What the actual... over?!

[Dozer]

Haven't played long enough to unlock many of the goodies people are discussing, with regards to the weapon nerfs buffs.

What I will say is that, just two night ago my friend and I were discussing how happy we were with leaving Destiny 2, because infinite reasons.

One thing I stressed to him was my concern that Arrowhead might do what way too many other studios do: Nerf the most used items.

What happened? Most used items got a nerf, while many other weapons that just can't deal with heavy types "as efficiently" got zero love.

Again, I haven't played long enough/ unlocked many weapons, but the logical fact remains, nerfing the majority of what few efficiency tools there are n the belt is NEVER a good thing. This is especially true when a vast majority of the other tools are mere stepping stones / low-key trash upon reaching higher levels of play, items, tactics, etc.

I've seen and read enough to know that the answer to this question is all anyone should be talking about:

We don't know what the future will bring, with regards to how this patch will play out. That said, why am I being Bungie micrio-managed into playing f***-around with enemies just to artificially inflate difficulty, when in the game there exists plenty of opportunities for players to find themselves in these situations naturally.

Why do I have to play ring-around-the-rosie with heavies instead of being able to efficiently kill them using the best/ only tool for the job?

So people wanted to use the railgun to deal with heavies. Why is that so bad? It's the only time I EVER saw people using it. It fills a void. It serves a unique purpose that NO other weapon could do as good, but it's by and large not the BEST weapon in game, because most of the enemies we shoot do NOT warrant being shot with that gun.

We can all split hairs all day long, but I'm more disappointed in there being a general lack to armor piercing among most of the weapons. THAT is what hurts railgun users so bad. Sure, the nerf sucks, but honestly tell me what other tool was designed to do that job as efficiently?

I haven't put a lot of time in, but I have eyes, ears, and a brain. I've done the math. The answer is simple: There are no/ is no other tool. Any arguments made after that logical fact are just hearsay and conjecture.

I'm reserving the right to call 100% bullsh!t on this lack of buffs patch, but I am calling it like I see it, "not so good."

Time will tell...

***UPDATE***

TL/DR: For those that want it, K1ll3rc0mb0 literally summed it all up nicely, pairing both wisdom and humor into what I think best describes the dop-pod we're currently finding ourselves in.

Thanks c0mb0! Have an awesome day!

[TheAceOfSpodes]

"I'm reserving the right to call 100% bullsh!t on this lack of buffs patch, but I am calling it like I see it, "not so good.""

... They nerfed 2 guns, and buffed 4. What?

We already have plenty of tools to deal with heavies. A well-timed spear shot will one shot chargers and hulks. Recoilless rockets deal with them pretty quickly, especially if you aim for a foreleg and then swap to primary. Autocannons can two-shot hulks if you aim well.

I haven't had a chance to experiment with the new flamethrower yet, but it should be pretty alright at handling chargers with a 50% dps buff.

And if you still want an anti-everything gun, the Arc Thrower exists unchanged.

[Cits]

The people who don't understand the game are generally overreacting

Breaker is more inline with other weaopns and was over performing. Railgun works exactly the same if you used it in unsafe mode like you were supposed to when dealing with armored enemies. Also, the other anti-armor weapons were and still are great, but people confused solo-plays constant need for moment on helldiver, because lack of killing potential, with the 'best' option even when playing with a team. The other anti-armor weapons (other than the spear) do exactly what they're supposed to and work great. Play with your team and freedom will reign supreme

[Katitoff]

2 weapons were nerfed.

7 were buffed. (3 shotguns buffed, Spear and arc thrower targetting improved, flamer massive buff, las canon massive buff)

What are you even on about?
Is this this some elaborate wall of text to farm clowns, or you're just blindly jumping on bandwagon of people complaining about insanely OP weapon that carried them to 8 and 9, while they should never leave 5?

[Dozer]

Originally posted by TheAceOfSpodes:

"I'm reserving the right to call 100% bullsh!t on this lack of buffs patch, but I am calling it like I see it, "not so good.""

... They nerfed 2 guns, and buffed 4. What?

We already have plenty of tools to deal with heavies. A well-timed spear shot will one shot chargers and hulks. Recoilless rockets deal with them pretty quickly, especially if you aim for a foreleg and then swap to primary. Autocannons can two-shot hulks if you aim well.

I haven't had a chance to experiment with the new flamethrower yet, but it should be pretty alright at handling chargers with a 50% dps buff.

And if you still want an anti-everything gun, the Arc Thrower exists unchanged.

I'm eager to see how the flamer works, more than anything to be honest

[Cits]

Originally posted by TheAceOfSpodes:

A well-timed spear shot will one shot chargers and hulks.

Teach me your secrets.

[Master Blaster]

I don't understand the point of doing so many nerfs to a PVE game? is this just to insert artificial difficulty or to create a stop-gap from people blowing through the content too fast? Cause thats pretty lame, granted I haven't gotten very far but I would still see this as being annoying/problem if it becomes a habit in the near future, I mean games are supposed to be fun right? Who cares if something is super effective? Isn't that what the difficult mode is for?

[Cits]

Originally posted by Dozer:

I'm eager to see how the flamer works, more than anything to be honest

I'm betting its going to surpass Arcthrower in accidental team killing now

[Ferrix]

Originally posted by TheAceOfSpodes:

"I'm reserving the right to call 100% bullsh!t on this lack of buffs patch, but I am calling it like I see it, "not so good.""

... They nerfed 2 guns, and buffed 4. What?

We already have plenty of tools to deal with heavies. A well-timed spear shot will one shot chargers and hulks. Recoilless rockets deal with them pretty quickly, especially if you aim for a foreleg and then swap to primary. Autocannons can two-shot hulks if you aim well.

I haven't had a chance to experiment with the new flamethrower yet, but it should be pretty alright at handling chargers with a 50% dps buff.

And if you still want an anti-everything gun, the Arc Thrower exists unchanged.

The Spear that still has a bug unpatched making it not lock on properly? The Recoilless that thanks to a currently-unpatched bug/glitch by admission of the devs isn't breaking Charger armor reliably? The autocannon whose rounds bounce off heavy armor, unlike that of the AC Turret? And the Arc Cannon which still has the bug of occasionally firing "dud" shots that don't actually shoot?

Flamethrower seems interesting but, no pun intended here, everything else seems cooked.

[Dozer]

Originally posted by Cits:

The people who don't understand the game are generally overreacting

Breaker is more inline with other weaopns and was over performing. Railgun works exactly the same if you used it in unsafe mode like you were supposed to when dealing with armored enemies. Also, the other anti-armor weapons were and still are great, but people confused solo-plays constant need for moment on helldiver, because lack of killing potential, with the 'best' option even when playing with a team. The other anti-armor weapons (other than the spear) do exactly what they're supposed to and work great. Play with your team and freedom will reign supreme

I found the breaker to be completely over-hyped. Is it good? Yes. Is it great? No. I can get better ammo economy out of the warbond SMG (forget name) I purchased, as that SMG hits harder than the assault rifles I've had access to.

The shotgun ammo is just not good, especially when dealing with armored enemies. I'm saving for the medium armor penetrating Liberator (again, sorry, forget the name). I hope that gun will be the go-to.

Also, speaking of ammo economy, is it just me or do secondary weapons just feel extra weak and have the worst ammo economy ever?

[TheAceOfSpodes]

Originally posted by Cits:

Originally posted by TheAceOfSpodes:

A well-timed spear shot will one shot chargers and hulks.

Teach me your secrets.

Sure! You need either a straight on face or tail shot against a charger or a hulk. At range its easier to reposition and ambush with the face shot, but if that's not an option and the charger is coming for you, bait it into a wall and put a bit of range (10-20 meters) between you and it, then fire for the butt.

In lieu of that, they're two hits.

I do concede that the spear can be a bit flaky at times with its lock-ons. But once you get used to the range requirements, you can get one shots pretty reliably.

[Dozer]

Originally posted by Master Blaster:

I don't understand the point of doing so many nerfs to a PVE game? is this just to insert artificial difficulty or to create a stop-gap from people blowing through the content too fast? Cause thats pretty lame, granted I haven't gotten very far but I would still see this as being annoying/problem if it becomes a habit in the near future, I mean games are supposed to be fun right? Who cares if something is super effective? Isn't that what the difficult mode is for?

Generally a stop-gap, in my more than 40 years of gaming. That is usually EXACTLY what it is.

This feels like a mix of both, stop-gap, as well as just a knee-jerk reaction to them (possibly) being concerned that people will get bored using the best tools in their belt...because most of the other tools are junk.

We need "not the best" tools to make "the best tool for SPECIFIC JOBS" feel best.

More buffs SHOULD have been the play here, by far. Not every weapon has to be junk, but not allowing best-in-slot for SPECIFIC JOB is just outlandish and speaks to a general lack of understanding how paper-rock-scissors works.

[Dozer]

Originally posted by Cits:

Originally posted by Dozer:

I'm eager to see how the flamer works, more than anything to be honest

I'm betting its going to surpass Arcthrower in accidental team killing now

Love that gun, but it's absolutely teammate lethal

[Kalenath]

Originally posted by Cits:

The people who don't understand the game are generally overreacting

Breaker is more inline with other weaopns and was over performing. Railgun works exactly the same if you used it in unsafe mode like you were supposed to when dealing with armored enemies. Also, the other anti-armor weapons were and still are great, but people confused solo-plays constant need for moment on helldiver, because lack of killing potential, with the 'best' option even when playing with a team. The other anti-armor weapons (other than the spear) do exactly what they're supposed to and work great. Play with your team and freedom will reign supreme

^This

The whole POINT of guns being weak is that you are supposed to use Stratagems and/or teamwork to win. I know, I know. Teamwork in a co-op game is HERESY!

[Dozer]

Originally posted by Ferrix:

Originally posted by TheAceOfSpodes:

"I'm reserving the right to call 100% bullsh!t on this lack of buffs patch, but I am calling it like I see it, "not so good.""

... They nerfed 2 guns, and buffed 4. What?

We already have plenty of tools to deal with heavies. A well-timed spear shot will one shot chargers and hulks. Recoilless rockets deal with them pretty quickly, especially if you aim for a foreleg and then swap to primary. Autocannons can two-shot hulks if you aim well.

I haven't had a chance to experiment with the new flamethrower yet, but it should be pretty alright at handling chargers with a 50% dps buff.

And if you still want an anti-everything gun, the Arc Thrower exists unchanged.

The Spear that still has a bug unpatched making it not lock on properly? The Recoilless that thanks to a currently-unpatched bug/glitch by admission of the devs isn't breaking Charger armor reliably? The autocannon whose rounds bounce off heavy armor, unlike that of the AC Turret? And the Arc Cannon which still has the bug of occasionally firing "dud" shots that don't actually shoot?

Flamethrower seems interesting but, no pun intended here, everything else seems cooked.

The Recoilless and Spear being flaky on armor-breaking is the legit answer/ reason I got when asking people, "Why so Railgun serious?" I've witnessed it, my own testing. It's bad, the "other" options for breaking armor.

Again, this was a blundered direction with the patch. Fingers crossed other weapons get a lot of love and soon

[TheAceOfSpodes]

Originally posted by Ferrix:

Originally posted by TheAceOfSpodes:

"I'm reserving the right to call 100% bullsh!t on this lack of buffs patch, but I am calling it like I see it, "not so good.""

... They nerfed 2 guns, and buffed 4. What?

We already have plenty of tools to deal with heavies. A well-timed spear shot will one shot chargers and hulks. Recoilless rockets deal with them pretty quickly, especially if you aim for a foreleg and then swap to primary. Autocannons can two-shot hulks if you aim well.

I haven't had a chance to experiment with the new flamethrower yet, but it should be pretty alright at handling chargers with a 50% dps buff.

And if you still want an anti-everything gun, the Arc Thrower exists unchanged.

The Spear that still has a bug unpatched making it not lock on properly? The Recoilless that thanks to a currently-unpatched bug/glitch by admission of the devs isn't breaking Charger armor reliably? The autocannon whose rounds bounce off heavy armor, unlike that of the AC Turret? And the Arc Cannon which still has the bug of occasionally firing "dud" shots that don't actually shoot?

Flamethrower seems interesting but, no pun intended here, everything else seems cooked.

The spear does occasionally seem flaky with its lock ons, and I avoided it because of how often I read it was useless.

But I've been using it the last 2-3 days on diff 8/9, and its been pleasantly surprising how good it is.

I've never seen this recoilless bug, every time I hit a leg, its popped the armor. And I used the recoilless extensively prior to the last few days. The AC rounds bouncing on heavy armor does seem like a bug, but its a manageable one. Go for the charger's tail, or the hulk's head. Two shots to a hulk's face is enough to kill it.