We needed BUFFS NOT NERFS

[ItsJ-]

Huge misstep on this patch. We needed the other options to be buffed to become relevant not the meta to be nerfed. The meta is still going to be the same and now it just makes the game worse. We need BUFFS not NERFS. Things were at a pretty good spot before we just needed more options to be buffed to relevance. Are the devs just not listening to the community?

We don't need everything to be broken or overly strong. We need the MAJORITY of things to be capable. The problem right now is we don't have enough capable options and once you get into the late game you have very few options. This is what makes the game NOT fun. A challenge is good, but i think everyone can agree that having so many stratagem weapons you have to call in not do ANY damage to the main problem enemies is a issue. I want to have fun like in the clips i see on youtube, but at the higher levels the options you see people taking on clips aren't actually viable. You end up all running the same stuff because nothing else is useful and than makes the game feel like a boring repeat over and over and over. We need options to make BUILDS in this game. Thats what makes games fun. Right now there is no brain power used in making builds in this game. You simply get level 20 take level 20 things and never think past that.

That isn't fun and is actually what we call power creep. We need more build diversity options. As of right now here are the options for difficulty 7+.

Supply pack
Shield generator
SOMETIMES guard dog rover

Expendable anti tank (low levels)
recoiless rifle
spear
railgun

Orbital Laser
Orbital Railcannon Strike

Eagle Airstrike
Eagle 500kg Bomb

EMS sentry
The one armor piercing sentry
MAYBE shield generator

This list gets even shorter if you are a solo player. For how many things are in game currently most of them aren't even usable and that sucks. I want to use more. I have tried and tested everything at max upgrades for reference.

Great youtube video that also helps emphasize what im saying here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCobWvtap3g

[ItsJ-]

Not surprised if the game takes a player dip because of this very out of touch

[iDankenstein]

There are buffs they just nerfed the meta guns which still is good. take railgun off safemode it 3 shot BT still and chargers stop complaining

[amyen]

Originally posted by iDankenstein:

There are buffs they just nerfed the meta guns which still is good. take railgun off safemode it 3 shot BT still and chargers stop complaining

for bile titans thats only true, if the host is on ps5. otherwise its just an ammo dump. confirmed in many threads already and i have experienced this first hand, since i have a friend on ps5 i play with. and everytime he is there, it was a "cakewalk" when a bile titan appeared - not so much when pc was hosting.

im only talking railgun without using other stratagems, and havent tested the new patch yet. but judging by the known issues list, the devs dont even know about this bug, as i havent seen it listed anywhere.

edit: also, your arugment doesnt make buffing instead of nerfing unviable as a critism. most of the stuff we have is just badly balanced. yes, its usabable, but not in any way shape or form a viable solution for anything on diff7 and above, where you are chased around constantly by every enemy type all at once. buffing 1 weapon and nerfing everything that was somewhat useable, instead of buffing the bad stuff is just crazy. specially in a pve game, where most people play with randoms and cant coordinate on a level a premade group with good comms can.

[ItsJ-]

Originally posted by iDankenstein:

There are buffs they just nerfed the meta guns which still is good. take railgun off safemode it 3 shot BT still and chargers stop complaining

No they did not buff enough. We still don't have anything BUT Railgun. We need grenade launcher to do appropriate damage to weak points because this is bugged right now. We need the Autocannon to do appropriate damage to weak points and it deserves medium armour piercing. We need the anti material rifle (Sniper) to do more armour piercing. We need machine gun and stalwart to actually have some kind of identity from the two. We need multiple airstrike buffs to make stratagems feel situational and not just a couple options.

We need buffs for the game to have a healthy rotation of options. Stop being a shill and recognize the game can and needs to do better. Cant help but feel these nerfs are being put in place to make the next battlepass with mechs feel even stronger. Multiple other weapons are fairly useless after obtaining them right now as well.

[Dub U]

Originally posted by iDankenstein:

There are buffs they just nerfed the meta guns which still is good. take railgun off safemode it 3 shot BT still and chargers stop complaining

Not enough buffs. HD2 puts very heavy emphasis on stratagem weapons to do a lot of the heavy lifting and it leaves your primary and secondary to the wayside because of it. A lot of the primaries are still vastly inferior on higher difficulties. I used to primarily run the starter Liberator and then the Defender, but on higher difficulties, neither are of them are very consistent in taking out the trash mobs as the Breaker is. I wanted to love the Diligence as I used the Paragon for the vast majority of my game play in HD1, but both variants of the Diligence are just absolutely worthless as they can't deal with the overwhelming number of trash mobs and they're not strong enough to deal with the heavier mobs. As it stands, you're still really only left with the Breaker and its variants for your primary. All the energy guns are pretty much trash as well and need to be balanced. There's really no point in even looking at them as they currently stand. They should add back the Stalwart as a primary like they did in HD1. There just needs to be more viable variety.

As for secondaries, you have 3 options but realistically only 1 option. The Redeemer. Everything else is again, inferior. The Redeemer can clear trash mobs and give you some breathing room but with its ammo economy, you really can only buy yourself a few moments in between resupplies. So with support weapons being your true primary weapon, you now barely have a back up to your back up. God forbid you get killed and cant get back to your body to recover your support weapon, now you're just kiting and clearing for your damn life.

If they want to focus more on support weapons, they need to really balance all the support weapons. Especially the AT. I ran the GL, AC, and RR long before picking up the RG, but pre-patch, the RG really was king. You didn't need a backpack slot for the RG, and it was very reliable for individual work. Yes, the game is about team work, but when you have people who just want to run the RG and shield, you're kind of SOL as you're now forced to reload the RR on your own and it takes a considerable amount of time. You can't deal with multiple heavy enemies with the RR on your own. If they made it so RR can be reloaded off the backpack while you wear it, I could see that being a huge plus for the RR. If the AM and the AC could strip armor, that would also change the paradigm from RG to different build as the AC has great versatility just like the GL as it can break outposts, broadcast towers, and spore shrooms unlike the RG.

Arrowhead has a lot of work to do, and they shouldn't be getting all their data from watching streamers unless they want to end up like COD MW3 and polarizing the community of bandwagon players and actual fans of the game.

[ItsJ-]

Originally posted by Dub U:

Originally posted by iDankenstein:

There are buffs they just nerfed the meta guns which still is good. take railgun off safemode it 3 shot BT still and chargers stop complaining

Not enough buffs. HD2 puts very heavy emphasis on stratagem weapons to do a lot of the heavy lifting and it leaves your primary and secondary to the wayside because of it. A lot of the primaries are still vastly inferior on higher difficulties. I used to primarily run the starter Liberator and then the Defender, but on higher difficulties, neither are of them are very consistent in taking out the trash mobs as the Breaker is. I wanted to love the Diligence as I used the Paragon for the vast majority of my game play in HD1, but both variants of the Diligence are just absolutely worthless as they can't deal with the overwhelming number of trash mobs and they're not strong enough to deal with the heavier mobs. As it stands, you're still really only left with the Breaker and its variants for your primary. All the energy guns are pretty much trash as well and need to be balanced. There's really no point in even looking at them as they currently stand. They should add back the Stalwart as a primary like they did in HD1. There just needs to be more viable variety.

As for secondaries, you have 3 options but realistically only 1 option. The Redeemer. Everything else is again, inferior. The Redeemer can clear trash mobs and give you some breathing room but with its ammo economy, you really can only buy yourself a few moments in between resupplies. So with support weapons being your true primary weapon, you now barely have a back up to your back up. God forbid you get killed and cant get back to your body to recover your support weapon, now you're just kiting and clearing for your damn life.

If they want to focus more on support weapons, they need to really balance all the support weapons. Especially the AT. I ran the GL, AC, and RR long before picking up the RG, but pre-patch, the RG really was king. You didn't need a backpack slot for the RG, and it was very reliable for individual work. Yes, the game is about team work, but when you have people who just want to run the RG and shield, you're kind of SOL as you're now forced to reload the RR on your own and it takes a considerable amount of time. You can't deal with multiple heavy enemies with the RR on your own. If they made it so RR can be reloaded off the backpack while you wear it, I could see that being a huge plus for the RR. If the AM and the AC could strip armor, that would also change the paradigm from RG to different build as the AC has great versatility just like the GL as it can break outposts, broadcast towers, and spore shrooms unlike the RG.

Arrowhead has a lot of work to do, and they shouldn't be getting all their data from watching streamers unless they want to end up like COD MW3 and polarizing the community of bandwagon players and actual fans of the game.

I think even youtubers and streamers are saying you can only really use the railgun though. I think the devs are just out of touch or starting to greed with this new battlepass approaching.

I agree with you though as of right now these are the options for any 7+ difficulty level

Supply pack
Shield generator
SOMETIMES guard dog rover

Expendable anti tank
recoiless rifle
spear
railgun

Orbital Laser
Orbital Railcannon Strike

Eagle Airstrike
Eagle 500kg Bomb

EMS sentry
The one armour piercing sentry
MAYBE shield generator

That's it. This list is way too short for how many options are in the game. If you are doing difficulty 7+ these are the only reliable options. If you are solo this list becomes even shorter.

[Feuver]

Originally posted by ItsJ-:

Huge misstep on this patch. We needed the other options to be buffed to become relevant not the meta to be nerfed. The meta is still going to be the same and now it just makes the game worse. We need BUFFS not NERFS. Things were at a pretty good spot before we just needed more options to be buffed to relevance. Are the devs just not listening to the community?

In the word of the devs:

I have since the game released seen many who say “Don’t Nerf, only Buff” and other similar ideas. However as a designer I can tell you this is not a great idea, but I understand where the sentiment comes from. All too often in the games industry the core fantasy, and what makes a weapon feel good and fun, is ignored for the sake of Balance. I believe players are scared of Nerfs, because it will ruin the fantasy of a weapon, ruin their fun. It is extra important to us to tread carefully so that we don’t ruin fantasy and fun when we do nerfs. We hope you, our players, will tell us when we cross that line inadvertently.

[Amaranth]

I want my auto-win button

[Maj. Crimes]

Originally posted by amyen:

Originally posted by iDankenstein:

There are buffs they just nerfed the meta guns which still is good. take railgun off safemode it 3 shot BT still and chargers stop complaining

for bile titans thats only true, if the host is on ps5. otherwise its just an ammo dump. confirmed in many threads already and i have experienced this first hand, since i have a friend on ps5 i play with. and everytime he is there, it was a "cakewalk" when a bile titan appeared - not so much when pc was hosting.

im only talking railgun without using other stratagems, and havent tested the new patch yet. but judging by the known issues list, the devs dont even know about this bug, as i havent seen it listed anywhere.

And where is the bug? Its not the first game where the game is "easier" on console due to controller aim. For instance, Battlefield 2042 has reduced weapon recoil on controller, so does the Finals. Its probably intentional.

[YippeeKai-Yay]

Originally posted by ItsJ-:

Not surprised if the game takes a player dip because of this very out of touch

Fine with me, casuals will leave anyways after a bit.

[Rampage]

basically showed these devs havent got a clue how to make this game a succes. Everything theyve done so far from stealth nerfs and weapon nerfs to insane galatic war interference drained every bit of fun out of the game.

[KnIf0r^TITAN]

I honestly think the game would be better if all the weapons where OP as hell but the number of enemies were tripled rather then nerf weapons in to uselessness.

[<⬆️➡️⬇️⬇️⬇️>]

there many 'meh' weapons, the schyte laser, the dilligence rifles, the revoler, the liberator alternatives are also quite meh, :/

[amyen]

Originally posted by Maj. Crimes:

Originally posted by amyen:

for bile titans thats only true, if the host is on ps5. otherwise its just an ammo dump. confirmed in many threads already and i have experienced this first hand, since i have a friend on ps5 i play with. and everytime he is there, it was a "cakewalk" when a bile titan appeared - not so much when pc was hosting.

im only talking railgun without using other stratagems, and havent tested the new patch yet. but judging by the known issues list, the devs dont even know about this bug, as i havent seen it listed anywhere.

And where is the bug? Its not the first game where the game is "easier" on console due to controller aim. For instance, Battlefield 2042 has reduced weapon recoil on controller, so does the Finals. Its probably intentional.

the bug is, if a ps5 player is hosting, that the railgun does more damage (and i wasnt even talking about the unsafe mode btw) - as in it kills a bile titan within 3 shots. and that is not the case when the host is on pc. has nothing to do with controller aim. look at the post im quoting and the read my response to it.

[Silence Suzuka]

Originally posted by iDankenstein:

There are buffs they just nerfed the meta guns which still is good. take railgun off safemode it 3 shot BT still and chargers stop complaining

So another idiot who doesn't know why it 3 shot BT.

NO it doesn't 3 shot BT because it is powerful or you aimed at right place.
It is because your connection is poor and the potato server they have registered multiple hit to your shot.