Buckshot and headshots need a major buff

[Xianyu]

I don't think it needs to be states that shooting a deer in the chest with a 12g buckshot from 15 metres away should be immediately fatal to anything smaller than a deer or a moose. But I can double-tab a buck from near point-blank range and get flesh wounds and watch the animal bound away with 'very low' bleeding even though I put eighteen pellets directly in to it.

This goes for anything bigger than a fox, or a coyote. It's BUCKshot. Not 'papershot'. Because right now, the buck shot would only good at hkilling paper targets.

And headshots. My god. If I shoot a moose directly in the eye, twice, it should be dead.

This is a problem from the lowly .242, the 270, and the bloody 7mm. A 7mm to the face is fatal. Period.

Unless this game is high fantasy and every single four-legged creature in this world has been kidnapped and had the same bone-metal-coating Wolverine got in the X-Men movies, then I think a bullet to the face should be a bullet to the face. I.E Fatal 90% of the time.

[El Turista]

Absolutely dessagree, mate.

Buck shots need skills and patience to place the shot. You have to know that pellets are no bullets, to start, and know what is going to happen when you pull the trigger. No fire and forget. With experience you can down 3x100 trophy red deer.

About head shots... No. No rework needed. Hunting rounds aren't armored military degree rounds. Indeed are the opposite, soft and expansive proyectiles looking to cause massive and fatal damage in an unarmored target. That soft bullet can bounce, glance and Eve ricochet in a hard an stable (solid) object as an skull. Many times. Many many...


You shoot a missed eye point blank with a shotgun??? First, you're a pervert, second eyes are no vitals and obviously the moose isn't going to die, the rest of the pellet arent going to do a fucl on that massive skull... And you're a pervert

Try the same with a .44 I've (accidentally) take a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ bear from 100m with .44. I've the screenshots if you like


Edit! And I'm very critical with the game, the devs, the realism and everything, but in this... Maybe one of the proper thing they implemented, sorry

[Xianyu]

El Turista původně napsal:

Absolutely dessagree, mate.

Buck shots need skills and patience to place the shot. You have to know that pellets are no bullets, to start, and know what is going to happen when you pull the trigger. No fire and forget. With experience you can down 3x100 trophy red deer.

About head shots... No. No rework needed. Hunting rounds aren't armored military degree rounds. Indeed are the opposite, soft and expansive proyectiles looking to cause massive and fatal damage in an unarmored target. That soft bullet can bounce, glance and Eve ricochet in a hard an stable (solid) object as an skull. Many times. Many many...


You shoot a missed eye point blank with a shotgun??? First, you're a pervert, second eyes are no vitals and obviously the moose isn't going to die, the rest of the pellet arent going to do a fucl on that massive skull... And you're a pervert

Try the same with a .44 I've (accidentally) take a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ bear from 100m with .44. I've the screenshots if you like


Edit! And I'm very critical with the game, the devs, the realism and everything, but in this... Maybe one of the proper thing they implemented, sorry

I don't even know where to begin with how stupid this all is.

I literally listed the ammo types I've tried to use for headshots and 'shotgun' wasn't one of them. Furthermore, hunting rifles aren't military grade ammo, sure. But deer aren't made of ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ kevlar either. If you shoot a deer in the head with a .270 it's dead 99% of the time. Except in this game where it dies 5% of the time.

And no, pellets aren't bullets, but a 12G from 15 metres away might as well be a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ canon for the amount of damage it should do to a deer. But this game would have you beleive that just because somehow, the pellets all missed the lungs and heart, that the deer can skip gaily across a field and into the treelline without immediately dying from the shock force of the pellets hitting them alone, let alone the internal trauma.

And your comments about soft bullets... do you know the first thing about ballistics? Like, at all?

[El Turista]

Xianyu původně napsal:

El Turista původně napsal:

Absolutely dessagree, mate.

Buck shots need skills and patience to place the shot. You have to know that pellets are no bullets, to start, and know what is going to happen when you pull the trigger. No fire and forget. With experience you can down 3x100 trophy red deer.

About head shots... No. No rework needed. Hunting rounds aren't armored military degree rounds. Indeed are the opposite, soft and expansive proyectiles looking to cause massive and fatal damage in an unarmored target. That soft bullet can bounce, glance and Eve ricochet in a hard an stable (solid) object as an skull. Many times. Many many...


You shoot a missed eye point blank with a shotgun??? First, you're a pervert, second eyes are no vitals and obviously the moose isn't going to die, the rest of the pellet arent going to do a fucl on that massive skull... And you're a pervert

Try the same with a .44 I've (accidentally) take a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ bear from 100m with .44. I've the screenshots if you like


Edit! And I'm very critical with the game, the devs, the realism and everything, but in this... Maybe one of the proper thing they implemented, sorry

I don't even know where to begin with how stupid this all is.

I literally listed the ammo types I've tried to use for headshots and 'shotgun' wasn't one of them. Furthermore, hunting rifles aren't military grade ammo, sure. But deer aren't made of ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ kevlar either. If you shoot a deer in the head with a .270 it's dead 99% of the time. Except in this game where it dies 5% of the time.

And no, pellets aren't bullets, but a 12G from 15 metres away might as well be a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ canon for the amount of damage it should do to a deer. But this game would have you beleive that just because somehow, the pellets all missed the lungs and heart, that the deer can skip gaily across a field and into the treelline without immediately dying from the shock force of the pellets hitting them alone, let alone the internal trauma.

And your comments about soft bullets... do you know the first thing about ballistics? Like, at all?

Aaamm... Buy real shotgun and go hunt, boy.

/Off

EDIT: that is not a milenial FPS friendly game... Enjoy... If you can... o7

[Monke]

Buckshot varies in pellet size but even the smallest (useable on deer) is over 6mm in diameter - more commonly triple "0" which is over 8mm in diameter. Two to three of these approximates the hitting power of a 300 Win Mag but the "stopping power" is actually multiplied by each hit, not by groups of 2/3 as this may suggest.
What this means is that No1 Buck to 000 Buck and above will (irl and should in game) completely destroy pretty much anything within 30 meters and even up to 60 as you really only need get 2 or three pellets on target.
At 30m, penetration should be "total" in terms of vitals. At 15m it should be an insta-kill anywhere except a leg-hit. Even then they shouldn't need any tracking as the leg that's been hit won't work at all, assuming it's still connected.
Just saying and appreciate that this is a game - nevertheless crap buckshot within 30m isn't an accurate representation from No.1 upwards.....

[:Radithol]

El Turista původně napsal:

Absolutely dessagree, mate.

Buck shots need skills and patience to place the shot. You have to know that pellets are no bullets, to start, and know what is going to happen when you pull the trigger. No fire and forget. With experience you can down 3x100 trophy red deer.

About head shots... No. No rework needed. Hunting rounds aren't armored military degree rounds. Indeed are the opposite, soft and expansive proyectiles looking to cause massive and fatal damage in an unarmored target. That soft bullet can bounce, glance and Eve ricochet in a hard an stable (solid) object as an skull. Many times. Many many...


You shoot a missed eye point blank with a shotgun??? First, you're a pervert, second eyes are no vitals and obviously the moose isn't going to die, the rest of the pellet arent going to do a fucl on that massive skull... And you're a pervert

Try the same with a .44 I've (accidentally) take a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ bear from 100m with .44. I've the screenshots if you like


Edit! And I'm very critical with the game, the devs, the realism and everything, but in this... Maybe one of the proper thing they implemented, sorry

And I disagree (correct spelling btw) with your assessment of rifle ballistics. They are not military rounds and aren't meant to be. Hunting rounds are designed to kill, and do so very efficiently. IRL, a .243 round to the head of a small deer at close range is devastating. Yet, in this game, a small animal shot in the head at 15 yards gets up and walks away.
Here is what really happens:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86k_-qcq43s

And, it is also effective on much larger game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgUGFjY2Rqo

[El Turista]

Promise to talk all of you on Sunday, sons.


Edit: sorey for the mistaiks. You surely suppose that english is not my first lenguage (and my cell phone doesn't help... (This little ♥♥♥♥♥♥.)

But, Wildcat, I know properly what pervert means and...

YouTube videos are as good evidences as Yahoo awnsers post.

[Xianyu]

Don't worry about Turista.

He's either senile or a troll. I haven't figured out which one yet. I have decided that it is completely safe to ignore his comments, especially since he thinks the 12-guage 'wadded paper' rounds are accurate to real life despite hinting that he's fired one himself.

[Ahroovi]

All I've got to say is I had a M870 Tactical, and shot buckshot at 35 yards with it. Almost every pellet hit the torso on a human silhouette. This was with no choke except the breaching/spiked muzzle installed. It had no effect on pattern, and was an 18 inch barrel. Buckshot close than that should definitely would that thing a lot more than it does ingame.
Anyone saying to actually get a gun and shoot it, I implore you do the same.

[Xianyu]

Ahroovi původně napsal:

All I've got to say is I had a M870 Tactical, and shot buckshot at 35 yards with it. Almost every pellet hit the torso on a human silhouette. This was with no choke except the breaching/spiked muzzle installed. It had no effect on pattern, and was an 18 inch barrel. Buckshot close than that should definitely would that thing a lot more than it does ingame.
Anyone saying to actually get a gun and shoot it, I implore you do the same.

http://xboxdvr.com/gamer/anonymuspegasus/video/49303705

So you're telling me this shouldn't have been a flesh wound? /sarcasm

[Monke]

Indeed and so improving in-game buckshot penetration within 30-50m (at least) should solve the issues. Side-on lung and neck shots shout be insta-kills within that range. A slight buff to spread might be appropriate but maybe expecting too much? Certainly out of the two, in-game penetration needs some love, in many of our opinions, it seems. :)

[Xianyu]

WildCat původně napsal:

so that lousy shot to the deer's intestines

In fact that 'lousy' shot was about the best shot you could take with buckshot at that angle. It was to the rear of the front legs and aimed in to the rear half of the lungs, liver, and yes, some intestines as well.

Couldn't aim for the heart because the leg was in the way. Couldn't aim directly at the lungs because the shoulder was in the way, couldn't aim for the head, neck, or spine because the buckshot has about as much penetrative power as a pub dart thrown by a small child. Pretty much the only way to get kills with buckshot is to hit the lungs.

Here's the screenshot: https://screenshotscontent-d2001.xboxlive.com/xuid-2533274796134622-private/7e6e48da-8efd-4df9-81b2-6cbc2332e71b.PNG?sv=2015-12-11&sr=b&si=DefaultAccess&sig=zbpxuW1CuC%2BX9oweNISvpLT4wSmJCHf1%2BbFSn%2F3dzlo%3D

If the buckshot in this game wasn't the equivalent of loading a shell with rocksalt, maybe I wouldn't have to be a 'lousy shot' to actually ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ kill something with it.

Not that shot placement really matters with buckshot. Might as well aim directly at the back haunch. I'm just going to get flesh wounds anyway. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Xianyu]

WildCat původně napsal:

Or you could have used a caller and lured it into facing you

Why would I want it facing me? I'm trying to get shotgun kills to unlock the slug rounds and the current party-popper buckshot is literally incapable of hitting the heart at point blank range with perfect accuracy unless you were able to somehow stand between the deer's forelegs and aim up at the heart.

I'll take a side-on-shot that might hit a lung before a face-on shot that won't penetrate far enough to hit the heart every time, thanks.

Oh look, I lured a doe towards me and shot it in the chest with a buckshot round and you know what happened? absolutely ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ nothing. Flesh wound again. Because there's too much flesh in front of the heart and the buckshot has the same penetrative power as that pen-and-rubber-band contraption kids make in high school.

[Xianyu]

Playing on the xbone. No rabbit update yet.

Stuck shooting paper wads at deer to level up shotguns.

[Monke]

WildCat původně napsal:

Scythe původně napsal:

...

That would require them to rework bullet physics so that greater damage is sustained the closer a target is to the shooter... and it's something I would welcome: bullet damage drop-off, so that a shot taken at point-blank range causes more damage that a shot from 400m, which is about the max rendering limit the game offers. In real life a bullet wouldn't lose a vast amount of damage before bullet drop caused it to hit the ground, since gravity has more effect than drag, but in terms of representing this in a game, they could simply reduce damage over distance, even if it's only by a couple of percent every 100 meters.

Yes. I don't know what physics/algorithms they're using to comment, but they have drop and it would be a "simple" fix to base it on drop or distance, as you say - the key concept being max at zero and diminishing away.

[El Turista]

I don't even need wt
(F/h) i promise to talk here, but was something about headshots.

https://outdoors.stackexchange.com/questions/10304/why-do-you-not-aim-for-the-head

The explanations with the deer still explains very nicely why head shots are bad

There are more, the proper dising of a hunting round makes dificult to confront bone

I have a lot of document talking about "bullet disorganization" (as we say in Spain) but can't find much on English. If I found will post it. The said bullet disorganization happens when a bullet penetrate (not really , can happen outside the body) the body and doesn't prerform as intended. The bullet desintegrarse, or glanzes on a bone or something happens

Shooting the heads faces a mayor failure than shooting another thing. As is said in the post above the bone is thick and de muscle denser...

Military degree bullet are opposed to hunting ones. Indeed some rounds intentented for military or enforcement works underperform on it's due but what's adopted by hunting civilian community (10mm as we talked in other post)

Can say many more things, but I'm drunk ans sleepy... Tomorrow we will see