My review on the Hurricane Guided Rocket System. Or maybe a rant?

[Varagonax]

I want to preface this by saying that its fun, and that other then a few of its most glaring flaws, it's not the worst weapon I have ever used in vidya gaems, and above all, this is just my opinion. So here goes.

This weapon is bad, at least without over clocks.

I do want to explain myself. Its not that its unusable, doesn't do damage or doesn't have its role amongst the other weapons... its just in how it performs in comparison to the other weapons available to the gunner. It does function just fine in solo matches, but when you play with a team it suffers, big time.

1: Its a primary weapon. Its intended to be your primary damage dealer, but in terms of how fast it can kill things, when you play with others and you are "competing for kills", its ability to redirect is overshadowed by your team mates being able to step in and kill those things you were shooting at. It partially makes up for it by allowing you to redirect your shots, but all this does is effectively improve your ammo efficiency. This is because of

2: Its slow projectile speed, even with the improved speed options. Because of its guided nature, of course it has to have a manageable projectile speed, but this overall works against it in a team setting. The skill ceiling this provides makes it fun to learn, but in the time it takes for you to shoot, THEN aim the shot, your team mates can often just deal with threat. I find myself to be finding priority targets only to, mid shot, realise another keen eyed player has identified the big threat and chosen to engage with it. This means that in practice, the weapon tends to fall apart in larger fights against all but the most inept teams. Of course, there is also

3: The fact that more then any other weapon, you need to be extremely aware of your team mates positions. I don't believe that I've ever KILLED a team mate before, but the amount of times I'm guiding a salvo of missiles into a swarm only to have another player wander in front of my to better guide their shots. This isn't something that you can always avoid, either. Sometimes the mission objectives require you to sit tight with each other, or the terrain forces the enemies and therefore the players to readjust positioning in unoptimal situations. Not only is it a problem when your team mates just wander in front of you, but unlike any other weapon

4: its primary quirk is a huge hindrance to its actual performance. Everything else about this game can be a huge detriment to its performance as, again, a primary weapon. Everything needs to be accounted for, from terrain generation, to whether or not your in a too-tight-space, to whether or not your team mate is just going to casually soak an entire stream of missiles because they needed to step closer to the enemies to get within THEIR optimal range.

See, it functions like a low burst, high dps version of the grenade launcher but UNLIKE the grenade launcher, which is a secondary and hugely benefits from treating it as such (such as using its limited ammo pool to deal with huge health targets or massive swarms), the Hurricane is a primary weapon, and as such benefits most from treating it as such.

Now I do not know how they can make this weapon better at base, without taking away what makes it unique. And I know there are overclocks that make it function better, but in my humble opinion, you shouldn't have to have an overclock to make the most of the weapon since I think that the best designed overclocks are the ones that ultimately impact its play style, not its function, and that a gun shouldn't only BECOME good BECAUSE of certain overclocks.

But it is hard to want to use the weapon when the Thunderhead can do the same thing, basically, without the gimmick that makes it harder to use, with arguably better dps and not having to worry about literally every rock and possible team mate that might get in the way.

Now, this is just my experience with the weapon so far. I DO think its fun to play with, but it just seems to be missing... something, and it does suck to use it as a gunner, which already has an identity crisis imo, because it feels like you're just nerfing yourself for a gimmick weapon.

Please do be polite, this is purely opinion, I could be very wrong or might have misplaced issues with the weapon. But I DO welcome discussion.

[Skearn]

MeToLee の投稿を引用：

I dont get it why is it so important who gets the kills? who cares who got the last hit? as long as you hit the targets too you're doing your part.

its more so important to know where to put firepower where its needed, minigun generally on bigger targets and AC on larger clusters, protecting the team from the more immediate threats based on the weapon you have and how you build it^^

dont think i needed to explain that but i felt like it^^

[Droolguy]

Skearn の投稿を引用：

i use bullet hell on minigun and like combat mobility on my AC so the middle road has always been my preferred approach.

This is why we will never have nice things. People defend stuff based entirely on emotional attachment and not reality.

As an example, Skean here uses the worst overclocks for the mini by choice because "he likes them", and the fact that he likes them is all the justification he needs. Does it handicap the team? Yes. Does he care? Probably not.

It is the basis for every single balance argument on the forums.

Emotionally driven players vs. fact driven players.

The emotionally driven players almost universally assume that you can't change anything ever for fear of ruining their fun, completely disregarding the fact that their fun and mechanical changes to the weapon are not tied together at all and you can change one without appreciably changing the other.

It is the defining reason that DRG is by all accounts a failure, having never had consistent solid player numbers despite being one of the highest rated games on steam. It spikes on every release and then quickly dies off when people realize it's the same old problems not being fixed.

The hurricane is "fun to use" for *some* players but functionally anemic compared to other options, you can fix the hurricane without actually changing how it is used at all with just moving numbers around.

What people find fun is not universal, and therefore can not be used as the basis for an argument.

EDIT: Sorry for dumping all that on you Skean, you just provided the initial example, the rest is a generalized statement to the community as a whole. I re-read it after posting and realize it could easily come across as being entirely directed toward you.

[Skearn]

Droolguy の投稿を引用：

Skearn の投稿を引用：

i use bullet hell on minigun and like combat mobility on my AC so the middle road has always been my preferred approach.

This is why we will never have nice things. People defend stuff based entirely on emotional attachment and not reality.

As an example, Skean here uses the worst overclocks for the mini by choice because "he likes them", and the fact that he likes them is all the justification he needs. Does it handicap the team? Yes. Does he care? Probably not.

act i had an entire thread on that, bullet hell can trump quite a few minigun builds in total damage done

with the damage mod, stun and max rof extra damage allows it to do 10.35 damage per target on 2 targets with 1 bullet.
sure its not the best for taking down praets and dreads but it still does that neatly, combined with my homebrew OC bulldog with neuro and sticky/incendiary grenades and you can do extremely well with it^^

[Chibbity]

I'm using the minelayer OC and I love it.

Now watch Droolguy go insane lol.

[Skearn]

Droolguy の投稿を引用：

EDIT: Sorry for dumping all that on you Skean, you just provided the initial example, the rest is a generalized statement to the community as a whole. I re-read it after posting and realize it could easily come across as being entirely directed toward you.

no offence taken, but i am interested what you think of my post before this 1 regarding bullet hell and why i consider it worthwhile

[Droolguy]

Skearn の投稿を引用：

act i had an entire thread on that, bullet hell can trump quite a few minigun builds in total damage done

with the damage mod, stun and max rof extra damage allows it to do 10.35 damage per bullet on 2 targets with 1 bullet.
sure its not the best for taking down praets and dreads but it still does that neatly, combined with my homebrew OC bulldog with neuro and sticky/incendiary grenades and you can do extremely well with it^^

No, it can't.

1. It does not reflect 100% of shots right out the gate.
2. The reflect will hit armor far more likely than soft tissue or weakpoints.
3. Half the damage relies on their being 2 targets within close proximity.
4. It reduces your accuracy by a ginormous amount making consistent weakpoint hits on smaller targets a literal impossibility outside of near point blank range.

In a mathematicians wet dream where you never use it in a situation that isn't optimally suited for it, it barely breaks even.

You know why you like it? Because it's easy, point in a direction and just go "Minigun go BRRRRRRRRR", and you'll hit stuff. It requires the least skill, but has the lowest skill ceiling. It "feels" good to use because it doesn't require effort.

Same issue with the hurricane, it "feels" good because your landing consistent hits, that doesn't mean that it's actually performing better.

[Droolguy]

Chibbity の投稿を引用：

I'm using the minelayer OC and I love it.

Now watch Droolguy go insane lol.

Yep. Sad thing is concept is fine, execution is beyond horrible. Par for the course in DRG.

[Chibbity]

Droolguy の投稿を引用：

Yep. Sad thing is concept is fine, execution is beyond horrible. Par for the course in DRG.

Haha, mines go BRRRRRR.

[Droolguy]

Chibbity の投稿を引用：

Droolguy の投稿を引用：

Yep. Sad thing is concept is fine, execution is beyond horrible. Par for the course in DRG.

Haha, mines go BRRRRRR.

I know it's not what you meant... but it did make me think... if they actually made them cryo mines that would fix them, as the freeze damage bonus for the group and extra CC would very handily make up for it sucking in virtually every other category.

[Chibbity]

Droolguy の投稿を引用：

I know it's not what you meant... but it did make me think... if they actually made them cryo mines that would fix them, as the freeze damage bonus for the group and extra CC would very handily make up for it sucking in virtually every other category.

Hey now, that's an idea.

I certainly wouldn't complain.

[Skearn]

Droolguy の投稿を引用：

Skearn の投稿を引用：

act i had an entire thread on that, bullet hell can trump quite a few minigun builds in total damage done

with the damage mod, stun and max rof extra damage allows it to do 10.35 damage per bullet on 2 targets with 1 bullet.
sure its not the best for taking down praets and dreads but it still does that neatly, combined with my homebrew OC bulldog with neuro and sticky/incendiary grenades and you can do extremely well with it^^

No, it can't.

1. It does not reflect 100% of shots right out the gate.
2. The reflect will hit armor far more likely than soft tissue or weakpoints.
3. Half the damage relies on their being 2 targets within close proximity.
4. It reduces your accuracy by a ginormous amount making consistent weakpoint hits on smaller targets a literal impossibility outside of near point blank range.

In a mathematicians wet dream where you never use it in a situation that isn't optimally suited for it, it barely breaks even.

You know why you like it? Because it's easy, point in a direction and just go "Minigun go BRRRRRRRRR", and you'll hit stuff. It requires the least skill, but has the lowest skill ceiling. It "feels" good to use because it doesn't require effort.

Same issue with the hurricane, it "feels" good because your landing consistent hits, that doesn't mean that it's actually performing better.

good points but the accuracy mod makes it good enough by putting it at 150%, yep armour do be a thing but that is also situational so unless you can make an accurate average it will only be a situational downside, you only use it on multiple targets (using a multi-target OC on singular targets isnt recommended unless the bulldog is empty (which is why i said it still did it neatly before))

why do i like it? because i love the orks from warhammer 40K, doesnt have anything to do with easy.

the hurricane i like because i actually make it work through more than just stats wich you may or may not have readt before in this thread, even better, because of the way the weapon behaves and its allocation of stats it allows me to pull some insane strings because i now have a weapon with a radius of 2, a ROF of 4 and 25% chance of stunning everyone in that radius for 3 sec allowing me to hammer them further and other enemy that breaks through during or after gets the same treatment.

im doing better/same with the hurricane than i did with a compact feed OC minigun with damage mods, a minigun "ammojunky" or a minigun that sports 14-16 damage.
on single target? no, thats why i called it a generalist weapon, its a hybrid with the typical hybrid problem of being spread thin thats why it needs creativity to boost it to a good lvl.

im not saying bullet hell is best, neither is the hurricane statistically best, i am saying that it can be put up to a lvl that makes it great enough to not under perform and burden other ppl through it.

if its all the same to you than just to ignore this post, i enjoy the convo tho^^

[Cyber Erox]

Play the hurricane max range and overclock for range too and use zipline (the thing no one use xD) for get the high ground (ask for engineer to make a platform for prevent falling) and you'll be able to shoot all over the map for cover your team's back you can also launch you're shield where he is needed (for T5 the napalm is good for damage and stun is good for help your team if they need to escape ^^)

In that strategies your Hurricane would be shine (not meta but funny like i say xD) and the bonus is : that give a zipline a real utility ! xD

[Skearn]

Cyber Erox の投稿を引用：

Play the hurricane max range and overclock for range too and use zipline (the thing no one use xD) for get the high ground (ask for engineer to make a platform for prevent falling) and you'll be able to shoot all over the map for cover your team's back you can also launch you're shield where he is needed (for T5 the napalm is good for damage and stun is good for help your team if they need to escape ^^)

In that strategies your Hurricane would be shine (not meta but funny like i say xD) and the bonus is : that give a zipline a real utility ! xD

nice xD

[Professor Hugedix]

Cyber Erox の投稿を引用：

Play the hurricane max range and overclock for range too and use zipline (the thing no one use xD) for get the high ground (ask for engineer to make a platform for prevent falling) and you'll be able to shoot all over the map for cover your team's back you can also launch you're shield where he is needed (for T5 the napalm is good for damage and stun is good for help your team if they need to escape ^^)

In that strategies your Hurricane would be shine (not meta but funny like i say xD) and the bonus is : that give a zipline a real utility ! xD

Helicopter gunner + Leaf lover + Necro + Ratio

[Unn4m3d (♥AUT♥)]

Cyber Erox の投稿を引用：

Play the hurricane max range and overclock for range too and use zipline (the thing no one use xD) for get the high ground (ask for engineer to make a platform for prevent falling) and you'll be able to shoot all over the map for cover your team's back you can also launch you're shield where he is needed (for T5 the napalm is good for damage and stun is good for help your team if they need to escape ^^)

In that strategies your Hurricane would be shine (not meta but funny like i say xD) and the bonus is : that give a zipline a real utility ! xD

That certainly was a necessary necro.