So, that server boss.....

[Misery]

.....Seems extremely broken.

Is there some sort of wacky trick here that I'm supposed to magically know to defeat this? I mean, the way this works, it's as if it expects me to suddenly be playing Nuclear Throne, wildly waving crazy deathray guns in all directions and zooming all over the place due to overwhelming foes just appearing from random angles non-stop. The game's deliberate and tactical combat just dives out the window and dies horribly in a pit of acid spikes.

It doesnt feel like any amount of skill is involved here. Granted, the bosses in the game are... more than a little screwy at the best of times, but this one is a bit beyond "screwy".

This might be a bit less completely irritating if there were more bosses for the game to choose from (or if I could just turn them off). As it is, this thing appears *REALLY OFTEN*. It's honestly kinda killing my desire to keep going, knowing that 50% of runs will just end arbitrarily due to that thing simply existing. It's the one big blemish in the game's otherwise stellar combat.


Seriously though: IS there some sort of trick to this? Some gimmick I'm not seeing?

And yes, I do know you have to stay in a certain range of it to drain it's health. Even if that werent true though this would still be a total mess. But that's not the sort of gimmick I mean.

[Logorouge]

The intensity of that one was greatly increased with the latest patch. It used to be really underwhelming.

As for a trick, in my case I just use friendly fire to my advantage and get them to blast each other while I headshot as many as I can, popping crowcontrol items here and there. Those little white spiders blow up and damage their surrounding friends pretty hard too. Not much else I can say I'm afraid.

[[R-K] WARLORD]

Originally posted by Misery:

.....Seems extremely broken.

Is there some sort of wacky trick here that I'm supposed to magically know to defeat this? I mean, the way this works, it's as if it expects me to suddenly be playing Nuclear Throne, wildly waving crazy deathray guns in all directions and zooming all over the place due to overwhelming foes just appearing from random angles non-stop. The game's deliberate and tactical combat just dives out the window and dies horribly in a pit of acid spikes.

It doesnt feel like any amount of skill is involved here. Granted, the bosses in the game are... more than a little screwy at the best of times, but this one is a bit beyond "screwy".

This might be a bit less completely irritating if there were more bosses for the game to choose from (or if I could just turn them off). As it is, this thing appears *REALLY OFTEN*. It's honestly kinda killing my desire to keep going, knowing that 50% of runs will just end arbitrarily due to that thing simply existing. It's the one big blemish in the game's otherwise stellar combat.


Seriously though: IS there some sort of trick to this? Some gimmick I'm not seeing?

And yes, I do know you have to stay in a certain range of it to drain it's health. Even if that werent true though this would still be a total mess. But that's not the sort of gimmick I mean.

This game is extremely underbalanced and the developer doesnt even know what hes doing about it. You can see him reply to multiple threads in here with things that are literally wrong about the game. He said to me earlier that there is only a max 2-3 armored enemies in each room but i have seen and also i have video of 7+ armored enemies in one room

[Misery]

Actually, I think the game is quite well-balanced overall... I've been having quite a great time with it. This server boss is the *one* thing in it so far that seems broken.

Dont get me wrong, there's some brutal stuff in here, but... aside from that one boss it's never seemed broken or unfair. And I cant think of any enemies that feel "cheap" or anything (though I will say the warping jerks with the shotguns are super-obnoxious even if they arent all that strong).

Armored enemies, I dunno, they dont seem too bad to me. They're like any other foe, as I see it: Pick the right guns for the right situation and you'll do fine, and consider the enemy's pattern/behavior before getting into a fight with it. Just need to choose whatever you have that might work best and then be careful.

[[R-K] WARLORD]

Originally posted by Misery:

Actually, I think the game is quite well-balanced overall... I've been having quite a great time with it. This server boss is the *one* thing in it so far that seems broken.

Dont get me wrong, there's some brutal stuff in here, but... aside from that one boss it's never seemed broken or unfair. And I cant think of any enemies that feel "cheap" or anything (though I will say the warping jerks with the shotguns are super-obnoxious even if they arent all that strong).

Armored enemies, I dunno, they dont seem too bad to me. They're like any other foe, as I see it: Pick the right guns for the right situation and you'll do fine, and consider the enemy's pattern/behavior before getting into a fight with it. Just need to choose whatever you have that might work best and then be careful.

This is a bullet hell game where every single enemy is capable of wiping you within 1-2 seconds. Its not balanced at all. The only option is shooting from long range and then backtracking while firing back.

[Nver]

I find this to be the easiest boss. I also play with all the modifiers on except Deflect.

[Shrike]

the next update will make spawns from 3 per interval to 2 + 50% chance for 1 extra already
Right now spawn types are a bit random that might be an issue

[BlackjackGT]

The boss battles just don't play like the regular levels at all, generally speaking. There's little or no cover, there's nowhwere to hide, the tactics of the levels go out the window. I find the boss battles exciting but it can definitely be frustrating because imho the levels in no way prepare you for the how the boss battles work.

I assume that's by design -- some other rogue-lites and rogue-likes I've played have been like that too. I can't really get a handle on the Raptor jet boss battle anymore, and I know it's one they've tweaked repeatedly.

If I have decent weapons, the server battle generally hasn't been a problem. As long as I keep moving around the center and using the walls in there as cover when I can, it's worked out.

I'll probably post a server battles video compilation this weekend, and if you're having trouble with it, you may get some ideas from it. :)

[Xinn0bun]

Lots of games don't prepare you for the boss fights and I feel the design is perfectly fine. We will learn through experience and communicating with each other in game and on forums.

[Misery]

Originally posted by Xinnobun:

Lots of games don't prepare you for the boss fights and I feel the design is perfectly fine. We will learn through experience and communicating with each other in game and on forums.

To a degree this is often true, but this is a boss that literally has no patterns or behaviors to learn. It's.... not even really a boss (which honestly is kinda disappointing... I'd rather fight an actual proper boss, like the others). It's just "here's a giant pile of random jerks from random angles for no reason".

That's exactly why it gives off the impression that alot of luck is the core of the fight. And also, while I know the devs on this game are NOT lazy, this is a part of the game that FEELS lazy in it's design (as in, "we couldnt think of something better so here's random enemies"), so that bothers me also. Again, I know that's not truly the case as the devs have made their skill and dedication very clear, and I think the game is fantastic, but that's still the feeling I get from this battle (and I doubt I'm alone on that one). The other bosses manage to be bloody tough as nails, and often quite chaotic, yet dont have that problem whatsoever. So I guess that's the other thing that really bugs me about this fight.

I'd honestly really rather just skip the bloody thing or somehow force the game to always spawn any other boss than that one... even if that boss is something that's technically more difficult than the server. Normally, this is an idea that would never even occur to me with games like this.

[Rhett]

Well, Shrike said it's being tuned next patch (this weekend hopefully). It's a fun fight, but sometimes you just can't be prepared for it. It used to be a pushover, but now it isn't, and it also now rewards a core module (it didn't, before - whereas Experiment 57 does).

Probably wouldn't be so bad if it didn't decrease progress so quickly, as you can sort-of kite the enemies around.. but they do keep spawning regardless.

[BlackjackGT]

Think this Korean player's video shows the right idea - move, move, move and use the meager wall coverage for protection:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1340019301
*Just don't ask me advice for Raptor/fighter boss. I'm hopeless. I think sometimes the Raptor boss just LOOKS at me, and I instantly die, *poof*, lol.

[Misery]

Well I finally beat the horrid thing. It actually seems like it almost *requires* a certain level of DPS to allow you to keep enemy spawns managable; previous attempts, I hadnt been able to put out that kind of damage, so was just overwhelmed. Even in that video there the player is killing the crap out of basically everything really fast. So that might be an issue?

Also yes I see what you mean about the Raptor. I got to that as the second boss of the run. I have no idea what even happened. There was lots of lunacy for about 5 seconds and then it looked like my guy got hit with a mini nuke or something.

[WhiteCrow]

Originally posted by R-K WARLORD:

This game is extremely underbalanced and the developer doesnt even know what hes doing about it. You can see him reply to multiple threads in here with things that are literally wrong about the game. He said to me earlier that there is only a max 2-3 armored enemies in each room but i have seen and also i have video of 7+ armored enemies in one room

First, there's no reason to be disrespectful. There's two people working on the game, not one. It's reasonable to expect they each work more on a given aspect of the game more than the other, so familiarity can vary. If you're taking things personal with the game or the developer, you're not providing helpful feedback.

Originally posted by R-K WARLORD:

This is a bullet hell game where every single enemy is capable of wiping you within 1-2 seconds. Its not balanced at all. The only option is shooting from long range and then backtracking while firing back.

This isn't a bullet hell game. You're about the only person who seems to think so. Ask in chat, they will tell you. If it wasn't balanced at all, then it would be impossible to beat, and people have already. I've seen videos of people playing close quarters with Commando, dashing in and using the knife and taking advantage of the increased fire rate. Shooting from range isn't the only viable way to play.

[Misery]

Well, another server fight down, after the patch.

It seems like it's not actually possible to beat it unless you get a weapon actually capable of doing certain levels of sheer damage output. Many weapons can do that.... but there are some that just cant.

I had a really bad run just now: The ONLY weapon I found before the boss was that slow rocket launcher. The one that can fire one rocket every 10000 years. That's it. I had that, and my craptasmal pistol. No, there were no other chances to grab any other weapons. According to the level generator, I *really* needed things like item upgrade stations, 20 med crates, and some gambling. Heck with weapons, right? No, wait: There was one other weapon chest..... which was locked. I've never found those to even be doable. One way or another, it created a bad setup.

There was no way to win that fight. It absolutely couldnt be done. You *need* a certain level of DPS or the fight is not even doable at all. With just a pistol? Yeah, not happening. That rocket launcher seriously doesnt even count in that fight. Either it needs 2 million years to reload, or something is right in my face where I cant use it anyway. Whereas the pistol just cant defeat the many heavy enemies in there. In normal levels, you have the option of backing off, pulling things and giving you the time needed to actually deal damage.... meaning that even the pistol can defeat things.... but you dont have that option against the server. You either do the damage RIGHT THE HELL NOW, or you get overrun. Even against the other bosses, the pistol is still viable, because those bosses dont just get constantly more ridiculous as the fight goes on (nor do they require you to stand in a really specific spot to deal damage to them).

Honestly, even after the nerf, I still think the boss is just flawed at it's core. The entire concept just has too many problems... it's a mess. This just isnt the kind of game that even supports arena-type fights. That really is for games like Nuclear Throne, not this one.

[CryonicSuspension]

Probably the easiest boss for the Specialist, since they can drop LMG turrets. Which class are you playing by the way?