Concerns about LOK-1 Smart Rifle for Engineer

[Anker]

I'm still downloading this game, but I've seen my fair share of lock on weapons in video games.

And they suck.

It feels like virtually every time a lock on weapon is introduced, it is slammed with the nerf b bat harder then any other kind of weapon. It will inevitably be the worst option available for weapons, and it's ease of aim, comparatively, will be made worse by crippling some other stat far too much.

My guess is it'll be the ammo counter, or lower damage per shot compared to everything else of it's class or range, or slow firing rate due to lock on (this is actually a reasonable downside... and the one I usually see the least, accordingly)

So, simply given the knee jerk balancing reaction of Every Game Dev I've Ever Seen towards this class of weapon, I'm concerned it'll end up at the bottom of the engineering pile. The best balanced one I've heard of was Titanfall 2's smart pistol (Can be outplayed by sufficiently agile players, and it's main downside is being transient with low ammo), and the worst is that godawful pistol Warframe has (With one shot or so per second compared to an automatic fire rate of 11 or so, it's literally ten times worse to shoot in semi auto lock-on then in auto mode for the weapon itself, let alone in comparison to other weapons).

So, in short, please try to keep it reasonable. Make it competitive with the other weapons, make it on equal footing with the other guns in harsh Modifiers or Deep Dives, make it good enough that people don't kick off any engineer trying to use this thing. It doesn't have to be the best gun- It just shouldn't be the easily-agreed-upon worst.

EDIT: I have gotten the lok-on rifle, and lo and behold, it is pretty much exactly as I feared. Low damage (five bullets to kill one unarmored grunt, with about thirty per mag), low ammo reserves (I ran out of ammo CONSTANTLY)

Yes, the staples of the '♥♥♥♥♥♥ lock-on weapon genre' are all here, unfortunately... Here's hoping they buff it. I spend all my ammo and feel like I'm getting nothing out of it, which with a weapon that means I SHOULD be hitting all of my shots, is just sad. The ammo issue is extremely prevalent even on short missions, and is hands down it's biggest flaw.

[Jaynoble55]

"I'm still downloading this game". It is really best to play it first before commenting. Hate to be that guy, but someone has to :(

[DjSpicy]

hes just giving his input from past experiences?

[SCamp]

Just a heads up: The only gotcha with this weapon is that with the SM4RT bullets mod will sometimes not kill targets.

It's a combination of two things:

1) Because some shots may hit armour and be reduced, there tends to be one or two shots that do reduced damage.
2) SM4RT bullets only "does just enough to kill" based on gun damage and enemy health. It doesn't take armor into consideration at all. It's good for maximizing targets hit, but by itself doesn't do too good at finishing enemies.

The solutions:
- Take one of the max lock mods in the final tier (shock or extra damage) and achieve max locks.
- Not use SM4RT bullets so you can overlock and get the final bullet in, with the sacrifice that it's harder to maximize the number of enemies hit. I believe the gun stops firing once enemies are dead, so it's no big deal.

[Frisky]

Originally I was pretty worried about the lok-1 as well, talked a lot about parts of the weapon I felt like were lacking
while some of those old points still stand (3-lock gimmicks aren't great, having more locks is less effective than having less locks generally, low ammo) The weapon has grown on me since it's come out, it takes a bit of practice since you basically have to aim it differently but the weapon has honestly been fun to use and hasn't felt so weak that it's not good at all

granted I'm leaning on an overclock which I think helps bring it up to power with the other weapons (execution since it lowers your max locks making it easier to spam extra lock damage) and I still bring the ammo upgrade on it I do think it's just a TINY bit underpowered but not enough to make the weapon bad

I don't think I've ever flipped my opinion on a weapon in a game this hard lol I hated this thing when i first used it but now I find it tons of fun

HONESTLY if it follows the engineer trend of engineer weapons coming out being underpowered then being buffed to become really good then I wouldn't worry too much anyways. Thing might randomly become stupid strong a few months from now

TL;DR, Weapon isn't so underpowered it's bad like i thought, but could do with a tiny bit of tweaking

[Mokiel]

have you tried smart pistol from Titanfall 2

[Billy]

Personally I adore the smart rifle, the simple fact it quickly locks onto things like the little swarmers was something I was dying to find for my dwarf. I can handle anything in the game at this point but those swarming bastards were such a chore for engi.

[Evill Bob]

It almost requires a overclock but it's not a terrible weapon, especially against anything that flies.

[ColtPiecemaker]

I like how you can arc bullets over and around terrain once you get a lock, allows you to do a top-down attack and hit things you cant quite see normally. I'm trying to figure out a solid build, but I need to get some more OC's first. I just hope they fix the SM4RT upgrade not quite finishing off enemies; perhaps it should also take armor into account.

[SCamp]

Originally posted by Evill Bob:

It almost requires a overclock but it's not a terrible weapon, especially against anything that flies.

I actually don't think it requires an overclock to be good; maybe better against some enemies and avoid the SMRT bullet problem with the ignore armour OC.

I'm running the green OC that increases number of locks and mag size. I don't feel like I need it. As far as the base weapon goes, it's in a really good place.

[Evill Bob]

Originally posted by SCamp:

Originally posted by Evill Bob:

It almost requires a overclock but it's not a terrible weapon, especially against anything that flies.

I actually don't think it requires an overclock to be good; maybe better against some enemies and avoid the SMRT bullet problem with the ignore armour OC.

I'm running the green OC that increases number of locks and mag size. I don't feel like I need it. As far as the base weapon goes, it's in a really good place.

I did say it ALMOST needs a overclock, though in comparison to the Engie's other primary options I do find it a little lacking. That isn't to say I'm going to stop using it but odds are it's not coming with me on a Elite Deep Dive.

[Anker]

Originally posted by elMOKI:

have you tried smart pistol from Titanfall 2

Not recently, for obvious reasons. (Rip TF...) And even then, it's not the best, it's just... Well, the best lock on weapons have seen in a game.

[Ender Zayne]

It's pretty balanced here. The auto-lock centers on bugs, which doesn't allow for aiming at weak spots unless you fire from a certain angle. I understand how this is to keep it from being overpowered, which I respect. It also isn't useless, as it still helps thin out hordes and deal good damage to bugs on ceilings.

I've been pretty impressed by the new weapons so far. None of them are overpowered or underpowered.

[ReaperLord]

Originally posted by Anker:

Originally posted by elMOKI:

have you tried smart pistol from Titanfall 2

Not recently, for obvious reasons. (Rip TF...) And even then, it's not the best, it's just... Well, the best lock on weapons have seen in a game.

Have you tried any of the smart guns from Cyberpunk 2077? The gyrojet ammo or the minimissiles from Xenoraptor? Have you tried the thermo gun from Everspace 1 and 2? Have you tried any of the smart or guided weapons from Jets N' Guns 2?

Back to DRG...

I usually play on Haz 3, it can take 4 or shots from the LOK1 to kill a grunt at their full health, though I don't have any overclocks for the gun yet.

[DJDiceZ]

Originally posted by ReaperLord:

Originally posted by Anker:

Not recently, for obvious reasons. (Rip TF...) And even then, it's not the best, it's just... Well, the best lock on weapons have seen in a game.

Have you tried any of the smart guns from Cyberpunk 2077? The gyrojet ammo or the minimissiles from Xenoraptor? Have you tried the thermo gun from Everspace 1 and 2? Have you tried any of the smart or guided weapons from Jets N' Guns 2?

Back to DRG...

I usually play on Haz 3, it can take 4 or shots from the LOK1 to kill a grunt at their full health, though I don't have any overclocks for the gun yet.

Yeah, the smart guns in Cyberpunk 2077 had some pretty OP builds. Also, Gunfire Reborn's Rainbow is deceivingly strong, and let's not forget how much rage OW's Symmetra caused (for those on the receiving end).

[Tall Giraffe]

I kinda wish there was a way for the gun to target weakpoints specifically (Like an overclock,) But I have been enjoying the gun for the most part.