HL2 in VR mode vs HLA in pancake mode

[PainkilleR]

Hey all!

I noticed a lot of people who played HL2 in VR mode say that it is awesome and is even more fun than HL:A (minus some bugs ofc).

So my question is why exactly does HL2 (which is designed with pancake controls in mind) translate to VR so well (and is arguably a more fun VR experience than HLA for some), while at the same time everyone who played HLA says that it will be a complete garbage in pancake mode?

[Titans of Time]

It's much easier to convert a 2D game to VR than the other way around. When you are converting 2D to VR you just have to add a couple things here and there to get it functional. When converting a game that was specifically designed for VR to 2D so much is lost in translation.

Basically in once case you are adding stuff, not a big deal. But in the other you are stripping it down.

[JNK]

Because basically (almost) everything is better in Vr.

Have you used Vr yet?

In Vr every object has the right scale, you are very immersed in the expierence, everything looks just like in reality and like you are just there. That expierence is always superior to watching something just on the screen.

You can compare it to visiting a sightseeing vs just watching a video or photo of that said sightseeing.

What do you think is better? Seeing a picture of the eifeltower or beeing in Paris and standing right in front of it?

For most people it’s way better to really be there - that’s why people spend thousand of euros to travel to certain locations instead of just use google and look at a photo.


You could play every normal flat game in Vr, have all the Vr benefits and still use your normal flat controls. It would still be better. Way better presence/immersive/visual expience with same controls.

Vr Games usually are even better because they just arnt just flat Games with better presence/immersion/visuals but they also allow for realistic controls. In Vr you can move your hands and head just like in real life. So you arnt just pressing buttons but you are really doing the actions 1:1 for the most part.
The games are designed around this possibilities and just don’t translate good on the limitations a keyboard and mouse give you. If you are going with your hands through dozens of objects in a shelf to find some bullets hidden between these - how do you want to pull such an action off with just button pressed and a mouse?

[Dr.Unfähig]

HL Alyx is obviously superior as a VR game because it's built from ground up for VR. Most important are the VR motion control interactions with your guns, inventory (ammo) and the environment which are very well executed in a native VR game like Alyx.

I also play HL2 with the gmod VR mod sometimes. The only thing I like more about that is that it doesn't give a ♥♥♥♥ about comfort. Valve made Alyx as comfortable as possible for most people which results in a rather slow gameplay compared to the previous games on flatscreen. Also I missed a vehicle level in Alyx, those are some of my favourite levels especially in HL2.
But overall playing HL2 in VR is still not that enjoyable because it runs via gmod and often causes problems for me. I played almost the entire game again using the VR MOD and I wouldn't recommend it, at least if you want a polished experience like Alyx.

to answer your question: Original flatscreen games in VR are great because of the huge level of immersion, especially in first person games. The other way around it's not working because native VR games have deep interactions with motion controls which would be impossible or at least very complicated to perform with mouse/keyboard, it just wouldn't be any fun.

[Zero001]

It is easier to mod PC to VR, but not really the other way around.

It does not mean that a PC to VR port will always end up being good or balanced. Payday2 has a VR mode, and VR players have a few advantages that PC players do not.

[Titans of Time]

Originally posted by Dr.Unfähig ♥ Ariana:

HL Alyx is obviously superior as a VR game because it's built from ground up for VR. Most important are the VR motion control interactions with your guns, inventory (ammo) and the environment which are very well executed in a native VR game like Alyx.

I also play HL2 with the gmod VR mod sometimes. The only thing I like more about that is that it doesn't give a ♥♥♥♥ about comfort. Valve made Alyx as comfortable as possible for most people which results in a rather slow gameplay compared to the previous games on flatscreen. Also I missed a vehicle level in Alyx, those are some of my favourite levels especially in HL2.
But overall playing HL2 in VR is still not that enjoyable because it runs via gmod and often causes problems for me. I played almost the entire game again using the VR MOD and I wouldn't recommend it, at least if you want a polished experience like Alyx.

The Ravenholm sequence in VR was freaking amazing though. The fast zombies jumping at me (even though bugged due to GMOD), was absolutely horrifying.

[Dr.Unfähig]

Originally posted by ^tchaosvh:

Originally posted by Dr.Unfähig ♥ Ariana:

HL Alyx is obviously superior as a VR game because it's built from ground up for VR. Most important are the VR motion control interactions with your guns, inventory (ammo) and the environment which are very well executed in a native VR game like Alyx.

I also play HL2 with the gmod VR mod sometimes. The only thing I like more about that is that it doesn't give a ♥♥♥♥ about comfort. Valve made Alyx as comfortable as possible for most people which results in a rather slow gameplay compared to the previous games on flatscreen. Also I missed a vehicle level in Alyx, those are some of my favourite levels especially in HL2.
But overall playing HL2 in VR is still not that enjoyable because it runs via gmod and often causes problems for me. I played almost the entire game again using the VR MOD and I wouldn't recommend it, at least if you want a polished experience like Alyx.

The Ravenholm sequence in VR was freaking amazing though. The fast zombies jumping at me (even though bugged due to GMOD), was absolutely horrifying.

Yeah it's really scary at times. I still hope for the greenlit HL2 VR Mod to release to fix those Gmod issues, but it seems kinda dead to me at this point

[PainkilleR]

Originally posted by Dr.Unfähig ♥ Ariana:

HL Alyx is obviously superior as a VR game because it's built from ground up for VR. Most important are the VR motion control interactions with your guns, inventory (ammo) and the environment which are very well executed in a native VR game like Alyx.

I also play HL2 with the gmod VR mod sometimes. The only thing I like more about that is that it doesn't give a ♥♥♥♥ about comfort. Valve made Alyx as comfortable as possible for most people which results in a rather slow gameplay compared to the previous games on flatscreen. Also I missed a vehicle level in Alyx, those are some of my favourite levels especially in HL2.
But overall playing HL2 in VR is still not that enjoyable because it runs via gmod and often causes problems for me. I played almost the entire game again using the VR MOD and I wouldn't recommend it, at least if you want a polished experience like Alyx.

I see... So the problem is those comfort features you say?

I have only seen people play HL2/HLA in VR and never played them myself, but for some reason it's more fun/funny to see people play HL2 in VR. It's just that in HLA gameplay videos enemies don't move around much and everything is so slow and I don't know how to put it but... everything feels glued to the ground for some reason?

P.S. I mean, people make funny gestures with hands and stuff in HLA, but overall gameplay feels better in HL2VR.

P.P.S. Yeah, I like all vehicle levels in HL2 as well!

[Titans of Time]

Originally posted by Dr.Unfähig ♥ Ariana:

Originally posted by ^tchaosvh:

The Ravenholm sequence in VR was freaking amazing though. The fast zombies jumping at me (even though bugged due to GMOD), was absolutely horrifying.

Yeah it's really scary at times. I still hope for the greenlit HL2 VR Mod to release to fix those Gmod issues, but it seems kinda dead to me at this point

Yea after a polished VR specific experience like Alyx, it would be hard to go back and take it too seriously.

[Dr.Unfähig]

Originally posted by PainkilleR:

Originally posted by Dr.Unfähig ♥ Ariana:

HL Alyx is obviously superior as a VR game because it's built from ground up for VR. Most important are the VR motion control interactions with your guns, inventory (ammo) and the environment which are very well executed in a native VR game like Alyx.

I also play HL2 with the gmod VR mod sometimes. The only thing I like more about that is that it doesn't give a ♥♥♥♥ about comfort. Valve made Alyx as comfortable as possible for most people which results in a rather slow gameplay compared to the previous games on flatscreen. Also I missed a vehicle level in Alyx, those are some of my favourite levels especially in HL2.
But overall playing HL2 in VR is still not that enjoyable because it runs via gmod and often causes problems for me. I played almost the entire game again using the VR MOD and I wouldn't recommend it, at least if you want a polished experience like Alyx.

I see... So the problem is those comfort features you say?

I have only seen people play HL2/HLA in VR and never played them myself, but for some reason it's more fun/funny to see people play HL2 in VR. It's just that in HLA gameplay videos enemies don't move around much and everything is so slow and I don't know how to put it but... everything feels glued to the ground for some reason?

I mean comfort options are not a problem in general if it's all optional, but with Alyx you see that the whole game was designed for a slower and more comfortable gameplay, due to a fair amount of people easily getting motion sick from VR games.
As a person who has no problem with motion sickness I prefer a fast gameplay like in HL2 where you can also have a more action packed/ aggressive playstyle

[PainkilleR]

Originally posted by Dr.Unfähig ♥ Ariana:

Originally posted by PainkilleR:

I see... So the problem is those comfort features you say?

I have only seen people play HL2/HLA in VR and never played them myself, but for some reason it's more fun/funny to see people play HL2 in VR. It's just that in HLA gameplay videos enemies don't move around much and everything is so slow and I don't know how to put it but... everything feels glued to the ground for some reason?

I mean comfort options are not a problem in general if it's all optional, but with Alyx you see that the whole game was designed for a slower and more comfortable gameplay, due to a fair amount of people easily getting motion sick from VR games.
As a person who has no problem with motion sickness I prefer a fast gameplay like in HL2 where you can also have a more action packed/ aggressive playstyle

That's actually pretty sad (the fact that comfort features are not optional).

Seems like the problem is not that VR game can't be a good pancake game, but rather HLA can't be a good pancake game because of a very slow gameplay.

Guess that's the only reason why people say HLA will be bad in non-vr version? Or is there something else to it?

[LemonyNebula]

Different games.

Half Life 2 in VR is the same game as it is in flat, with the same interactions, level design, pacing and overall design.

Alyx is a game that is unlike the last games. It contains more interaction, smaller levels, slower pacing and a different design altogether. It has a focus on what works for VR, which is not as transferable to flat, as flat design is to VR.

Basically, if you play a flat game in VR, you get the same game with 'few' added benefits of VR (such as visual, but not so much interaction). If you play a VR game in flat, you get a cut down version of the game, as those added benefits where integral to the design.
So yeah, games work better when stuff is added, than when stuff is taken away.

[PainkilleR]

Originally posted by LemonyNebula:

Different games.

Half Life 2 in VR is the same game as it is in flat, with the same interactions, level design, pacing and overall design.

Alyx is a game that is unlike the last games. It contains more interaction, smaller levels, slower pacing and a different design altogether. It has a focus on what works for VR, which is not as transferable to flat, as flat design is to VR.

Basically, if you play a flat game in VR, you get the same game with 'few' added benefits of VR (such as visual, but not so much interaction). If you play a VR game in flat, you get a cut down version of the game, as those added benefits where integral to the design.
So yeah, games work better when stuff is added, than when stuff is taken away.

It's actually kind of strange if you think about it...

Imagine if HL2 was a VR-only game with HLA levels of interactivity and somebody would make a mod to turn it into a non-vr experience (into HL2 we know today). In the end it would still be a great game (because HL2 is a great game ).

But in case of HLA it would turn into a really bad game, huh?

[Titans of Time]

Originally posted by PainkilleR:

Originally posted by LemonyNebula:

Different games.

Half Life 2 in VR is the same game as it is in flat, with the same interactions, level design, pacing and overall design.

Alyx is a game that is unlike the last games. It contains more interaction, smaller levels, slower pacing and a different design altogether. It has a focus on what works for VR, which is not as transferable to flat, as flat design is to VR.

Basically, if you play a flat game in VR, you get the same game with 'few' added benefits of VR (such as visual, but not so much interaction). If you play a VR game in flat, you get a cut down version of the game, as those added benefits where integral to the design.
So yeah, games work better when stuff is added, than when stuff is taken away.

It's actually kind of strange if you think about it...

Imagine if HL2 was a VR-only game with HLA levels of interactivity and somebody would make a mod to turn it into a non-vr experience (into HL2 we know today). In the end it would still be a great game (because HL2 is a great game :gordon:).

But in case of HLA it would turn into a really bad game, huh?

If HL2 was designed as a VR exclusive, it would also suck as a pancake game...

Seems like you are trying to validate your already cemented opinion.

Just try VR, stop trying to guess why we are telling you how great it is and just experience it yourself.

[Zero001]

Originally posted by PainkilleR:

Originally posted by LemonyNebula:

Different games.

Half Life 2 in VR is the same game as it is in flat, with the same interactions, level design, pacing and overall design.

Alyx is a game that is unlike the last games. It contains more interaction, smaller levels, slower pacing and a different design altogether. It has a focus on what works for VR, which is not as transferable to flat, as flat design is to VR.

Basically, if you play a flat game in VR, you get the same game with 'few' added benefits of VR (such as visual, but not so much interaction). If you play a VR game in flat, you get a cut down version of the game, as those added benefits where integral to the design.
So yeah, games work better when stuff is added, than when stuff is taken away.

It's actually kind of strange if you think about it...

Imagine if HL2 was a VR-only game with HLA levels of interactivity and somebody would make a mod to turn it into a non-vr experience (into HL2 we know today). In the end it would still be a great game (because HL2 is a great game :gordon:).

But in case of HLA it would turn into a really bad game, huh?

No, it would be the same.

[PainkilleR]

Originally posted by ^tchaosvh:

Originally posted by PainkilleR:

It's actually kind of strange if you think about it...

Imagine if HL2 was a VR-only game with HLA levels of interactivity and somebody would make a mod to turn it into a non-vr experience (into HL2 we know today). In the end it would still be a great game (because HL2 is a great game ).

But in case of HLA it would turn into a really bad game, huh?

If HL2 was designed as a VR exclusive, it would also suck as a pancake game...

Seems like you are trying to validate your already cemented opinion.

Just try VR, stop trying to guess why we are telling you how great it is and just experience it yourself.

I am not interested in why it's a great VR experience though (that said I am perfectly aware why you like it). I am interested in why it would be a terrible non-vr experience.