Path signal - please explain

[[Disconnected]]

Hi guys, im kinda R-rated when it comes to "path signals". I saw like 100 tutorials and still dont know how it work, and how to use it. What i understand (and i hope i inderstand it well), that it "create" some area, on wich must be covered all entraces with path signal and exits with block signal? And when train enter to that area, it search for aviable way to get out? Then...why this does not work?
https://ibb.co/v4xLgJz7
I need to get from bottom right (red), to bottom left (green) and there is train in way (in inner circle). shouldn't my train continue on the outer ring, to avoid that "parked train"? Why it want to go to "inner circle anyway"? Can someone explain it to me? Im kinda stupid with this... :/

[Jack-o-Lantern]

Path at every ngress. Block at every exit

[Kage Goomba]

Path reserves the path and forces oncoming train to take alternate route - block is a hard stop if a train is in said block.

As Jack said - Path at every entrance - block at every exit.

Generally you only need a path if you have a complex/multi route intersection - many get along fine with only blocks.

[Skraal]

The trains always take the shortest route. They don’t check for an available way with path signals, they only check if their (shortest) way is free. No train will ever take the outer ring because it’s longer than the inner ring.

[[Disconnected]]

Originally posted by Skraal:

The trains always take the shortest route. They don’t check for an available way with path signals, they only check if their (shortest) way is free. No train will ever take the outer ring because it’s longer than the inner ring.

I had chit-chat with Chatgpt and i think i get it. So Path signal is just "go/stop signal, no "search for aviable path", as i expected by name "Path signal". As i understand it, "outer ring" will not be used in this example, but can be used, when entrace / exit will be in less than 180° angle.
Anyway thx for reply.

[Eiko]

You don't NEED to have block signals at the ends of path blocks. It's just usually what you SHOULD do. But you CAN chain path blocks it just usually doesn't result in good behaviors.

Block blocks only allow one train in them. Easy to understand.
Path blocks have the following rules:
* Any time a self-driving train enters the block BEFORE a path block, it requests a path through the path block from the signal that it's approaching.
* The TRAIN selects the path it wants to follow and requests that path from the signal
* If the path block doesn't have any paths already reserved, or if the existing paths do not intersect the path that was requested, then the signal will turn green and reserve that path. Now the train has exclusive access to that path and any intersecting paths until it goes through.
* If the requested path does intersect an already-reserved path then the signal stays red, the train will stop at the signal, and it will wait until the requested path is the oldest one or none of the older ones intersect with it.
* If no self-driving train is in the block before the path signal, it will stay red no matter what.
* In order for a path to be "clear", the next block after the path block must be clear for the train to enter it.
* When a path is reserved, the next block that the train will be moving into will also be reserved by that and other trains will be prevented from entering it as if it were already occupied.

Those rules create lots of complex emergent behavior that isn't necessarily obvious, but those are the rules. Also they combine with the rules trains follow for example the way they brake in anticipation of a red signal in ways that might be undesirable.

So the end result is usually that if you have COMPLEX intersections you want path signals on the inbound tracks and path signals on the outbound tracks. And basically any other situation you just should use block signals.

[Harag]

As others have said, trains take the shortest route, so your red train will cross over the X to go on the inner side of the circle to head to the green section. If you want them to stay on the "right" path and thus go on the outer ring, then you'll need to remove the X just before the train. As you can see in the image. the whole roundabout is yellow, thus it's one block if any train is on there no other trains will enter. to break it up you need to use the block signals

[Doc✪Hollywood]

Easy Signal Solution:

Build one train for one track, then you dont need signals. Then just add as many waggons to that train as you need. A single train will never be the bottleneck, no matter how long the train route is, it will always be the belts.

Unless you're a train enthusiast:
Then go for signals and crossings and all kind of complicate scenarios you enjoy while others get nightmares about it

[[Disconnected]]

Thank you all for answers :)

[Doc✪Hollywood]

Originally posted by Disconnected:

I had chit-chat with Chatgpt and i think i get it.

Not sure though how truthworthy GPT is for Satisfactory problems and health issues

[dragonflyer]

Worse than useless in almost all cases.

[Mia]

Originally posted by dragonflyer:

Worse than useless in almost all cases.

you also "love" that new google feature? *cough* *cough*

[Xianlung]

there u go add couple more and u should be fine i marked them whit arrows

https://ibb.co/Xrg34dpS

[[Disconnected]]

Originally posted by Xianlung:

there u go add couple more and u should be fine i marked them whit arrows

https://ibb.co/Xrg34dpS

Okay, ill try. (Im now at work). Thx for tip ;)

[Xianlung]

Originally posted by Disconnected:

Originally posted by Xianlung:

there u go add couple more and u should be fine i marked them whit arrows

https://ibb.co/Xrg34dpS

Okay, ill try. (Im now at work). Thx for tip ;)

np the problem is that u made the whole circly as " one section for both rails, so u need to add more at every intersection what in the path section for every rail...

keep in mind trains allways use the shortest way unless there blocked

[Eiko]

I disagree with that suggestion. In reality there's no point in having two rings here because trains aren't smart enough to use them. The only reason to have a roundabout here at all is if you want future expansion. If you just want a turnaround it should just be that.