Secondary to use with cryo cannon?

[chester]

I've been running cryo cannon + subata and the two seem to synergize really well. I'm running a typical cryo vampire build where I freeze enemies and finish them with drills at close range and subata/axes at long range, and use subata to kill far away mactera or cave leeches.

Most people seem to use epc with cryo, and I'm curious if there are any benefits to using it over subata (aside from mining obviously, but I have a scout and engi in my group that are on resource duty so I don't know how useful epc mining would be).

[True Winger]

Subata is probably the superior option.

I run EPC because I like to vaporize swarms with a well-timed TCF blast.

With Cryo, I like to use Ice Spear to vaporize regular grunts with ease. For heavies, I throw axes after they are frozen and that seems to be enough.

Although perhaps inefficient, on Haz 3/4 I like to optimize for brainlessness and/or fun. My Driller also has very poor long-range options, but I can drill so I don't have to engage at long-range if I don't want to.

[Aimee]

EPC mining is only realy useful on rare occasions, and its difficult to learn.

Most players use the EPC not because of the mining, but because it deals more damage per shot and has an high overall dps and total damage combined.
The Heavy Hitter OC with a single target damage build is quite good at bursting down priority targets.

Otherwise the Burning Nightmare (Tier 5) build also mops up enemies quite well. Especialy when frozen.

There are a decent amount of builds for the EPC, but you mainly go for single target or burning nightmare. AoE EPC builds are not great with the Cryocannon, but Persistent Plasma OC AoE build with the flamethrower does work quite well.

[SCamp]

Subata is always a good pick, especially for single-target weakpoints, frozen enemies and long-range performance.

Wave Cooker purely for thermal shock.

EPC for single-target with thermal shock or TCF utility. Basically you can have both single-target damage for general use and thermal shock against frozen targets, or you can have single-target damage against frozen targets and have all the utility that TCF provides.

EDIT: My old build for Thermal Shock was using Heavy Hitter EPC. I haven't used it in a long while so I don't know if they changed anything when they combined Flying Nightmare and Burning whateveritwascalled that would change the build.

[thebadman]

Wavecooker 11212 works pretty great. Stock or not as long as you are not slapping gamma contamination OC on it as you really feel loss of 86.6% ray AOE size... Did not try diffusion ray but it should probably be fine, swarmers still get 2tapped and while you might not hit swarm as hard you will have more ticks at same time so should even out at very least.

Just hose some bugs in swarm and you can freeze the rest with T3 mod, with enough bugs you basically have C4 cryo from all cold and boiler procs. dmg in 1st tier is kinda important for swarmers outside REZ and overall dps. Frozen prae can be killed with 2 axes as usual or you could throw one and use it to spread cold at other bugs while you stand next to it, grunts that are not guards have short freeze range after all.

[SCamp]

Originally posted by thebadman:

Wavecooker 11212 works pretty great. Stock or not as long as you are not slapping gamma contamination OC on it as you really feel loss of 86.6% ray AOE size... Did not try diffusion ray but it should probably be fine, swarmers still get 2tapped and while you might not hit swarm as hard you will have more ticks at same time so should even out at very least.

Just hose some bugs in swarm and you can freeze the rest with T3 mod, with enough bugs you basically have C4 cryo from all cold and boiler procs. dmg in 1st tier is kinda important for swarmers outside REZ and overall dps. Frozen prae can be killed with 2 axes as usual or you could throw one and use it to spread cold at other bugs while you stand next to it, grunts that are not guards have short freeze range after all.

I'd probably use 212x3/312x3. With Exothermic Reactor and Temperature Amplifier you can get 1-2 enemies frozen and then the wave cooker will chain-react frozen enemies into freezing other enemies you miss.

[Dwarfurious]

subata with clip size :v

[Aimee]

Originally posted by Dwarfurious:

subata with clip size :v

+5 clipsize in tier 1 will let you reload a lot longer per bullet, than if you take the -0.6 reload time.
So you will have a lot more downtime where you are not shooting with the increase in clipsize, strangely enough.
And with the fast firerate, low damage, and high ammo pool... you will reload a lot.

[MrPurple33]

To Start Off With- I'm Biased-
I'm an "Old-School Driller" with the Flamethrower, Subata, and HE Grenades

BUT- Any Mix of FT, Cryo, Subata, and EPC Works- Heck The Sludge Pump has Good Potential and Useage- Only The Wave Cooker seems Like somewhat of a Joke Weapon to Me

Traditionally, the Driller Setup seems to favor either the Flamethrower+Subata,
especially with Volatile Bullets, or Cryo+EPC

But by all means, continue to utilize the Cryo with the Subata, because-

Originally posted by RickWinger:

Subata is probably the superior option.

Originally posted by SCamp:

Subata is always a good pick, especially for single-target weakpoints, frozen enemies and long-range performance.

Originally posted by Dwarfurious:

subata with clip size :v

and quite simply " 'Bata Is Better™ "

[RamsesIICP]

With ice your drills are your secondary, whichever other weapon you wanna bring is tertiary.

[Robin ;3 (she/her)]

EPC makes heat if you mod it correctly. Temperature shock, 1 shot frozen grunts.

[King Fossil]

Autopistol is usually pretty bad when used with cryo since it gets a lot of damage from its giant weakspot bonus and volatile bullets, and neither of them work against frozen enemies. You can try using it for shooting enemies at long range who aren't frozen so they still have weakspots, but it's still not that good without volatile, and hitting weakspots at long range on enemies who might be in the dark and moving on walls/ceilings at weird angles can be pretty hard. If you have explosive reload OC then it gets a lot better for sniping since it stops being weakspot reliant, but you probably don't.
Single shot plasma build does 25 damage per shot (40 if you have heavy hitter OC, but again, I guess you probably don't) and doesn't rely on bonuses so it's very good for killing frozen enemies and much more acceptable if you're bodyshotting spitters on walls, even if it's harder to actually hit them since it's not hitscan. Or you can do a shock combo build and spam explosions to wipe out groups. Especially useful against mactera since it one shots them. It's just more useful in most circumstances.
Don't forget microwave either. It's not so good vs single targets but it's fun to sweep over a group of frozen enemies and instant kill them all with temp shock. Though that's a lot better with diffusion ray OC. Which you probably don't have. Again. Curse you OC system.

[SCamp]

Originally posted by King Fossil:

Autopistol is usually pretty bad when used with cryo since it gets a lot of damage from its giant weakspot bonus and volatile bullets, and neither of them work against frozen enemies. You can try using it for shooting enemies at long range who aren't frozen so they still have weakspots, but it's still not that good without volatile, and hitting weakspots at long range on enemies who might be in the dark and moving on walls/ceilings at weird angles can be pretty hard. If you have explosive reload OC then it gets a lot better for sniping since it stops being weakspot reliant, but you probably don't.

IIRC, since it's been a while since I've run Cryo+Full-Auto Subata but if you take reload speed on full-auto Subata you should be able to 2-clip a frozen praetorian.

[King Fossil]

Originally posted by SCamp:

IIRC, since it's been a while since I've run Cryo+Full-Auto Subata but if you take reload speed on full-auto Subata you should be able to 2-clip a frozen praetorian.

I guess? Or you could take heavy hitter plasma and do it faster and with less ammo used. Not sure what your point is.

[Sokaku]

For freeze builds, my goto is Heavy Hitter +Burning Nightmare spec'd for single shot. You get temp shock to one-shot many frozen targets, plus for enemies that have freeze resist, swap to using the EPC to ignite, then chill for a shock. (goo bombers, rollers, Oppressors) This saves a tonne of ammo.

Suba is hitscan, but you'll use a lot more ammo compared to a HH EPC.

Cooker can be setup for superior temp shock potential, but I find it lacks punch when facing opponents resistant to freeze or at range.

[Rob DiGiorno]

to me the wave cooker is the perfect 2nd weapon for driller. i don't care about EPC mining THAT much, and the subata is just a boring pistol to me.

the cooker has lots of ammo, with mega power supply too, and can with pinpoint accuracy, pop bugs/mactera like a balloon across the map

this is where the driller absolutely suffers, and this thing fills that gap perfectly