Something has to be done with alternate recipes.

[Mugman Lord]

The goal of giving alternate recipes is giving other options that may either simplify of the cost of effectiveness. Or vice versa by complicating recipes but giving greater reward for the hassle. Or simply giving different ways to do things ex : steel bars to create (Copper wire). My problem with those alternative recipes is that most of them are terrible at best objectively. Sometimes the alternate recipe will ask you more complexity but giving you lesser reward than the simpler recipe or that sometimes the reward isn't worth merging some of your production lines. I have come to the conclusion that 1/4 of the alternative recipes are useful but most of them are terrible. I wish they will buff some alternative recipes so there's more viable options in the game and promoting more approaches to problems and properly rewarding you for you effort if you go for a harder recipe by giving you better reward as compensation for your efforts. What you guys think?

Edit: I had my mind changed after considering the arguments and digging deeper. Most alternate recipes can be good in their own way if used correctly and most have their merit more than I would have loved to admit. Consider the opinion above totally obsolete, I personally think I lacked insight in this topic, I should have dig deeper before posting, but I think my post was more of a sentiment than a rational well thought argument. I was deceived and wondered what to do with most recipes which left me discontent because I felt they were bad. But I just didn't have enough knowledge and maybe imagination. My mind also changed when I got closer to late game when different options are overall a really good thing. Thanks for changing my mind.

[War Wizard Grymzst]

You are missing the forest for the trees.

[Mugman Lord]

Originally posted by GreenBeret63Echo:

You are missing the forest for the trees.

I am not sure to understand your point here, it is quite unclear to me.

[Ccrack]

i think most of the ''useless' ones are ment to be ways to craft parts without using the original material types at all, because logistics arnt real or something

it is super annoying when you start a new save and the recipe rng is treating you like ♥♥♥♥

[⇧⇨⇩⇩⇩]

Its harder to give you any feedback when you dont mention any examples. When Im playing I find many recepies useless at the moment but I can at least see why they exist.
Some are for making greater output of various materials/coponents, some are for using different materials to make things.

[Schalimah]

Have a look at the wiki they have a usefull table for each product that shows you how the alternates compare.
Sometimes it takes a couple alternates to see the intention.

There is no recipe for wire from steel.
Did you mean iron rods from steal bars?
This one is actually way more efficient 5 iron ore and 10 coal vs 32 iron ore for the same outcome.
Or did you mean screws from steel beams?
This one saves space and energy but does consume slightly more resources.
I have to agree it is probably one of the worst alternates but it does have a benefit.
The best way resource wise is to use steel rods and default screws.

Overall I strongly disagree with the OPs statement.
Almost all alternates are great.

[⇧⇨⇩⇩⇩]

Originally posted by Schalimah:

Have a look at the wiki they have a usefull table for each product that shows you how the alternates compare.
Sometimes it takes a couple alternates to see the intention.

There is no recipe for wire from steel.
Did you mean iron rods from steal bars?
This one is actually way more efficient 5 iron ore and 10 coal vs 32 iron ore for the same outcome.
Or did you mean screws from steel beams?
This one saves space and energy but does consume slightly more resources.
I have to agree it is probably one of the worst alternates but it does have a benefit.
The best way resource wise is to use steel rods and default screws.

Overall I strongly disagree with the OPs statement.
Almost all alternates are great.

I agree, and I suspect this post is largely a matter of perspective. People play all games (that allow for it) in very different ways, and its easy to kind of turn the blinders on to all the ways you perrsonally are not playing the game. I can point to several occasions where I have learned about the use for some upgrade or tool I viewed as useless based on my own experience from reading about people talking about how great that thing was. Usually the case was that I simply wasnt aware of lategame stuff yet, or they were playing the game in some way I just hadnt thought of yet.

[GeminiEclipse]

I wouldn't say they are all great. Just some are much more situational. If you aren't in that situation it'll seem bad.

Like I haven't found a use for silica and limestone to concrete. Doesn't mean it's bad. Just not useful for my setup.

[DrNewcenstein]

At best, some of the alternates are a way to consume excess material as opposed to just dumping them in the awesome sink. If you look at what's involved in making wet concrete - not just the water and limestone, but the refinery construction materials and power cost, as well as floor space in a factory zone - there's no way it's viable, unless it's spitting out full stacks in one cycle.

While some may see the power and space as infinite, others may see a better use for that power and space.

[Schalimah]

Wet concrete just like the pure ingot ones are one of the best alternates there are as you get more bang for your buck.
More concrete per limestone. (3:2 instead of 3:1)
While it takes 6% more power it requires 50% less space.
But space and power should never be an issue in this game.
If they are you did it wrong.

[Maehlice]

Originally posted by Schalimah:

space and power should never be an issue in this game.
If they are you did it wrong.

What if Space and Power aren't the actual concern? Space and Power require "time and effort".

At the expense of resources, some alternates require significantly less infrastructure and logistics.

It all depends on what the player finds most satisfactory. ;)

[Schalimah]

fine.
I guess some people don't care about efficency.

[Maehlice]

Originally posted by Schalimah:

fine.
I guess some people don't care about efficency.

I guess some people miss the point.

Efficiency of time is still efficiency.

[Cronos804]

I also needed a lot of math to stumble upon it but a lot of the alts actually become good if you calculate with many alternates at the same time instead of just one.
Easiest example is the reinforced iron plate alt that uses Wire. Its not that good until you unlock Iron Wire.
In that example its pretty clear because Iron Wire itself is just great to reduce complexity but the other alts pretty much behave in the same way.
You need to use multiple at once.
Or at least read in the wiki which combinations are good.

What i do agree with is that they should really tell you more about this ingame. Currently you need excel to find a use case for anything thats not just 'gain 50% more Copper by adding water'.
And some alts are actually bad. I would say less than 25% though. Who needs to automate miners.

[Vectorspace]

I wonder if another reason for some of the alts is not necessarily that they are better for power or efficiency, but simply that they use a different resource?
E.g. you are building a new factory, and you need to make wire, but there's no copper, only iron. You could transport copper in, or just use the alt iron wire recipe

[Mojo]

Some alts are not so great, but again like someone else said I think they are there to help you from having to send too much to Awesome Sinks.