Pipe flow rate question

[Bec7992]

I have 900 heavy oil residue per minute (1 300 pipe and 1 600 pipe) going into 2 output junctions. 1 needs 420pm and 1 needs 480pm. The junction looks like this:

----420--------480
-----2-----------2
-----J111111111J
2222------------1
111111111111111

J = junction, 1 = T1 pipe, 2 = T2 pipe, - = blank space.
I thought this would balance out over time, but its been more than 5 hours since and it has not gotten any better. Is there a better way to do this?
And I have checked, the supply is not the issue. The T1 pipe seems to have the full 300 flow rate, but the T2 flow is low, and machines on both junctions have supply issues.

[Thing]

valves can limit flow amount to specific number

[Bec7992]

Originally posted by Thing:

valves can limit flow amount to specific number

Right, and I tried that first, but it also had the same problem, I think because of the valve resolution, so I tried this way because I thought it should work according to page 6 of this doc on the wiki.
https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/images/3/39/Pipeline_Manual.pdf

[DaBa]

Originally posted by Thing:

valves can limit flow amount to specific number

Don't use valves just to limit the flow rate, you want your pipe network to be as simple as possible if you want it running well. Also, valves wouldn't help in this situation either.

The solution is to not mix the 600 and 300 pipes. Also if you're building a system that utilizes the full flow rate of a pipe you need to make absolutely sure that there are absolutely zero flow rate issues in your system until that 600 gets split into smaller portions, else you will never be able to get all 600 cubic meters to your machines.

So: keep both pipes separate, and make sure that their contents are flowing flawlessly by making their trip as simple as possible: as little pipe segments as possible, no unnecessary headlift or pumps, no valves, no buffers where they aren't needed, just a straight shot from the source into the start of the manifold. Also take care when building the manifold so that it's not one way that ends with just a dead end, or you'll be dealing with backflow issues in that scenario, which in a tight system will definitely create problems.

[Bec7992]

Originally posted by DaBa:

Originally posted by Thing:

valves can limit flow amount to specific number

Don't use valves just to limit the flow rate, you want your pipe network to be as simple as possible if you want it running well. Also, valves wouldn't help in this situation either.

The solution is to not mix the 600 and 300 pipes. Also if you're building a system that utilizes the full flow rate of a pipe you need to make absolutely sure that there are absolutely zero flow rate issues in your system until that 600 gets split into smaller portions, else you will never be able to get all 600 cubic meters to your machines.

So: keep both pipes separate, and make sure that their contents are flowing flawlessly by making their trip as simple as possible: as little pipe segments as possible, no unnecessary headlift or pumps, no valves, no buffers where they aren't needed, just a straight shot from the source into the start of the manifold. Also take care when building the manifold so that it's not one way that ends with just a dead end, or you'll be dealing with backflow issues in that scenario, which in a tight system will definitely create problems.

By not mixing, do you mean that on the right 480 manifold, I should separate it into 2 manifolds, one requiring the 180 leftover from the first junction, and the 2nd manifold using the full 300 of the T1 pipe?

To solve the dead end issue, do you mean the end of the manifold should loop back to the start of the manifold, or something else?

[Lawn-Mower]

Gotta ask the standard fare questions..
Did you prime?

More basic stuff (cause we don't know):
Those MKII pipes weren't upgraded from MKIs were they?
Have you verified flow through the various segments? -sometimes connection issues occur while building. It's a bit harder to troubleshoot in cases where you're connecting two input feeds unfortunately..

If that also doesn't work, a more elegant solution may be to drop that overflow from the MKII feed pipe into the junction with the MKI main feed pipe vertically - this will give it a gravity bump, and preference the output to take from that line; prioritising accepting the fluid from the MKII line..

If the above conditions have been met, and didn't work, and you're deadset against upgrading those MKIs to MKIIs: have you tried a valve to kill flow from the input MKI pipe going into the MKII junction (effectively ensuring flow only moves in 1 direction from the MKII to the MKI [main feed] junctions? .

[DaBa]

Originally posted by Bec7992:

By not mixing, do you mean that on the right 480 manifold, I should separate it into 2 manifolds, one requiring the 180 leftover from the first junction, and the 2nd manifold using the full 300 of the T1 pipe?

To solve the dead end issue, do you mean the end of the manifold should loop back to the start of the manifold, or something else?

What you suggested would work, although it's more about just not having a situation in which at any point in a pipe there could be more fluids coming it than the flowrate allows for, that's where things can get weird with fluid dynamics. You could also, for example: run the mk2 pipe (600) for the first manifold, then have the end of that manifold connect to the start of a second one.

Without going into much detail because I really don't want to: if you have 2 high flowrate pipes that are operating at capacity or close to it, don't try to intersect them in any way. But if you are trying to do the same when the flowrate is not very high then that's okay.

And your solution for a dead end issue is also correct. You want it to circle back like a train track, where a train is only going in a single direction. Although I'm not 100% sure if that's what is happening when you do that in the game. It's one of those things people noticed that helps and they don't know exactly why it does, but since it works nobody cares I've also seen people put a fluid buffer at the end of a manifold which they claimed also prevents backflow but I can't vouch for that.

Also a few more extra tips:

- Fluids care about gravity, they will always try to go to the lowest point of your system. This means that any differences in height will cause fluids to not flow evenly. You can also use this to create natural valves, since the fluid will not flow back the pipe if it can remain in the lower section of the pipe network. This is why people recommend to have your manifolds above machine inputs and feed them from that height, it's also useful to start any manifold with a small descent to create a natural protection against anything flowing back into the main pipe.

- If a system is operating on zero margin of error (machines need the exact same amount of fluids you are putting into the system) it is very useful to pre-fill your pipe system with some fluids before you let the machines start consuming it. Due to fluids flowing irregularly you can have situations where some machines aren't receiving what they need because an extra amount is being pumped into some other machine. So you want to pump fluids into the pipes before you start the machines to smooth out those irregularities and ensure each machine has access to plenty of fluids in their connected pipes at all times.

[Bec7992]

Originally posted by Lawn-Mower:

Gotta ask the standard fare questions..
Did you prime?

I thought I did to start, but I forgot that when I turned on all the machines they would all suck up 50 units each, which lowered the pressure a bit, so I don't think it stayed "primed".
Is the best way to prime to block the output, but let the machine process?
Though I thought that just waiting would fill it out since the source is producing 900, but not all the consuming machines are running, so it should have backed up but hasn't yet.

[Lawn-Mower]

Originally posted by Bec7992:

Originally posted by Lawn-Mower:

Gotta ask the standard fare questions..
Did you prime?

I thought I did to start, but I forgot that when I turned on all the machines they would all suck up 50 units each, which lowered the pressure a bit, so I don't think it stayed "primed".
Is the best way to prime to block the output, but let the machine process?
Though I thought that just waiting would fill it out since the source is producing 900, but not all the consuming machines are running, so it should have backed up but hasn't yet.

yes

[Lawn-Mower]

That wiki pdf's pretty dense, but also takes the discovery away.. I also don't like some of the terminology that's used..
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3337976896

And Daba's on the money too. I prefer not to use the loop trick, but it is an easy solution that works when you're learning.

[Dirtyshadow]

MkGalleon guide to Fluids is good. A few things are a bit advanced and over the top.

The biggest issue not explained to usess is while you have 300 going into the pipe... all the machines are try to drink the horse trough during a drought. The runt on the end furthest from the tap usually dehydrated


Valves are great for one way gate flows

You can loop a pipe back onto itself... the end back to the first junction to great a flow loop.

Using a fluid buffer to build "Flow Compensators" solves basic most problems.

While filing a pipe to max seems optimal, try to minimise the inputs and outputs of a pipeline where possible to simplest ratios.
(For example 3 pump to:8 coal plants require structured piping... but a 0.75 pump:2 coal plant is a simple junction)

[Bec7992]

When you create a loop back, do you need to put a valve before the starting junction on the end of the loop so the input doesn't go to the loop back end, or is no valve needed?