current state of controls

[UpSyndrome]

Hi,
I've been waiting to buy this for awhile and in some older posts i see some control issues just wondering how things are as far as playing with kb/m . My hands are somewhat f'd up just need to stay away from games if keys are not remappable or the mouse is iffy etc. Also if it requires multi-key moves...cant do those

Thanks

[TheSeek]

M+KB controls in this game are literally broken. The game is designed with a controller in mind, and the result is a lot of controls for essential actions(which can be done instinctively and very quickly all at once with a controller) are messily spread arund the keyboard. As example, while attacking and moving the camera with mouse, you might need to move, jump, dodge(done by doublke tapping a direction), charge, use special attacks, use items, switch weapons and more very fast, but with four of your left finges used just to move and jump, it's hard to juggle al of that. On top of this, mouse camera and aiming are even more broken, as the mouse emulates a controller right stick, which means no proper aiming and wonky camera controls.
BUT, there is a mod which improves all of this called NAIOM, it allows for a more free remapping of all the keys, adds a dedicated dodge button(instead of double tapping a direction), and changes a long ranged fire key from a hold to a toggle(so you won't have to hold the button down to fire constantly), and most importantly, fixes mouse camera and aiming by making it raw input(1:1 movement), adding a crosshair where needed.
Despite all this, even with normal functioning hands, KB+M is unusable for me(and it's not me cause i can get by fine with KB+M controls in other 3rd person action games like DMC)...other people can get accustomed to these wonky controls just fine, but to me(and to a lot of other people), M+KB keeps being too busy and messy even with the fixes.
If possible, I'd always recommend a controller, that's how the game was designed to be played,

[Včelí medvídek]

K+M is perfectly fine, most you need is W,A,S,D + LMB, RMB with occassionaly double tap for dash and evade and SHIFT for probe companion attack... It can be only misleading with some quicktip game gives you (as it eg show /, \ instead LMB and RMB) and for hacking you need left mouse on table..

I am very bad at action games but even without any changes in setting (that cna be changed in game) it feels very natural and dont made me big issue (ye, some speed challenges or perfect jumping for hidden chests gave me good headache but those are optional) - just mid last 3rd playthrogth (hence heading end of game)

[TheSeek]

Publicado originalmente por Včelí medvídek:

K+M is perfectly fine

Not intended as an attack, but as a genuine curiosity driven by confusion...how can you(and others cause you're not alone) feel like the KB+M controls are "fine" when someone even went as far as making a mod due to the thousands and thousands of people considering them utterly and horribly unusable? Especially the mouse, what I described in my reply is not just a figurative representation of how i feel the mouse works, it's actually how it's coded, with negative mouse accelleration and literally emulating a controller right stick. The controls are literally(not used as an exaggeration here) broken, not working as one would expect them to work in an intuitive way, so...how do you do it? intended both as "how can you feel comfortable with such horrible controls" and "how can you say they're fine when they're as a matter of proven facr broken".
The video about the mod that fixes all this shows very well how the game without mod works(from 00:35), and it's...unusable(he also explains the issues) https://youtu.be/83vZUk8fxRM?t=36

Again, not an attack, i'm just curious.

[UpSyndrome]

I was hop ing the controls might be something like Shadow Warrior great controls just hacking the crap out of everything it was perfect but if the games work better with controller THAT makes me want to break things

[TheSeek]

Publicado originalmente por UpSyndrome:

I was hop ing the controls might be something like Shadow Warrior great controls just hacking the crap out of everything it was perfect but if the games work better with controller THAT makes me want to break things

No offense but...Shadow Warrior is a first person shooter for PC, Nier Automata is a 3rd person action game(with multiple camera/perspective changes) for console, it's just...normal and obvious that they'd control VERY differently, and that the console game works better with a controller.

[Včelí medvídek]

Publicado originalmente por TheSeek:

Publicado originalmente por Včelí medvídek:

K+M is perfectly fine

Not intended as an attack, but as a genuine curiosity driven by confusion...how can you(and others cause you're not alone) feel like the KB+M controls are "fine" when someone even went as far as making a mod due to the thousands and thousands of people considering them utterly and horribly unusable? Especially the mouse, what I described in my reply is not just a figurative representation of how i feel the mouse works, it's actually how it's coded, with negative mouse accelleration and literally emulating a controller right stick. The controls are literally(not used as an exaggeration here) broken, not working as one would expect them to work in an intuitive way, so...how do you do it? intended both as "how can you feel comfortable with such horrible controls" and "how can you say they're fine when they're as a matter of proven facr broken".
The video about the mod that fixes all this shows very well how the game without mod works(from 00:35), and it's...unusable(he also explains the issues) https://youtu.be/83vZUk8fxRM?t=36

Again, not an attack, i'm just curious.

It is very safe claim that majority of PC port players (Steam users) dont care or even know about this - they just play the game as it is and are perfectly fine with it same as I am - either it dont feel them so bad or they jsut get used to it quickly, as said I jsut play with A,W,S,D and use mouse for attacks not so much for rolling around (only slow turning) - for targeting pod gatling - ye it is right this cna be tricky, I jsut get used to not move the mouse if enemy is in front of me and use only melee otherwise for "air moving targets", switched to rocket autoaim pod long time ago too...

You meet and build opinion on very small vocal minority you meet eg. in discussions.

Similar as everyone here state FAR is essential mod and only recognizible difference for me is annoying mouse pointer blinking during cutscenes, correct fullscreen could possible set by ALT+ENTER already.

[TheSeek]

Publicado originalmente por Včelí medvídek:

You meet and build opinion on very small vocal minority you meet eg. in discussions.

Not really, I'm talking about objkective facts on how the mouse works in this game, and the video i posted is proof...its not a matter of subjective experiences and judgment from players, the amint direction resets itself if you stop moving the mouse, that's NOT how it should work. The camera moves slower if you move your mouse faster, that's NOT how it should work. Those are facts, not subjective opinions.
Also, when you mentioned FAR, no one says it's essential, it's a known fact that most players don't need it, but what you're saying about fixing the fullscreen resolution issues by doing ALT+ENTER is false, because those who experience those issues have them regardless of pressing ALT+ENTER.

For the rest of your reply, your way of playing by just using melee weapons is not a very good representation of how the controls are: just cause you don't use all the controls it doesnt mean they're usable, it means you don't use them. If i want to walk diagonally up while jump attacking, shooting pod, switching weapons, target another enemy and heal myself, i can do that with 3 fingers on controller in 2 seconds, but on keyboard you can only move the camera and attack with mouse, so everything else must be done on left hand, so..2 fingers to move diagonally up, one for jumping, and im left with just 2 fingers to press the remaining 4 keys to switch target, swap weapons, shoot pod, and heal muyself? Not possible, not in the 2 seconds it'd take on controller.
You can decide to not do it, like you said, and just move and attack, but if i decide to do all that, the controls must allow me to do it. And the keyboard controls in this game simply don't allow this.

To sum it up, it's not about adabtability, cause as example i can easily switch from controller to keyboard in games like Bayonetta, DMC, and other 3rd person action games like this, the controls are comfortable and take no time to adapt, here it's not the case.