as well say Undertale >>>> whatever you can bring to compete.

[The_Dipl0mat]

Originally posted by 𝒞𝒶𝓈𝓊𝒶𝓁 Sinner:

Originally posted by The_Dipl0mat:

You notice how many casualties a Helldiver often has?

We do have to kind of ask how much of that is game/plot armor really. I think some of the charm about HD2 is you don't have "plot" armor, you will get ♥♥♥♥♥♥ up really fast on higher difficulties if you so much as breathe the wrong way.

I think a better way to look at it would be: If you dropped an ODST into a bug/bot world, how successful would they be? They can bring anything, but can't call in any support.

If you dropped a Hell Diver into a besieged or covenant owned world, how would they fair?

I feel like an ODST would be capable of performing at least one full obj by themselves against automatons, but quickly mowed down by bugs due to unfamiliar combat style. Due to the lack of support for a Helldiver, they would not last long on either besieged or Covenant owned. Both would excel most with a squad though rather than by themselves.

An ODST squad would be fairly capable and most likely more stealthy than a Helldiver squad, but the Helldiver squad would most likely be bringing more bang.

[ImHelping]

ODST vs helldiver missions is a pretty horrible scenario for them because mocking helldivers for needing respawns is also forgetting helldiver enemies get infinity respawns even after you blow up every single on map spawner. oops you touched a mining survey machine time for a million more bugs spawning 20 feet away from you.

Helldivers meanwhile would be amazed at the luxury of an entire planet of halo enemies, because that is still a finite number.

"Grunts and flood and whatever... can't sprint at us across the surface of the ocean? REALLY?"

Honestly they would both die horribly.

[SievertChaser]

Originally posted by BabyBeauty:

Wiao people actually arguing about the design of the lore, rather than which is more fun and what gets played more time wise?

HD2 > Halo, by numbers and stats

Only because Halo is freaking dead.

[𝒞𝒶𝓈𝓊𝒶𝓁 Sinner]

Originally posted by The_Dipl0mat:

I feel like an ODST would be capable of performing at least one full obj by themselves against automatons, but quickly mowed down by bugs due to unfamiliar combat style. Due to the lack of support for a Helldiver, they would not last long on either besieged or Covenant owned. Both would excel most with a squad though rather than by themselves.

An ODST squad would be fairly capable and most likely more stealthy than a Helldiver squad, but the Helldiver squad would most likely be bringing more bang.

You gotta account for the big heavies though. I'm gonna say that the spartan laser is equivalent to the laser cannon in one hit, it would be good at taking down hulks. But ODSTS 100% get wiped by bugs if they aren't running pure stealth, and as we know, stalkers are immune to stealth builds. I can just imagine the ODSTs getting overwhelmed by a swarm of hunters, chargers, and bile titans.

I think the real loser for Hell Divers would be that their primaries would probably suck against anything that wasn't a jackal/elite.

[ImHelping]

Originally posted by 𝒞𝒶𝓈𝓊𝒶𝓁 Sinner:

Originally posted by The_Dipl0mat:

I feel like an ODST would be capable of performing at least one full obj by themselves against automatons, but quickly mowed down by bugs due to unfamiliar combat style. Due to the lack of support for a Helldiver, they would not last long on either besieged or Covenant owned. Both would excel most with a squad though rather than by themselves.

An ODST squad would be fairly capable and most likely more stealthy than a Helldiver squad, but the Helldiver squad would most likely be bringing more bang.

You gotta account for the big heavies though. I'm gonna say that the spartan laser is equivalent to the laser cannon in one hit, it would be good at taking down hulks. But ODSTS 100% get wiped by bugs if they aren't running pure stealth, and as we know, stalkers are immune to stealth builds. I can just imagine the ODSTs getting overwhelmed by a swarm of hunters, chargers, and bile titans.

I think the real loser for Hell Divers would be that their primaries would probably suck against anything that wasn't a jackal/elite.

As much as I make fun of the scorcher for not being as good as I wish? It is a lot better than a halo plasma rifle.

"What do you mean I can't ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ reload? Man I almost take back all my complaints about running out of ammo killing rocket devastators and walkers with it."

[Claptain Ahab]

Originally posted by Mander:

1) Training: ODST
2) Weapons: mileage may vary, but I would say Helldivers, but only if we include pages’ 7/8/9 weapons.
3) Combat Experience: Helldivers. Space Vietnam didn’t stop us. We’re blitzing through battles so fast that PTSD can’t keep up with us.

I love it when people try to use a super extreme to describe a meaningless task they are doing. We are blitzing through it so fast ptsd cant keep up with us. Like good lord i hope you dont get ptsd from sitting in a climate controlled home clicking buttons. I dont think it was quite the joke or flex you thought it was. Really more telling of this community.

[Baelog]

Imagine taking the Helldiver Graduation Course as the only training a Helldiver ever gets.

Helldivers are required to be members of the Super Earth Armed Forces (SEAF) before becoming a Helldiver, which means you were one of the blue armored guys that you find on various missions.

Helldiver school is much like Ranger school, it's an entire school devoted to the training the Helldiver will experience during their time in the field, including SERE training, how to brace for impact inside of a Hellpod, proper Stim use, all sorts of weapons training (Helldivers are 100% familiar with all weapons they can call down or find in the field, including how to reload and rack a handgun with one hand) and even vehicle training.

The Helldiver Graduation Test, where you earn your cape is more or less a loyalty test to see if you're willing to actually pull the trigger on live Terminids much like how Air Force PJs are forced to kill rabbits for survival training and a brief exposure to orbital strikes and call-ins to get you acclimated to their effect and impact on the battlefield before your contract signing.

So I wouldn't say Helldivers have "15 minutes of training" before they're sent into the field as a Helldiver.

[SievertChaser]

Originally posted by 𝒞𝒶𝓈𝓊𝒶𝓁 Sinner:

Originally posted by The_Dipl0mat:

I feel like an ODST would be capable of performing at least one full obj by themselves against automatons, but quickly mowed down by bugs due to unfamiliar combat style. Due to the lack of support for a Helldiver, they would not last long on either besieged or Covenant owned. Both would excel most with a squad though rather than by themselves.

An ODST squad would be fairly capable and most likely more stealthy than a Helldiver squad, but the Helldiver squad would most likely be bringing more bang.

You gotta account for the big heavies though. I'm gonna say that the spartan laser is equivalent to the laser cannon in one hit, it would be good at taking down hulks. But ODSTS 100% get wiped by bugs if they aren't running pure stealth, and as we know, stalkers are immune to stealth builds. I can just imagine the ODSTs getting overwhelmed by a swarm of hunters, chargers, and bile titans.

I think the real loser for Hell Divers would be that their primaries would probably suck against anything that wasn't a jackal/elite.

Depends on how we make comparisons in ballistics, really. Theoretically everything in Halo is OP because it takes a lot of spam from a 7.62x51 mm assault rifle to kill anything. In Helldivers' more grounded terms, that assault rifle is a freaking machine gun. (Although, interestingly, the Mobile Infantry of the movies also uses a long-barreled 7.62x51 mm "assault" rifle)

Basically the smallest practical Helldiver gun would be the autocannon. Heh, Wh40k called...

[The_Dipl0mat]

Originally posted by 𝒞𝒶𝓈𝓊𝒶𝓁 Sinner:

Originally posted by The_Dipl0mat:

I feel like an ODST would be capable of performing at least one full obj by themselves against automatons, but quickly mowed down by bugs due to unfamiliar combat style. Due to the lack of support for a Helldiver, they would not last long on either besieged or Covenant owned. Both would excel most with a squad though rather than by themselves.

An ODST squad would be fairly capable and most likely more stealthy than a Helldiver squad, but the Helldiver squad would most likely be bringing more bang.

You gotta account for the big heavies though. I'm gonna say that the spartan laser is equivalent to the laser cannon in one hit, it would be good at taking down hulks. But ODSTS 100% get wiped by bugs if they aren't running pure stealth, and as we know, stalkers are immune to stealth builds. I can just imagine the ODSTs getting overwhelmed by a swarm of hunters, chargers, and bile titans.

I think the real loser for Hell Divers would be that their primaries would probably suck against anything that wasn't a jackal/elite.

Well yeah, thats why I said they'll get quickly mowed down by bugs. Unfamiliar fighting style that favors combat ODSTs aren't equipped to handle. They'd likely run stealth as long as possible though, likely to even go as far as more than crawling around and trying to use terrain to their advantage.

I'd say most Diver primaries would suck against elites, hunters, and most vehicles that covenant would field during an alarm. However, the punisher line would do fantastic, as would the JAR-15, Scorcher, and maybe the laser weapons. And the Liberator Penetrator. They'd be well equipped to handle grunts, jackals, drones, n' maybe brutes? Ultimately, without stratagem access a Helldiver squad would not last long on their own when engaging Covenant.

ODSTs would probably last just a bit longer due to their own stealth experience which plays a role in much more than just "crawl around" against Automatons, and may be even able to actually take some stuff out. (And by a bit, I mean maybe an extra hour?)

[SievertChaser]

Originally posted by The_Dipl0mat:

Originally posted by 𝒞𝒶𝓈𝓊𝒶𝓁 Sinner:

You gotta account for the big heavies though. I'm gonna say that the spartan laser is equivalent to the laser cannon in one hit, it would be good at taking down hulks. But ODSTS 100% get wiped by bugs if they aren't running pure stealth, and as we know, stalkers are immune to stealth builds. I can just imagine the ODSTs getting overwhelmed by a swarm of hunters, chargers, and bile titans.

I think the real loser for Hell Divers would be that their primaries would probably suck against anything that wasn't a jackal/elite.

Well yeah, thats why I said they'll get quickly mowed down by bugs. Unfamiliar fighting style that favors combat ODSTs aren't equipped to handle.

Hm... do we count post-war era ODSTs trained to deal with the Flood?

[ImHelping]

Not gonna lie this is now one of my favorite Vs threads because of all the "Well, both of them would be good at stuff" posts mixed in.

Much better than one of the dumbest halo centric threads I have seen way back. Somebody angrily declaring Master chief would curbstomp Dead Space (well no ♥♥♥♥-) PS he also has every weapon and infinite ammo. (...do they... do they think master chief is a baby?)

[𝒞𝒶𝓈𝓊𝒶𝓁 Sinner]

Originally posted by SievertChaser:

Hm... do we count post-war era ODSTs trained to deal with the Flood?

I don't think I'd say that dealing with the bugs is the same as the Flood. Kinda similar, but very different at the same time. I know there was supposed to be a juggernaut, or I think there was in Halo Wars 2, but that is still so much smaller than a bile titan, and I can't think of a flood unit that spits acid at you from a good distance away.

On the issue of the flood though. Does incorporating a Diver squad into the Gravemind make it democratic?

[The_Dipl0mat]

Originally posted by SievertChaser:

Originally posted by The_Dipl0mat:

Well yeah, thats why I said they'll get quickly mowed down by bugs. Unfamiliar fighting style that favors combat ODSTs aren't equipped to handle.

Hm... do we count post-war era ODSTs trained to deal with the Flood?

I'd say its still vastly different. With the Flood you need to keep them pushed back and rely on support for it (Hellbringers, Navy, ect ect). They'd probably be able to retreat from bugs but not get much accomplished. At most, I can see them taking out nests and basic destructive tasks. Maybe one fortifying obj (Activate 710 pumps, ect ect)
The moment their position is known, it becomes a fall back and regroup deal which would probably result in casualties. They'd also have severely limited ammo as you can't exactly pick up a dead bugs weapon

[The_Dipl0mat]

Originally posted by 𝒞𝒶𝓈𝓊𝒶𝓁 Sinner:

Originally posted by SievertChaser:

Hm... do we count post-war era ODSTs trained to deal with the Flood?

I don't think I'd say that dealing with the bugs is the same as the Flood. Kinda similar, but very different at the same time. I know there was supposed to be a juggernaut, or I think there was in Halo Wars 2, but that is still so much smaller than a bile titan, and I can't think of a flood unit that spits acid at you from a good distance away.

On the issue of the flood though. Does incorporating a Diver squad into the Gravemind make it democratic?

Yeah, the flood relies on kinda similar tactics to the bugs, but the infection angle brings up a vastly different situation. Not to mention the existence of a bug somewhere doesn't mean that place is generally insta-doomed

And obviously, Democratic spirit overwhelms the Gravemind and it enlists for the Helldivers corps