What's the deal with the Nemesis?

[???]

Maybe I'm just bad at the game, I'll accept that one. But it seems like this thing just sucks? As an enemy it doesn't actually do much but move towards you, shoot out repulse shields and grab up to two dwarves for an (as far as I can tell) inescapable death with massive range. It can just casually break through walls and float so there isn't any real sense of terrain advantage or strategy beyond just fight it in a big open area. It's got a lot of HP, doesn't seem to drop anything of value, spits out massive amounts of large explosives when it dies.

Basically it doesn't add anything of value or interest to the game. It's not fun to deal with, for me and my friends personally, and it's stupidly hard to avoid if you don't want to deal with it. The only incentive, it feels like, to dealing with it is that it won't interrupt your mission; but for the resources it takes it feels like we might as well just abandon ship and restart.

[Tempus animae]

One Fire Greande from Gunner and it goes down... Not THAT much truoble..? DRiller with Flamer needs a few seconds...~

[wwwJam]

Nemesis is an odd duck.
Its strongest form of attack is its grab. So... why does it use a repulsion shot? It blocks your own shots, sure, but it also pushes you away. Why would it want to potentially push you away from its most lethal attack? I suppose in a narrow space it's a good defensive choice, but in a wide open space, it's literally to its own detriment.

It also has a huge payload of phase bombs... Which it refuses to use until it dies. It could force you to dance and potentially run closer to it by occasionally using them during active combat, but it just decides not to.

It's a very strangely designed enemy. I feel like it was meant to behave very differently than the end product. I personally imagined something much faster and more aggressive, with arm attacks similar to the Caretaker's arms, but it's really just a slowly hovering ball of "get too close and you die." People can argue that Detonators are the same, but Detonators don't fly, don't have a ranged attack, and can be slowed (even briefly frozen) in a variety of ways to quite good effect. The Nemesis also doesn't affect the environment like Detonators do, which is a shame. If the phase bombs (and its own explosion) left rather large craters, at least it'd have some kind of fun interaction there. I guess they didn't want to surprise people familiar with the Caretaker's phase bombs.

At the end of the day, I'm just trying to learn to accept its existence. I don't much like it, but it's clearly here to stay, at least for the season.

Originally posted by Zeitseele:

DRiller with Flamer needs a few seconds...~

Driller's my most played class, and even running Triple Filtered Fuel, I've only successfully ignited a single Nemesis, and it almost felt like a bug with how instant it was. Otherwise I can empty tank after tank into the big things and it just will not ignite. Am I missing something? I did see someone mention laying fire in the Nemesis' path. I figured it was a flying enemy, am I wrong and it actually has a much lower hitbox than I imagine, or something?

[phenir]

Originally posted by wwwJam:

Nemesis is an odd duck.
Its strongest form of attack is its grab. So... why does it use a repulsion shot? It blocks your own shots, sure, but it also pushes you away. Why would it want to potentially push you away from its most lethal attack? I suppose in a narrow space it's a good defensive choice, but in a wide open space, it's literally to its own detriment.

It also has a huge payload of phase bombs... Which it refuses to use until it dies. It could force you to dance and potentially run closer to it by occasionally using them during active combat, but it just decides not to.

It's a very strangely designed enemy. I feel like it was meant to behave very differently than the end product. I personally imagined something much faster and more aggressive, with arm attacks similar to the Caretaker's arms, but it's really just a slowly hovering ball of "get too close and you die." People can argue that Detonators are the same, but Detonators don't fly, don't have a ranged attack, and can be slowed (even briefly frozen) in a variety of ways to quite good effect. The Nemesis also doesn't affect the environment like Detonators do, which is a shame. If the phase bombs (and its own explosion) left rather large craters, at least it'd have some kind of fun interaction there. I guess they didn't want to surprise people familiar with the Caretaker's phase bombs.

At the end of the day, I'm just trying to learn to accept its existence. I don't much like it, but it's clearly here to stay, at least for the season.

Originally posted by Zeitseele:

DRiller with Flamer needs a few seconds...~

Driller's my most played class, and even running Triple Filtered Fuel, I've only successfully ignited a single Nemesis, and it almost felt like a bug with how instant it was. Otherwise I can empty tank after tank into the big things and it just will not ignite. Am I missing something? I did see someone mention laying fire in the Nemesis' path. I figured it was a flying enemy, am I wrong and it actually has a much lower hitbox than I imagine, or something?

I assumed the bombs were a last ditch effort from the rival company to get rid of you after the robot has failed since the bombs seem to teleport in from above. Basically, the nemesis is not carrying the bombs but the company knows you are near it since it died so they just bomb the area.
I also have trouble igniting them unless I get right up on them for radiance but that's suicidal. I'm guessing there is some mismatch between where the robot looks like it is and where it actually is and hitscan weapons don't have this issue.

[Action Gooseman]

Nemesis' power is purely in Murphy's Law. The majority of the time I come across it it's when the crap hits the fan and it being there is an actual problem.

[Kiaren]

I just hate that there is no way to dodge or escape from the claws. The only counter play is "don't get close". The effectiveness of that strat depends more on the level layout than any actions on your part.

I'd rather they act more like cave leech grabs, where Bosco or a friend could knock you out. But as it stands it is an "insta-kill" that takes an annoying 10 second animation.

[SCamp]

LazyMaybe made a video regarding methods of dealing with Nemesis:

https://youtu.be/Kcya_3vDzFA

[Ackranome]

Fire kills a Nem - everything else struggles.

[Sokaku]

In a team, you can get dropped if the Nemesis gets staggered, which is basically if one of the glowing hitboxes gets destroyed. Beyond that Heightened Senses will free you from a grab.

The Nemesis also has a beam or pulse ranged attack from it's eye.

I'd like to see some changes to the Nemisis such as having one of both of the grabber-arms use a scanning beam like the Caretaker arms, and "breaking" that hitbox causes that arm to retract for a short time, basically meaning no grab from that arm. And those arms should wave around a bit to make it a challenge to hit while they lock onto a target. Keeping it at range is fine for some situations where that is an option, but there should be an option to get in a bit closer to brawl it. I use Shield-Blocks as gunner to tie up Detonators especially on Escort and Salvage runs.

[BlackFoxSamaki]

I do kinda wish the Nemesis would drop goodies when it's defeated, especially since it feels sort of like a mini-boss. Right now there doesn't seem to be much reason to engage it if you don't have to. I would for sure hunt the suckers down though if they dropped some minerals or something when they went boom. Right now I guess the main satisfaction is making the company proud! (Am I cool yet, mission control?)

[King Fossil]

Originally posted by SCamp:

LazyMaybe made a video regarding methods of dealing with Nemesis:

I see a large shooting range like area in this video. Pretty sure the devs have said that's an impossible dream so I guess the video must be a hoax.
Really though, that's a good video. I didn't realise sticky flames worked so well. Better remember that.

[Nihil]

Originally posted by Zeitseele:

One Fire Greande from Gunner and it goes down... Not THAT much truoble..? DRiller with Flamer needs a few seconds...~

When you play on Haz1, sure.


The NEmesis as wwwJam said up there is an "odd duck"
I don't completely get the design decision behind it. Or maybe i just didn't encounter it often enough.
But till now this game was perfectly balenced to be played in solo and in coop too.

But the nemesis has kicked that balance up into the clouds. It has that grap attack which you can't escape only if you have someone shooting the arms. It's like a mactera grabber or a cave leech. You need someone to save you. In solo you have Bosco. With 3-4 ppl even if the 2 arms have grabbed 2 dwarfes, you have someone to save you. But the struggle comes with 2 people. If both of you are in his claws......that's gg.

[OREGRIM]

I hope it is removed after this season.

[jajomba]

Originally posted by Nihil:

Originally posted by Zeitseele:

One Fire Greande from Gunner and it goes down... Not THAT much truoble..? DRiller with Flamer needs a few seconds...~

When you play on Haz1, sure.

Any other hazard as well, including 5
Check the video above

[TartanHaggis]

I've only encountered it once but it was just me and my mate playing so funnily enough it was game over. It's OP against two dwarfs.

[Fallenbox]

its not hard to kill, just very underwheling