Threaten/sweet talk

[Munga]

The threaten mechanic seems kinda glossed over. I think being a hideous monster (including officers of the law :P) should increase threaten percentages. Maybe a hideous scars trait from leveling up or a monstrous trait from the start or something along those lines? Also, maybe a scare option using the same mechanics, forcing them to break and run away? That could be useful in a few situations.

[Cottontail Cavalier]

That's a great idea, but the reason something like that hasn't been added yet is because the threaten mechanic isn't very prominent. You only really use it for the retrieval missions, and even then it may not be the optimal choice. I feel like a trait for that alone would be kind of a waste, but maybe Matt can add that effect in to Disturbing Facial Expressions.

[Munga]

I like nonviolent resolutions. Pacifist runs are fun on roguelikes, and it would add a few options.

[Munga]

Alternatively, an extremely charasmatic approach would be a cool option that's not present. Maybe a class that starts with tons of cologne, some traits for making it easier to sweet talk people, and a few hard earned bucks? :P

[teworth]

I think the bartender starts out with people liking them and the comedian has something like that he can tell a joke and people around might like it and become a follower of hate it and punch you.

[Munga]

The comedian is far too random, though fun to play as. Besides, I'm talking more about getting people to give up the items you need for quests in a peaceful manner.

[Cottontail Cavalier]

Yea but there has to be some sort of skill reliant mechanic for the sweet talking, unlike the percent chance threaten we have right now. I was thinking a class with some sort of "reputation" points that dictate how people act towards you, with different ways to earn it, like making more friends and having followers. And then the more reputation you have, the easier it is to get the item from someone.

Maybe the reputation could be an overall mechanic as a way to add more options into the game, like where a citizen's mood towards you could be inluenced by your reputation instead of just your actions in front of them.

[Munga]

I wasn't suggesting you get the item for free, but it was a percentage based roll, like threaten. Maybe it would allow you to lower the price of bribing them into a trade? And if it failed, the price would just go up instead of them instantly trying to kick your ass?

[Cottontail Cavalier]

That really just sounds like investment banker, with shrewd negotiator and all. The thing is, with threaten already being not amazing, adding another version of it would seem almost pointless, as it would be a situational mechanic.

[Munga]

Does shrewd negotiator actually affect bribing and such? I know cologne does. I'll check it out.

[Cottontail Cavalier]

No I don't think it does. Bribes are $55 right? That's how much it was for investment banker so I guess it doesn't effect it.

[Munga]

I checked it out on my last playthrough and it doesn't. It doesn't affect buying the objective items off of people either. I mean, that fits with the investment banker. He's the rich guy that all the poor people hate. I'd like to see a rather poor character that's well known amongst the slummers, and sweet talks his/her way out of situations. Also, the investment banker is really fun, but the constant need for more drugs turns it into a race against time for him. I'd rather have a street worker who takes their time, maybe picking diseases here and there :P Sex of the character would be something to take into account as well. Fallout has done similar things.

[Cottontail Cavalier]

Yea maybe that could be the worker class that will (probably) be implemented later. He could start off with Friend of the Common Folk or something. You always see workers all over Industrial helping people out, so that would make sense.

[Munga]

That wasn't what I meant by street worker, but yeah, a construction worker/engineer would be awesome as well. Starts with a wrench/axe and helmet, and has some standing amongst the slummers.

[Munga]

I know a total pacifistic walkthrough is absurd, but making things easier by talking to people to make the situation less bad and making friends is more fun than going into every situation with guns ablazing. It'd also be cool if sometimes a certain character had an item that you needed, but talking to them would be way easier than shooting your way out of the situation. Like, gang leaders surrounded by tons of gangsters, firefights that will be very hard to win unless you're very well equipped. Maybe he gives you a secondary mission to pull off in the level in trade for the item, something like that.

[Aquillion]

I think social mechanics could be expanded a bit and applied to more things. Add both Threaten and Persuade rolls, and allow them to apply to:

1. Shopkeepers, in an attempt to adjust their prices.

2. Anyone who has an item you need in a mission.

3. Anyone you can recruit, to try and get them to work for you. (Possibly just at a reduced price.)

4. Bouncers, to get them to let you in.

That would give it plenty of use.

Threatening would have a higher success rate, and works just as well even if you've annoyed them, but risks turning them annoyed or hostile.

Persuade can only be attempted once per person, and is heavily influenced by their opinion of you (so friendly people are easier to persuade, whereas annoyed ones are very hard.)



In addition, this allows for several new traits:

A trait that lets you use threaten / persuade to recruit anyone (with a few exceptions) rather than just people who can normally be recruited.

A trait that makes Threaten / Persuade recruitment free (possibly just on certain types of characters.)

A trait to improve Threaten and / or Persuade chances in general, of course. Maybe one for each with an additional effect that benefits that type of influence, such as:

A trait that makes Threatening more likely to work; and if you fail, it's more likely to make the target's opinion of you just drop one level rather than instantly going hostile.