Cluster nerfs are a bit too extreme

[dragon808tr]

So I was lucky enough to get cluster charges as my first new OC of season 5 and put it on my hurricane immediately. My reaction? Meh, it has potential with a very high skill ceiling like the old plasma burster missiles (before the pathing got fixed). The rockets fittingly move slow and hit hard if you dont explode, and if you do explode you need to predict enemy movements and then get the timing down. With a reduction in clusters and a further reduction in ammo it simply makes this OC not really worth taking over stock. I whiffed many of my cluster shots, was left very vulnerable in close-quarters situations, and post-nerf dosen't add anything meaningful to the gun. I really hope they revert these changes as I felt the OC as released was very fair, as it is a high skill weapon with large drawbacks.

Also please, PLEASE do not touch mortar rounds! Its the most fun I've had with the Autocannon!

[Chibbity]

Mortar rounds is definitely getting nerfed lol, it's pretty OP atm.

[Dwarfurious]

yeah i feel disgusted using mortar rounds, its crazy that big bertha is single target for half the damage

[Smetrix]

I really do not see what the big deal is lol. I’m still using it on haz 4-5 and it still works great.

[Frisky]

Originally posted by dragon808tr:

Also please, PLEASE do not touch mortar rounds! Its the most fun I've had with the Autocannon!

While I feel the same way in the fact it's some of the most fun I've had with this game, lets be realistic, it's probably gonna get nerfed

enjoy it while it lasts

[kestrel]

i genuinely do not understand why people thought this OC didn't need to be nerfed. you could kill an oppressor, an enemy with %66 explosive damage resistance, with enough clusters, on H5 with 4 players. it was ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ mental

it's still a solid option that requires skill to put off, you just can't bomb single targets for free anymore. and failing that, the GRS still has many strong options

[kestrel]

Originally posted by Frisky:

Originally posted by dragon808tr:

Also please, PLEASE do not touch mortar rounds! Its the most fun I've had with the Autocannon!

While I feel the same way in the fact it's some of the most fun I've had with this game, lets be realistic, it's probably gonna get nerfed

enjoy it while it lasts

i think the jury is still out on whether mortar should be nerfed. certainly its damage output is extreme, it's enough to out-DPS big bertha against some HVTs, but it comes with a lot of downsides. your only option for CC safety is the fear mod which isn't great and it deals a lot of friendly fire damage. the extremely low range coupled with its littany of downsides definitely doesn't make it a free upgrade in the way something like NTP was (is)

what's funny is that despite mortar leaning heavily into the autocannon's pre-existing flaws of crap accuracy and slow RoF, it actually feels substantially better to use than base AC or really any of its other overclocks. to be honest, i think that says more about base AC than it does mortar

[LoneHunta]

yeah it was just too good, as previous guy said, 5 ammo could kill a hz5 4p pretorian. But I'd rather they decreased the damage per bomblet instead of -2 bomblets, feels bad man.
Also mortar has huge draw backs, like
a) not being hitscan
b) slow, arching projectile
c) very inaccurate, and the penalty for missing shots is bigger as you have less ammo
d) huge friendly fire damage
e) can't see ♥♥♥♥ if you fire too many mortars too fast, enemies get a free smokescreen
but its very good anyways

[Frisky]

Originally posted by kestrel:

i think the jury is still out on whether mortar should be nerfed. certainly its damage output is extreme, it's enough to out-DPS big bertha against some HVTs, but it comes with a lot of downsides. your only option for CC safety is the fear mod which isn't great and it deals a lot of friendly fire damage. the extremely low range coupled with its littany of downsides definitely doesn't make it a free upgrade in the way something like NTP was (is)

fair points, I'm certainly more in favor of not nerfing it ATM but I wouldn't be too shocked/would understand mostly if it did happen, I'm getting the same feeling as NTP in some cases where I just wipe out everything infront of me short of an oppressor

also for close range CC I've found T5C to also be useful, the 50% dmg resistance paired with gunner's explosion resist minimizes self damage by a ton and makes it much safer to spare a few shots on yourself to get targets off you

I do think the ammo does help make the case that it may be balanced, if they do nerf it I hope they don't touch the ammo, I have had to make sure I don't go overboard shooting at something too much and the spread as you mentioned makes flying and faraway targets basically a no-go requiring a good secondary to pick those off so thinking about it more maybe it'll be fine as it is and spared of nerfs

Originally posted by kestrel:

what's funny is that despite mortar leaning heavily into the autocannon's pre-existing flaws of crap accuracy and slow RoF, it actually feels substantially better to use than base AC or really any of its other overclocks. to be honest, i think that says more about base AC than it does mortar

I think thats because mortar rounds actually justified the low accuracy and RoF of the cannon with shots that actually hit like something a cannon would do, which in general I do wish the autocannon had more of

part of the reason I use 1,1,3,1,3 composite drums so much before this update was because it leaned more into that "slow, accurate, heavy hitter" type thing I'd expect from the autocannon (IK big bertha is also an option but I really couldn't get into it with it's huge list of downsides)

[kestrel]

Originally posted by Frisky:

also for close range CC I've found T5C to also be useful, the 50% dmg resistance paired with gunner's explosion resist minimizes self damage by a ton and makes it much safer to spare a few shots on yourself to get targets off you

ordinarily i would agree, T5C is usually a great mod but i prefer tap-firing mortar due to its low mag/ammo count and high damage making it more efficient to count off individual shots
i basically never hold M1 so i never get to top RoF, ergo no T5C

I do think the ammo does help make the case that it may be balanced, if they do nerf it I hope they don't touch the ammo, I have had to make sure I don't go overboard shooting at something too much and the spread as you mentioned makes flying and faraway targets basically a no-go requiring a good secondary to pick those off so thinking about it more maybe it'll be fine as it is and spared of nerfs

im the opposite, if they have to nerf it in the end i'd rather they reduce its max ammo instead of lowering the damage or radius
or maybe reduce the firing speed further, such that it's as fast as tap-firing is anyway, and then i could run T5C comfortably

[dragon808tr]

Originally posted by kestrel:

Originally posted by Frisky:

While I feel the same way in the fact it's some of the most fun I've had with this game, lets be realistic, it's probably gonna get nerfed

enjoy it while it lasts

i think the jury is still out on whether mortar should be nerfed. certainly its damage output is extreme, it's enough to out-DPS big bertha against some HVTs, but it comes with a lot of downsides. your only option for CC safety is the fear mod which isn't great and it deals a lot of friendly fire damage. the extremely low range coupled with its littany of downsides definitely doesn't make it a free upgrade in the way something like NTP was (is)

what's funny is that despite mortar leaning heavily into the autocannon's pre-existing flaws of crap accuracy and slow RoF, it actually feels substantially better to use than base AC or really any of its other overclocks. to be honest, i think that says more about base AC than it does mortar

Honestly I havent touched the autocannon in years. its Gunners weakest option by a mile. NTP is just so stupidly OP that it is boring. I had my run with it but now im done with it. I usually stick to the minigun or the rockets. Having an option that feels like what carper bomber SHOULD have been is great! It's how something called an "autocannon" should handle! It's the most fun I've had in DRG in years and if they nerf it i'd be extremely dissapointed.
Honestly from what ive heard rotary overdrive is busted too since you can just proc agressive venting and never get touched. If anything should be nerfed its that, though I hope they lay off with nerfs, since its a PvE game and you really shouldn't nerf players especially when Haz 5+ exists now.

[kestrel]

Originally posted by dragon808tr:

Honestly I havent touched the autocannon in years. its Gunners weakest option by a mile. NTP is just so stupidly OP that it is boring. I had my run with it but now im done with it. I usually stick to the minigun or the rockets. Having an option that feels like what carper bomber SHOULD have been is great! It's how something called an "autocannon" should handle! It's the most fun I've had in DRG in years and if they nerf it i'd be extremely dissapointed.

i agree autocannon is generally pretty bad without NTP, it desperately needs an accuracy buff

Honestly from what ive heard rotary overdrive is busted too since you can just proc agressive venting and never get touched. If anything should be nerfed its that

RO doesn't need nerfs, it's not as good as LSLS or burning hell
spamming venting is nice but it causes you to chew through ammo fast, often faster than the amount of coolant you can hold

[kestrel]

Originally posted by Dyn:

What is NTP??? There is only minigun and rockets, outside of autocannon. And what is 5+? Isnt haz5 the max????

NTP is neurotoxin payload, an autocannon overclock

H5+ (or hazard 5+) is a new difficulty that lets you expand hazard 5 with customizable toggles such as more enemies spawned or increased damage taken

[Clumbernut]

Clusters still give you x7 the aoe and damage and you also stun everything because you're rolling that 25% stun chance 7 times

[Frisky]

Originally posted by kestrel:

ordinarily i would agree, T5C is usually a great mod but i prefer tap-firing mortar due to its low mag/ammo count and high damage making it more efficient to count off individual shots
i basically never hold M1 so i never get to top RoF, ergo no T5C

understandable, I usually hold down my mortar shots and I also use T2C so after the first shot I'm instantly at max RoF

I'll probably also give the fear mod a try some more, I'm sure it's highly useful I just prefer not to scatter what I'm trying to blow up

Originally posted by kestrel:

im the opposite, if they have to nerf it in the end i'd rather they reduce its max ammo instead of lowering the damage or radius
or maybe reduce the firing speed further, such that it's as fast as tap-firing is anyway, and then i could run T5C comfortably :viridian:

a firing speed reduction would be a nerf I'd be ok with, opting to undo it by taking one of the RoF mods or as mentioned leave it as is and have an instant RoF cap, I'd certainly not be upset at all if thats how they approached it

[Sokaku]

I just unlocked the cluster so no before vs after compare for me, but I honestly don't see what is to like about this OC. The Hold Reload mechanic is VERY off for me, several times in low-stress testing I found myself reloading the damned thing. The ROF means you're deploying 2 or maybe 3 missiles to get any cluster action happening before they hit something or a wall.... Personally I think this thing was built for one role, Helicopter Gunning.

I mean I thought using Pulse Burster was "baby-sitting" the Hurricane, but this is a new level of it, no thanks. I'll keep my Rocket Barrage build for sure where I get more ammo and can just fire and forget while on the move, Pulse Burster for when I want stuff dead fast, and Minelayer for craps & giggles on defensive missions.