nProtect Gameguard From Three years ago, the trolls are getting out of hand...

[Dans_Tip]

https://www.reddit.com/r/PSO2/comments/i6w762/consensus_on_nprotect_gameguard/

This post above from three years ago covers all knowledge that you need to know about the issue people are presenting in the forums here.

[Dans_Tip]

Another post covering this "issue": https://www.reddit.com/r/pcgaming/comments/19d1v51/the_pc_version_of_helldivers_2_will_include_3rd/

[punchobastardo]

This looks much better to me:

https://steamcommunity.com/app/1549250/discussions/0/3388420307302919948/

[Dans_Tip]

Originally posted by punchobastardo:

This looks much better to me:

https://steamcommunity.com/app/1549250/discussions/0/3388420307302919948/

Ya this was a good one too

[punchobastardo]

Also, just because some have given up on the fundamentals of privacy and security it doesn't mean every one else is a troll, I would say quite the opposite is a fact actually.

[Dans_Tip]

Originally posted by punchobastardo:

Also, just because some have given up on the fundamentals of privacy and security it doesn't mean every one else is a troll, I would say quite the opposite is a fact actually.

I've played several games with anti cheats just like this and all you have to do is uninstall them after, its either people complaining about third person or anti cheat with new releases now a days. Its more trolling than giving information that's actual helpful. If they didn't have an in game store, which sounds like they will, they don't want hackers just freely stealing in game assets for free, you should have to buy them if they cost money, it supports development of the game itself, and paying for live servers if they aren't doing peer to peer or Lan co-op. For example EAC is used on several coop games and PVP games and it is "EAC is kernel level access but the problem is that devs slapped it on to the product at the last minute"

[Dans_Tip]

Issues like this happen without EAC or other similar anti cheats https://steamcommunity.com/app/671860/discussions/4/3801651941321943329/

[Dans_Tip]

"EAC (Easy Anti Cheat)" and "nProtect GameGuard" are both anti-cheat technologies used in online games to prevent cheating and hacking, but they operate and are implemented in somewhat different ways. Here's an overview of each and their key differences:

### Easy Anti Cheat (EAC)

- **Developer**: Originally developed by Kamu, a subsidiary of Epic Games since 2018.
- **Approach**: EAC is designed to operate in real-time, detecting cheats by scanning the memory, the game's files, and the activity in the system to identify known cheat signatures and suspicious behaviors.
- **Integration**: It can be integrated directly into the game or run as a separate service. EAC often requires players to have the anti-cheat running before starting the game to ensure a fair playing environment.
- **Community and Developer Support**: Offers tools and services for developers to easily integrate and manage anti-cheat measures. It is known for its community engagement, providing updates and patches to handle new cheats.
- **Games**: Used by a wide range of games, especially those on the Epic Games platform and various other multiplayer titles across different genres.

### nProtect GameGuard

- **Developer**: Developed by INCA Internet, a South Korean company.
- **Approach**: GameGuard includes features like rootkit-like functionality to prevent cheat software from running by operating at a low level within the system. It checks for unauthorized modification of game files and system monitoring to detect and prevent cheat software.
- **Integration**: Typically, GameGuard is packaged with the game and runs as a background service, closely monitoring for any cheating activities. It is known for being difficult to bypass, but this can sometimes lead to false positives or compatibility issues with legitimate software.
- **Community and Developer Support**: Provides a more closed system compared to EAC, with updates and cheat detection patterns managed by INCA Internet. It is less transparent to the end-users and developers regarding what is detected or how updates are implemented.
- **Games**: Primarily used in MMORPGs and other online games, especially popular in the Asian market.

### Key Differences

- **Approach to Detection**: EAC focuses on a combination of signature-based detection and behavioral patterns, whereas GameGuard operates more intrusively, with deep system scans and prevention techniques that can sometimes be seen as overly aggressive.
- **User Experience**: Players might find that EAC is less intrusive in terms of system performance and compatibility with other software, whereas GameGuard’s intensive scanning and prevention methods can lead to issues with false positives and compatibility with legitimate software.
- **Market Focus**: EAC is widely used in Western markets and across various game genres, while GameGuard has a strong presence in the Asian market, particularly with MMORPGs.
- **Developer Engagement**: EAC provides more tools and support for developers to integrate and manage the anti-cheat system within their games, promoting a community-driven approach to combat cheating. GameGuard, while effective, offers a more opaque system with less outward-facing support and community engagement.

Both technologies aim to provide secure and fair gaming environments but choose different paths to achieve this goal, reflecting in their adoption by different types of games and in different markets.

[noe]

Originally posted by Dans_Tip:

I've played several games with anti cheats just like this and all you have to do is uninstall them after, its either people complaining about third person or anti cheat with new releases now a days. Its more trolling than giving information that's actual helpful. If they didn't have an in game store, which sounds like they will, they don't want hackers just freely stealing in game assets for free, you should have to buy them if they cost money, it supports development of the game itself, and paying for live servers if they aren't doing peer to peer or Lan co-op. For example EAC is used on several coop games and PVP games and it is "EAC is kernel level access but the problem is that devs slapped it on to the product at the last minute"

My main concern with this anti-cheat thing is that supposedly it embeds itself into a deeper level of the computer than normal files, and can't be removed without going through a very specific process to do so. But at the same time I've found posts that claim you can delete it by simply just removing a few specific named files, so I'm not sure what to believe.

Apparently the developers have an uninstaller available on their website too, but I don't know this company so I have no way of knowing if the site is actually legitimate.

[Kiggles]

Uninstaller exists, and works. It still complicates matters, since uninstalling the GAME doesn't necessarily remove the rootkit. Where someone may be fine dealing with a potential vector for security breach temporarily, the onus is still on them to remember to uninstall nProtect.

This creates interesting problems for clients, since many people unaware of the security risk likely won't realize it exists on their system after the game is uninstalled. It isn't running, but it isn't updating itself either. If at any point in the future the latent version installed on your system is discovered to have a vulnerability, your entire system is compromised. Your fault for not maintaining it? Yup. But it does lead one to wonder whether the risk (which is purely hypothetical) is worth it in the first place.

[Dans_Tip]

Join the hell divers 2 Discord, the people trying to make this a big deal are either cheaters themselves or never wanted to buy the game in the first place and they're just trolling. Look it up get educated on the matter, is what I advise. Call of duty and many big title games all use these anti cheats, either buy the game or don't.

[Kiggles]

Originally posted by Dans_Tip:

either buy the game or don't.

OK

[Shibe]

Originally posted by Dans_Tip:

Join the hell divers 2 Discord, the people trying to make this a big deal are either cheaters themselves or never wanted to buy the game in the first place and they're just trolling. Look it up get educated on the matter, is what I advise. Call of duty and many big title games all use these anti cheats, either buy the game or don't.

If you've been around the last 20 years, you know never to touch anything from nProtect.

The game could have used EAC and there would be substantially less outrage.

[Dans_Tip]

Originally posted by Treat (Kiggles):

Originally posted by Dans_Tip:

either buy the game or don't.

OK

lol

[Dans_Tip]

Originally posted by Shibe:

Originally posted by Dans_Tip:

Join the hell divers 2 Discord, the people trying to make this a big deal are either cheaters themselves or never wanted to buy the game in the first place and they're just trolling. Look it up get educated on the matter, is what I advise. Call of duty and many big title games all use these anti cheats, either buy the game or don't.

If you've been around the last 20 years, you know never to touch anything from nProtect.

The game could have used EAC and there would be substantially less outrage.

This isn't just any company making the game. If this wasn't a well known Asian company they could of course be manipulating software within the game and taking peoples data, etc etc... Its happened before on Steam and games have either been banned or nobody touches them. This is Sony. Arrowhead is just the dev team, but essentially Sony are the bosses of arrow head since they own the rights and trade marks to Hell Divers and Hell Divers 2. That being said its already been "reported" to them by a small amount of people, and it seems like they'll either keep this or change it to EAC who knows, but either way it just goes deeper into your system to protect against hackers. EAC itself still Allows hackers to get into games and over all ruins the experience for others. DBD is a good example of hackers running rampant within the game and it has been going on for over 7 years.

[Venirto]

I've got my refund already (Steam will automatically process refund on pre-orders before game's release), the closer we are to release the more red flags start to appear. This is a PvE co-op online shooter without PvP yet they treat it as if it is a Free-2-Play competitive title.

Making a PSN account is already a risk given Sony's lack of security. Data leaks happen every few years and often we don't find out about them until weeks after they happen.[firewalltimes.com]. I was ready to tolerate online-only requirement even to play single player, I was fine with micro-transactions as well but GameGuard is the "straw that broke camel's back". They could have chosen any other anti-cheat and I would have been fine yet they've picked the worst possible option.

Think I'm over-exaggerating? Look up Steam discussions under Phantasy Star Online 2 and Undecember where this anti-cheat is present and look how many issues people have with it. Simply searching for "GameGuard" on PSO2 community page will give you over 25 pages with results.