Colonial vs Warden equipment ballance:

[Party San]

This is coming from a Colonial loyalist.

As of the recent update, I think its safe say that Wardens have the edge in terms of game tech and overall weapons.

- Wardens have best AT weapon in game: White Ash - aka. Flask.
When you throw near (not at) enemy tank tracks you will track a tank 100% percent of the time. This weapon is Warden exclusive, and only weapon that can track 2 tanks simultaneulsy when thrown at the ground between 2 tanks (enough close to them).
Altough it did get a nerf range wise, it is still possible to lob this AT grenade over a tank or any other vic.
The Colonial counterpart, the Ignifist cant be fired from barges (AT flask can be thrown out of barges), does not autoequip, gives a big slowdown when equiped (before this patch, not sure now), and tends to bounce A LOT on a tank that has armour, while the White Ash has 100% pen chance regardless of tank armour.
The White Ash has also been buffed by giving it the ability to strip armour (which it had not before this patch).
(Wardens also recieved exclusive AT grenade this last update, which I havent tested thus cannot comment on it).

- Harpa range and Boma range has been brought closer to each other. Bomastone (Colonial anti-infantry grenade) has been one of the best tools under the Colonial belt, however it had been almost nerfed to the ground (range difference between both now is only 1 meter if I recall correctly - ALSO the harpa has a lot more range if used with the osprey but with no possibility to cook).
Wardens still complain about the 100% bleed, while Harpa - their grenade has 100% kill chance. I would take Harpa over Bomastone every time I play (even if Bomastone has a bigger radius).
Regarding crate numbers the Bomastone crate has a bit more grenades - HOWEVER since 1 Harpa guarantees 1 kill, and 2 Bomastones guarantee 1 kill (most of the time), the ratio of number of grenades between these in crates is not 2:1, so is not as OP as people say (Im not sure but I think Bomastone crate has only 5 grenades more than the Harpa crate).

- The Outlaw, one of the Warden tanks has recieved a big buff. Altough it has been locked behind facilites now (just like the colonial tank, the Spatha, which was the best Colonial tank before this update), is has a big advantage over the Spatha:
*Outlaw has 45 meter range, Spatha has 40 meter range.
*Outlaw has 7.92mm machine gun, Spatha has no machine gun.
*Outlaw has speed boost, Spatha has no speed boost.
*Outlaw has 20% HV40 - 20% additional damage per shot, *Spatha has 10% HV40 - 10% additional damage per shot (nerfed this patch from 20% to 10%).

Only things going for Spatha is: faster reload (by 1 second if I remember correctly beacuse Outlaw did get a reload time buff this last patch) and 2 more slots in tanks, for 200 extra bmat or 100 bmat and diesel/petrol can (dont remember HP or armour difference between the 2 tanks).

(Wardens have 2 vics with 45 meter range - Early war 68mm Halftrack (easy to decrew from behind), and 40mm 20%HV Outlaw (cannot decrew)- Colonial have only 1 45m tank - the LTD which is easy to kill and decrew because its open top, and 45m range Smelter, a push gun which is also easy to decrew because it is a push gun - not including the Stygian on Colonial side and the Stockade on the Warden side).

- Wardens have the most Tank variants from both factions. They have all kind of tanks:
*Bonelaw shoots 8 ArcRpg rounds - Colonial have no tank variant that shoots ArcRpg.
*Highwayman shoots rapid 20mm - Colonial have no tank variant that shoots 20mm.
*New Outlaw variant shoots 3 rapid 30mm with autoloader - Colonial have no tank variant that shoots rapid 30mm (reminder - tankette is not a tank, does not shoot rapid 30mm and both sides have early game 30mm tankettes with Wardens also having a HAC that shoots 40mm).
*Silverhand has 2 guns, it shoots both 40mm and 68mm - Colonial have no variant like this (only this patch we have recieved the MTD that has 68mm and Tremola grenade launcher - which is a mini Warden Super Tank, the Predator - which can shoot tremolas and 94.5mm - so wardens DO HAVE a tank variant that shoots both tremola with a gun turret).
*HTD shoots HV68, a 68mm round with more damage than a standard 68mm, has great frontal armour - one of the most sought after and feared tanks in the game - Colonials just this patch recieved a 68 MTD (does not have HV modifier), which has yet to be proved to be decent in a fight.
(HTD did geta nerf because of the 50% fuel consumption increase to all tanks this patch, so it might be a little harder to use within longer distances, but that is for Wardens to find out).

Most of Warden tanks have machine guns, on colonial side only the Bardiche and Ranseur (and the Scorpion which is strictly anti-infantry tank) has a machine gun compared to: all Outlaw vairants with the base variant having 2 machine guns, and also Chieftain has 12.7 gun as well as Kingspire having 12.7 gun.

New mechanic has been introduced to this game just this patch: Only open top vehicles or a captain looking out the hatch, can see infantry hiding/shooting from bushes.
Of course Wardens recieved the only tank, that has a commander spot with a mounted machine gun on top of the tank, very useful for spotting and clearing infantry hiding and shooting from bushes.
Colonials are left with their only 2nd slot weapon (tank commander can only use secondary weapon to shoot out of the tank hatch) they have (apart from the pistol which both sides have access to) the pitch gun, which does not stagger/slow down when hitting enemies.

Wardens have 3 secondary weapons, while Colonials have only 1 secondary slot weapon.
*Wardens only faction that have a secondary slot weapon that can attach a bayonet (did matter lot more before this last update).
*Wardens have a multishot pistol, which burst fire.
*Wardens have the only 1 shot 1 kill shotgun (added this patch), which goes in second slot, which will 1 shot a player from 5 meters range.

Second slot weapons can be used by medics, or by players that use snipers as primary weapons.

Wardens have 68mm EAT (Emplaced Anti Tank gun), while collies have BEAT (Bonesaw Emplaced Anti Tank gun).
The difference is the Warden EAT is hitscan, you shoot and enemy recieves instant hit when in range. The Colonial BEAT however, fire quite slow and is easy to dodge, much easier than the Warden counterpart by 45meter range Outlaws that pve octagons.
Collie BEAT can shoot over obstacles, however once enemies know a BEAT is hiding they will be looking out for the ARC shot which they will be able to dodge 99% of the time IMO because of the quite slow shot that is visible before reaching its destination.
Warden EAT is preffered by many many players, including myself.

Wardens have a better Super tank (Predator) than Colonials (Ares), even if Ares did get a buff couple of wars ago, where it is 1 gunner that controls both guns, not 2 seperate gunners, one for each gun.

The Warden jeep + Cutler (Cutler being Warden exclusive weapon) combo is the best Watchtower clearer from all the game.
It takes 1 cutler rpg shot to clear 1 Watchtower:
You need 3 mamon to kill WT.
You need 2 Tremola to kill WT.
You need 1 and half 12.7 clip from the Catara (colonial infantry mg that has been nerfed over and over again, and now need rmat to produce if Im not mistaken).
But you need only 1 RPG cutler shot to kill 1 Watchtower.
Even without the jeep, just on foot you can easily clear more than 6 Watchtowers in one run, granted you will not be caught.

Wardens have a sniper that 1 shot 1 kills, Colinal sniper has a very low chance to 1 shot 1 kill, most of the time you need 2 shots to finish en enemy when using Colonial sniper.

Wardens have the only 250mm push gun in the game, a 250mm variant that is not triggered by AT mines, and comes out early.
So Wardens have 2 250mm vairants (250push and Chieftain) while Colonials have only the Balista (which had been buffed few patches ago, for many wars it was really slow).

In comparison Chieftain has not only 250mm turret, but also 12.7 turret. This can kill infantry that is trying to QRF your 250mm rush to kill concrete. You can also supress AT pillboxes, while the Balista does not have any machine guns to stop infantry rushing you.
Difference is with ammo the Balista can carry twice the amount of ammo the Chieftain does, but if the Balista dies early you are just donating 250mm shells to Wardens lol.
Many players preffer the Chieftain to the Balista, including myself.
One big bonus for Balista before this patch, is that it was MPF-able tank - this patch it got nerf and now is locked behind facilites as a Scorpion variant.

Wardens have 2 Battle Tank vairants, they have the only Flame Battle Tank in the game, which has better overall stats than the Colonial BT, including faster speed also when reversing.

Wardens have the satchel while Colonials have the Hydra. The satchel is hidden in your 3rd slot, and you can still have a pistol and shoot infantry when going on a mission, while the Hydra is a big item weapon, so you are running with it pulled out, and in order to shoot with a pistol, you first must drop the Hydra, and pull out the pistol from 2nd slot, only then you can return fire (I think satchel got buff this patch, maybe the hydra too? not sure...)

Furthermore:
- Wardens get the only 68mm 45 meter range vic that is available early in the game - the ATHT halftrack,
- Wardens have more Armoured Car variants (including bonecar with increase damage per shot this last update),
- LordScar aka STD (Stygian on wheels),
- Kingspire scout tank (anti infanry mg tank that has radar - very useful even late game because of mobile radar - it got turn rate buff this patch if I remember correctly),
- more weapon variants in general (infantry rifles)
- Warden sub being better to Colonial sub (better turning rate - even if this patch Colie sub got 40% turning rate buff)
- Warden gunboat being better than Colonial gunboat (Warden mortar having full 360 rotation - Collie mortar on Colie gunboat does not/ also you can hide inside Warden Gunboat to take cover - in Colie gunboat you are always exposed)
- nice gun vairants: long range Loughcaster, midshort range Blakerow (prefered by many over Argenti), Hangman, Aalto and Sampo (only guns that switch from auto to semi-auto), Wardens even have the equivalent to Colonial Fuscina, the Booker which recently also got a buff, The Fiddler - a long range, laser accurate, 25 bullet smg that has very fast stabilisation even when moving - it can actually compete with the Colonial rmat weapon - the Dusk...

I could probably find more examples of why Warden faction is the faction with better arsenal in general.

HOWEVER Colonials do also have good Vics and weapons:
- BTD (Battle Tank destroyer that outranges BTs by about 5-7 meters when accounting turret distance from tank chassis, however similarily to the HTD on its own it is in danger because of low turret vision range/no rotation)
- 45 Smelter push gun (45 meter range, good for pve octagons)
- Stygian pushgun (powerful 94.5mm pushgun)
- Scorpion (Best IST tank in the game)
- Argenti rifle, Catena rifle, Dusk assault rifle (nerfed this patch - need rmat to produce now)
- LTD (very squishy, open top easy to decrew, quite easy to fuel with engine at front, 45 meter range Light Tank Destoryer)
- Vulcan
- Bardiche (now is 2 68 autoloader tank, however 1 slot for Bmats has been removed - nerf, and overall reload speed has been decreased by 1 second, which overall makes this tank have lower DPS than previously in comparison when going in for full dive, after the initial 2 shot)
- Ranseur (aka Quadiche - decent pve RPG tank)
- Lunaire (gas nerf is a direct nerf to Lunaire use)
- Destroyer, mobile 120mm artilery, longer range 150mm stationary artillery (altough wardens get a blast shield on theirs, that protects them)
- Kranesca - only colonial tank with speed boost (Wardens have at least 4 tanks with speed boosts, all Outlaw variants),
- Bane, Venom,
- Argonaut (Colonial jeep that has room for 4 players) and Oddysey...

If I missed anything feel free to add. Also if you are a Warden please make a similar list to how Collies have better equipment if you think so, I would gladly ready it.

All the best.

PS. I missed out on purpose weapons that are common to both factions, such as sticky, havock charge and cometa, since both factions can produce them, they do not affect faction ballance. Also i have not included the new AT rifles, because they need testing in Foxhole war scenario, to how actually they behave.

[Quad Shot]

Warden response, first corrections on your post about some things. (these are not bias, just statistics, all info is post-update based on devblog and foxhole wiki)

Bombastone comes in crates of 25, 5 more than harpa.
Post update bombastone will have 12m range and harpa will have 11m range, down from 14.5 and 13.65 respectively.

Post update outlaw will have 7 second cycle speed to spathas 4.5, dps will be 102.8 and 146.3 respectively (pen chance noninclusive)
Outlaw has 2950hp 11000 armor, spatha has 3650hp 13550 armor. (both 33%-67% pen chance)
Outlaws road speed ranges from 6.67m/s (no boost) to 9.6m/s (boost), on road the spathas speed is 7.62m/s

HTD (noble widow) has 75% hv68 (1050 dmg per shot, 6.5 sec cycle, 161dps)

Brigand (new outlaw base) has a 7.92 mg in commander position, and this may have been changed, but commander is unable to use their secondary slot (binos, pistol)

Catara now costs 15 rmats instead of 165 bmats, but comes in crates of 20 instead of 10.

Warden sniper (Clancy-Raca M4) does 101-151 dmg (1 shot down) 57.5m effective.
Colonial sniper (KRR3-792 Auger) does 69-103 dmg (rare 1 shot down) 54m effective.
Colonial 20mm sniper (“Quickhatch” Rt.I, fac locked) does 150-225 AT dmg (1 shot kill, effective against tanks and mounted weapons) 52.5m effective.

Chieftain carries 6 250mm rounds (5 in inventory, 1 in chamber), ballista carries 11.
Scorpion (ballista base vic now) costs 100 rmats, down from 155.

Flood Mk. I (12.7) 5100hp, 15650 armor (25%-50%), 7.21m/s (on road), 0 inv slots.
Flood Mk. VII (flame) 5100hp, 16250 armor (23%-50%), 6.39m/s (on road), 0 inv slots.
Lance-36 (75mm) 6250hp, 15650 armor (25%-50%), 6.25m/s (on road), 16 inv slots.
Lance-25 (94.5mm) 6250hp, 15650 armor (20%-50%), 3.94m/s (on road), 8 inv slots.

Alligator Charge (satchel) does 400 dmg, up from 300
Hydra's Whisper does 550 dmg, up from 350

Same as catara, dusk now costs 15 rmats instead of 165 bmats, but comes in crates of 20 instead of 10.

Bardiche cycle speed is .2 sec faster than pre update, reload speed was nerfed by 1 sec, but fire speed was buffed by 1.2 sec. Not counting the first shot, dps is now 113.2 (up from 109.1)

Now onto the real post

While the flask is strong, especially with the tracking potential, it is very easy for tanks to dodge if thrown poorly. It is true that the ignifist does perform poorly later in the war when tanks have more armor, but at that point you have the bane and venom to make up for it. Also the white ash stripping armor will do nothing. It strips 300 armor, most that will do is make every tank impossible to store if we cap them.

Based on what I have seen of the new warden exclusive AT grenade, it is just a AT tremola with less range. I assume you can guess how ♥♥♥♥ it will probably be if you have ever tried to use a lunaire against tanks.

Best thing I can say about the grenades is that wardens use the harpa as a conditional weapon, and usually bunker bases are not supplied with it other than early war when we get hundreds of crates of them in seaports. Compare this with colonial bombastone use, and that warden trench systems are usually built around the bombastone, and you get the picture.

In a straight up fight, with equivalent crews and no skill issues, a 1v1 of spatha and outlaw will almost always end in the spatha's victory. Look at the hp/dps differences in the stats section. (pre update spatha had equivalent dps to the widow)

Hawthorne (secondary rifle) is decent, but like every secondary weapon, no one makes them. This is especially true of the Cascadier (3 shot pistol), in all my time playing I have almost never seen them on a front, and the range is terrible.

I agree that the BEat and colonial SHT are bad, Eat is just better and the only way for the warden SHT to be better is when colonials steal one.

I do not know why you are talking about the cutler+jeep combo as if it is warden exclusive, you have a jeep that you can mount a rocket launcher to.

Next update the colonials will also have a 1 shot kill sniper, fac locked and with the worst sniper range yes, but it will have the capabilities to wipe out every tripod on the map and shoot tanks for little to no damage with the 20mm rework.

Ballista is more focused on conc clearing, Chieftain trench clearing. Also, Ballista is just going to be like the spatha, with large regiments building thousands a war (new mpf cost is 70 rmats + upgrade cost per tank)

Warden ac variants are the highlander (off road speed), wildjack (flamethrower, colonial equivalent in flame tankette), and Gravekeeper (arc-rpg launcher, pcm cost, colonial equivalent with rpg ac and 20mm ac neither costing pcms).

Like the stygian, the lordscar can be decrewed by one man with a grenade. unlike the stygian, the lordscar does not have 52.5m range (with barrel length). Lordscar dps is 200.1, 40 more than a htd that does not require 40 steel mats.

The scorpion is the lategame colonial equivalent to the kingspire role wise in tank lines, same intel collecting ability and inventory space to support other tanks.

I agree that the old colonial sub's turning radius was bs, due to its 40% buff and the naki's 20% nerf, the naki now only turns twice as fast as the trident (used to be 7 times), which makes sense given the size difference.

I won't talk about infantry weapons because they are more about personal preference more than anything else (I prefer the loughcaster over most other infantry weapons because I like to not miss), but I will say that the Aalto's semi auto function could be removed one day and it would take years for anyone to notice.


The biggest problem I have with the current balance is Falchion MPF bonus (56.6 rmats each) and AT/rpg production exclusivity, think if you stole a warden sniper rifle and it used a ammo that you also had to steal.

[DayWalker]

need nerf damage noble widow! 200% -> 150%

[Party San]

1/2 - one of two

Warden response, first corrections on your post about some things. (these are not bias, just statistics, all info is post-update based on devblog and foxhole wiki)

Thanks for getting into number details in response to this post, it motivated me to do the same in my reply.

Everything I wrote was from the top of my head and I admit was lazy, however a 2 paragraph reply to someone, turned into a big wall of text and I had already spent lot of time, without wanting to spend even more looking up actual numbers. Excuses, excuses... lol.

Also I appologise for the wall of text once again lol, I tried to revisit the paragraphs and did cut down as much as I could (Im not the best in explaining many things, but I do my best).

I had to divide this reply into 2 posts, as I exceeded the total number of characters a post can have.

Bombastone comes in crates of 25, 5 more than harpa.
Post update bombastone will have 12m range and harpa will have 11m range, down from 14.5 and 13.65 respectively.

I was correct about Bomastone crate size in my opening post, also I was correct about 1 meter range distance between Bomastone and Harpa.

Post update outlaw will have 7 second cycle speed to spathas 4.5, dps will be 102.8 and 146.3 respectively (pen chance noninclusive)
Outlaw has 2950hp 11000 armor, spatha has 3650hp 13550 armor. (both 33%-67% pen chance)
Outlaws road speed ranges from 6.67m/s (no boost) to 9.6m/s (boost), on road the spathas speed is 7.62m/s

What? Outlaw Mk II reload speed: decreased from 5.5 seconds to 5 seconds www.foxholegame.com/post/update-59-dev-branch-released
https://imgur.com/a/Wa960fU - I actually did a print screen of dev notes

It is not a 7 second reload, it has only 0,5 seconds slower reload speed to Spatha, so its even less than I wrote in my OP. Thats actually crazy...
Could you please link your source for 7 second Outlaw reload speed and dps for both tanks?

So Spatha has only HP and Armour going for it, it is now the worse tank of the two 40mm tanks IMO, and just the 0.5 speed reload, with Outlaw doing 2x as much damage on every shot.

Since both Outlaw and LTD are both poke tanks (with Outlaw also being flank tank and pve tank, as well as tankline tank because of armour and health regardless if it has less than Spatha):

LTD – 68mm – 45 meter range, 600 damage, 4.5 second reload duration
foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/H-10_%E2%80%9CPelekys%E2%80%9D
foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/68mm
Outlaw – 40mm 20%HV40 – 45 meter range, 600 damage + 20%HV modifier = 720 damage, 5 second reload duration
foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/40mm

However I think the 68mm has 50% penetration bonus increase from 40mm?

HTD (noble widow) has 75% hv68 (1050 dmg per shot, 6.5 sec cycle, 161dps)

Brigand (new outlaw base) has a 7.92 mg in commander position, and this may have been changed, but commander is unable to use their secondary slot (binos, pistol)

The commander already has a mounted gun on the tank, why would he need to use his secondary weapon?
Like I said, this tank is a tank that is countering the new: "infantry (shooting) in bush visible only to open top/commanders mechanic", while Colonials are left to counter it with standard non-stagerring pistol, non-Staggering Pitch gun.

What is interesting the new Brigand Outlaw base variant does more damage than HTD granted all 30mm shots pen.
Its 1200 (3x400) 30mm damage over 1050 damage for HTD as you stated here (granted if all shots pen).
https://foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/30mm
Brigand does 2x damage as regular 40mm (600 dmg regular 40mm).

Catara now costs 15 rmats instead of 165 bmats, but comes in crates of 20 instead of 10.

Warden sniper (Clancy-Raca M4) does 101-151 dmg (1 shot down) 57.5m effective.
Colonial sniper (KRR3-792 Auger) does 69-103 dmg (rare 1 shot down) 54m effective.
Colonial 20mm sniper (“Quickhatch” Rt.I, fac locked) does 150-225 AT dmg (1 shot kill, effective against tanks and mounted weapons) 52.5m effective.

I was correct about Warden sniper 1 shot 1 down (more or less; I said kill not down, probably because when I play infantry I rarely finish off downed players, rather go for next player in line straight away).
Having a sniper that both does more damage and has greater range is not ballanced (original factory snipers) even if there is slight difference in crate difference and magazine size.
https://foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/Clancy-Raca_M4
https://foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/KRR3-792_Auger

Chieftain carries 6 250mm rounds (5 in inventory, 1 in chamber), ballista carries 11.
Scorpion (ballista base vic now) costs 100 rmats, down from 155.

I was correct about Balista having twice as much shells than a Chieftain has (give/take 1 shell).

Scorpion: Designated Ammo Slot capacity reduced from 60 to 25.
Each gunner has now ~13 x 12.7mm in chamber before they need to pullback and restock on ammo, instead of 31 x 12.7mm.
If we are giving buff stats, we also need to add nerf stats as well.

Talking about ISG's, Kingspire 20% turret rotation increase is very nice, also I could not find stats in terms to max ammo capacity of Kingspire.

Flood Mk. I (12.7) 5100hp, 15650 armor (25%-50%), 7.21m/s (on road), 0 inv slots.
Flood Mk. VII (flame) 5100hp, 16250 armor (23%-50%), 6.39m/s (on road), 0 inv slots.
Lance-36 (75mm) 6250hp, 15650 armor (25%-50%), 6.25m/s (on road), 16 inv slots.
Lance-25 (94.5mm) 6250hp, 15650 armor (20%-50%), 3.94m/s (on road), 8 inv slots.

I was incorrect talking about overall stats between BT's, should have not used that word.
Guess it is HP over speed after all, and Warden BT's faster while Colonial BT's have more health.

However:
Lance-25 Hasta – Designated Ammo Slot capacity increased from 8 to 12.
https://www.foxholegame.com/post/update-59-dev-branch-released

Are these inventory slots you are writing about not designated ammo slots for storing ammo? Aka you cannot store anything other than ammunition in them? Key word being "designated"?

Alligator Charge (satchel) does 400 dmg, up from 300
Hydra's Whisper does 550 dmg, up from 350

More satchels can be carried in inventory and fat walked to destination, hydra can be only carried 1 at a time,
which is something I would prefer myself over more damage (as well as being more stealthy when having in 3rd slot to my intentions).
I myselft actually prefer QoL like these in terms of weapon handling, more so than a little bit more damage.

Same as catara, dusk now costs 15 rmats instead of 165 bmats, but comes in crates of 20 instead of 10.

Bardiche cycle speed is .2 sec faster than pre update, reload speed was nerfed by 1 sec, but fire speed was buffed by 1.2 sec. Not counting the first shot, dps is now 113.2 (up from 109.1)

Its not firing speed but firing duration – is it not how fast you shoot after initial reload, but how fast you shoot second round after shooting the first and second 68mm shell?

I will be honest I have about 1.5k-2k hours as tanker but only as driver, I only drive tanks, I cant even remember last time I actually shot out of a tank (apart from some quick qrf where i had to jump in a tank and shoot for a couple of minutes to quickly help out with QRF).

My understanding was "shooting speed" targets the time it takes to shoot between the 2 reloaded shots and where it matters the most, however when diving at an enemy tank, the crew will not wait to reload all 2 shots, they will keep shooting straight away, once one shell had been reloaded to try to finish the tank as soon as possible.

The Bardiche in a tankline is designed to recieve/tank shots so other tanks can retaliate, so it cannot afford to pull out everytime to reload both shells and make other tanks wait 9 seconds before it is ready to drive back up to continue the fight; this 2 shot autoloader is mostly good for first time engagements during a tankline brawl untill either side wins or completle retreats to regroup.

Could you link the DPS source you used for Bardiche DPS?

Now onto the real post

While the flask is strong, especially with the tracking potential, it is very easy for tanks to dodge if thrown poorly. It is true that the ignifist does perform poorly later in the war when tanks have more armor, but at that point you have the bane and venom to make up for it. Also the white ash stripping armor will do nothing. It strips 300 armor, most that will do is make every tank impossible to store if we cap them.

Saying the Warden Flask is strong is an understatement. It has been one of the most broken weapon in the game since I remember. It is NOT easy for tanks to dodge it, because of the splash damage it does – sometimes it is actually better to manuover to get hit by flask on the turret than try to escape and get tracked only because the flask lands near the tank tracks.
Remember – tanks are 100% tracked not on flask direct contact with tank, but with indirect splash damage.
The bane is mainly used for defence, altough there have been bane squads, it does not 100% track. The Venom does not 100% track either. Neither of these penetrate 100% while the flask does (please keep in mind Wardens also have the Cutler that is also good against tanks, heck last war I found 1 with 1 rgp, shot i at HTD side and tracked it first shot, good rng yes but the Cutler is decent).

Currently Colonials HAVE NO counterpart to flask that 100% tracks tank and can track 2 tanks at the same time, it is the most powerful AT weapon there is in the whole game by miles.

Flask armour strip is still a buff, after so many thrown flasks, if a Colonial tanks survives, it will not have full armour (like it did previously) and will have to consider going to garage to fix it or not, where previously it was only full HP hammer on location to get the tank back in shape – no need to drive back to garage for armour repairs.

It strange to talk about not being able to put a captured Colonial tank in depot or seaport, capturing tanks does not happen that frequently (and is low on priority list) especially on frontlines where there are several tanks on both sides.
You will want to strip tank armour as much as you can to get your faction tanks to easier pen enemy tanks with their shots, so everything focused towards that will help in the fight overall.

Care to give an opinion about Colonial Ignifist? Lol
If the flask is to remain having 100% track change, Ignifist should have a very very high turret or fuel chance, to ballance things out IMO (even up to 80% which statistically would be even lower than the flask percentage to track, which is wild).

Based on what I have seen of the new warden exclusive AT grenade, it is just a AT tremola with less range. I assume you can guess how ♥♥♥♥ it will probably be if you have ever tried to use a lunaire against tanks.

I would have to test the grenade for myself to form an opinion.
Tremolas have been used to finish off tracked/disabled/stationary tanks (mostly HTDs), just as I suspect this new AT tank will do. The flask with 100% track chance has now a role for other AT infantry. It just takes 1 Warden to lob 1 flask near tracks of a tank, and other wardens will finish it off with AT grenade.
GAC can also use the new AT nade, and Im guessing so will the Predator?

Wardens that had been complaning about Colonial being only faction to produce Bane and Venom ammo, are the only faction that can produce the Varsi AT grenade.

Best thing I can say about the grenades is that wardens use the harpa as a conditional weapon, and usually bunker bases are not supplied with it other than early war when we get hundreds of crates of them in seaports. Compare this with colonial bombastone use, and that warden trench systems are usually built around the bombastone, and you get the picture.

The trench design around bomastones you are talking about was before the recent patch, especially since the current patch isnt out yet, so not sure why you are using that as an argument. The new Boma throwing distance nerf will change this.
Warden logi not supplying a weapon is a non-argument IMO, falls flat. If you need it produced or delivered call it out in logi chat or do it yourself. I myself have seen many harpas on frontlines during wars.

I repeat once again – I will take a grenade that has only 1 meter shorter range, and has 100% kill chance, than a grenade that has 1 meter more and 100% bleed chance. The bleed you can stop with bandage, the kill chance (or down chance) you cannot stop by yourself.

The Bomastone being superior to the Harpa is now a myth – it was used everytimg Colonials would talk about the OP Flask (100% bleed chance and range, now only 1 meter range difference between Harpa and Harpa has 100% down chance), now it is a moot point, while Flask is still OP with 100% track chance.

[Party San]

2/2 - two of two

In a straight up fight, with equivalent crews and no skill issues, a 1v1 of spatha and outlaw will almost always end in the spatha's victory. Look at the hp/dps differences in the stats section. (pre update spatha had equivalent dps to the widow)

Spatha does look better with HP and armour difference, but like I said before in this post, Outlaw has ony 0.5 slower reload speed (according to link to latest update that I provided), can you please provide the link to your source regarding Outlaw stats.

There is always track or fuel rng, with that happening the Outlaw will simply outrange the Spatha, and sit at a cofortable 45 meter range while shooting. Outlaw if turreted can speed boost and has a greater chance to outrun Spatha, granted with a little bit of luck perphaps – however to be truthful all this did also happen before the 20%HV Outlaw buff.

With new AT rifle changes, the Outlaw mg can prove to be even more useful than it was in the past.

Outlaw is the new best generalist tank from both factions with the following roles:
*Poke tank (45m)
*Flank tank (speed boost)
*Pve tank (HV20)
*Tankline tank (decent armour and HP and reload speed - 5 seconds)
*Trench clearing tank (machine gun)

Outlaw speed boost does help Outlaws climb steeper slopes as I did find out once when I was chasing a turreted Outlaw with a Falchion and the Outlaw had escaped due to climbing a steep slope.

Hawthorne (secondary rifle) is decent, but like every secondary weapon, no one makes them. This is especially true of the Cascadier (3 shot pistol), in all my time playing I have almost never seen them on a front, and the
range is terrible.

Combination of Hawthorne and Oddysey is very lethal since pitch gun had stagger effect removed. I have used this rifle few wars back and I do remember it being decent.

I dont think an argument of people not producing this rifle is a valid one, you could always produce this rifle yourself or ask logi if indeed it is such a big problem.

If the Cascadeer has staggering effect, now that the normal pistol doesnt, it is much better than the standard pistol. I remember being killed many times by tank commander looking out of hatch using the cascadeer.

My point stands, that Wardens have 3 secondary weapons (all decent if cascadeer has stagger effect), while Colonial have a mediocre, or just bad 1 secondary weapon, the Pitch gun with no stagger effect.

I agree that the BEat and colonial SHT are bad, Eat is just better and the only way for the warden SHT to be better is when colonials steal one.

I cannot comment on tanking skills on either side, both sides have proficient tankers and starting crews surely, and everything in between. This post/thread is about faction ballance without taking skill into consideration.

I do not know why you are talking about the cutler+jeep combo as if it is warden exclusive, you have a jeep that you can mount a rocket launcher to.

Well Colonial rpg jeep is facility locked, neither cutler or base Warden jeep are. However sure, you are right, lets skip the jeeps:
A Warden with a Hauler full of RPG will clear twice as many Watchtowers then a Colonial with a Hauler full of Tremola.
I dont remember exact number of rpgs a Warden with specialist uniform can have in inventory, but Colonial with grenadier uniform can carry max of 6 tremolas – that is only 3 dead watchtowers in 1 go.
Pretty sure Warden with rpg/specialist uniform can kill at least twice as many with rpgs in his inventory, surely at least Warden specialist uniform can carry 6 rpgs.
(In a scenario where both arent caught).

Next update the colonials will also have a 1 shot kill sniper, fac locked and with the worst sniper range yes, but it will have the capabilities to wipe out every tripod on the map and shoot tanks for little to no damage with the 20mm rework.

Key word being "facility" locked. Colonials need to produce an extra step to get a 1 shot AT sniper which they have to use to shoot infantry with, that has less range than the Warden factory sniper.

So the Warden sniper outranges both Colonial snipers which is a counter to the Colonial AT sniper (makes sense with AT sniper, not so much with factory snipers).

We both know the Colonial faction is the faction that depends on tripods more than the Warden faction, also Wardens have a tripod Bonesaw that they can hide in trenches/octagons making them invisible to both tanks and the new AT sniper, which will prevent it getting killed, so saying "wiping out every tripod on map" is a strech.

The tripods take 8 or 9 shots to kill with the , and if Im not mistaken redeploying and deploying a tripod weapon will refill the tripod HP back to full %, unless this has been changed.

If the Wardens do not counter the Colonial facility locked AT sniper, with their longer range factory sniper before Foebreaker or Ratcatcher dies, that is entirely on them.

Also 20mm does not stack in the inventory like 7.62 does.

Ballista is more focused on conc clearing, Chieftain trench clearing. Also, Ballista is just going to be like the spatha, with large regiments building thousands a war (new mpf cost is 70 rmats + upgrade cost per tank)

Balista is no longer MPF-able, because it is not a base tank, it is a variant that needs to be made in a facility.

Balista needs Scorpion help when going toward target with infantry filled trenches between, Chieftain is self sufficient in this matter (the more Chieftains rushing with 12.7mm gunners, the better).

Chieftain has a huge advantage because it will kill infantry trying to QRF and supress AT pillboxes, please dont downplay it to only "mostly trench clearing role" (mid to late game Wardens only use the Chieftain to conc rush, 250push isnt used as extensively if at all from what I noticed, so no, it does not have a mostly trench clearing role, that role acts like a bonus to this 250mm tank – Wardens have many other tanks that have machine guns that can clear trenches).
Regarding extra ammo, just twice as many Chieftains are needed to rush a concrete to achieve a similar result in terms of load.

However with new bunker changes, perphaps it will take even less shells than before, to delete conc bunkers in general, guess time will tell during the next war or two, so 250mm ammo count will play less of a role in general.

Are you saying Balista production will be greated than when Balista was MPF-able and easier to ship in crates?
You know Colonials were in a similar situation, because the Balista was facility locked, the Colonial faction had not been productin as many (from what I remember).
I guess next wars will tell if you are correct.

Warden ac variants are the highlander (off road speed), wildjack (flamethrower, colonial equivalent in flame tankette), and Gravekeeper (arc-rpg launcher, pcm cost, colonial equivalent with rpg ac and 20mm ac neither costing pcms).

You forgot to include the HAC (Heavy Armoured Car) Knave and the GAC (Grenade Armoured Car) Freeman to the collection of AC's Wardens have, which proves my point of Wardens having more AC variants in general.
https://foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/Armoured_Car#Warden-0
HAC shoots 40mm, GAC can shoot: Tremola, Smoke, Harpa, Gas AND the new Varsi AT grenade, making this vehicle more useful in later wars, depending on the tech level of the Varsi.
https://foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/O%27Brien_V.190_Knave#Inventory_&_Armament-0
.
So it now has anti-inf, pve and AT capabilities.
Both have no equivalent on Colonial side (even the new Colonial MTD can only shoot Tremola).

Like the stygian, the lordscar can be decrewed by one man with a grenade. unlike the stygian, the lordscar does not have 52.5m range (with barrel length). Lordscar dps is 200.1, 40 more than a htd that does not require 40 steel mats.

If I recall correctly Lordscar has 4 man crew, crew can swap inside in a heartbeat to driver once driver is dead, very hard to decrewed by infantry with rifle because of its wonky hitbox also from the back (unless something has changed this patch with the new aim assist regarding different heights),
It is much much faster than Stygian to pull out, especially offroad and does not need to deploy to be able to shoot.
Stygian can only hold 1 shells additionally have 1 external person carrying a shell so 2 in total.
STD can hold 12 shells plus one in chamber.
https://foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/Silverhand_Lordscar_-_Mk._X#Inventory_&_Armament-0

From Foxhole Wiki: Stygian Innefective range: 47.5 meters; Sygian Effective range: 42.5 meters.
Not sure where did you get 52.5m range for the Stygian? Is range of pushguns calculated from shield, and not end of barrel?

Stygian has innefective range, which is not accurate also does bounce much much more than when shooting from effective range (reasons why people that use Stygian avoid innefective range all together most of the time).

We could compare the Stygian to warden Balfour Stockade, which has 42.5 innefective range or, 47.5 innefective range.
https://foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/Balfour_Stockade_75mm#Inventory_&_Armament-0
Stockade has a curved blast shield that gives crew better protection from being decrewed than the Stygian.

However comparing STD with Talos is a complete bust lol (altough truth be told, Talos should be compared to Warden Stockade), even tough now Talos is a lot cheaper to produce (and its shell count has been overall increased in previous patches).

Landing a Bomastones successfuly will only bleed the crew (Boma 100% bleed), when they manage to pull back to safety and get medical before they bleed out, Im sure if Colonials had 100% killing chance nade (Harpa), the crew would die instead of driving off into the sunset (been there, done that).

Having sucess rate of landing 2 good cooked Bomas on STD only doable when crew is afk or driver is playing with monitor turned off, and squad vc muted (a small exaggeration, but you get what I mean).

Also is it not easier to decrew open top tanks with flask?

The scorpion is the lategame colonial equivalent to the kingspire role wise in tank lines, same intel collecting ability and inventory space to support other tanks.

Scorpion is the best IST in the game,100%. Kingspire however has the advantage of being early game.

I agree that the old colonial sub's turning radius was bs, due to its 40% buff and the naki's 20% nerf, the naki now only turns twice as fast as the trident (used to be 7 times), which makes sense given the size difference.

Things like torpedo loading for Warden subs from carts should be adressed, Im not a big Navy player but I think Colonial submarine was to have advantage of being able to load torpedos from anywhere else than a seaport.
The carts have rendered this moot.

I know of Warden Battleship having 3x2 150 guns that work better in certain situations than Colonial 2x3 150.

Also returning to gunboats:
Warden gunboat: Ronan: 8.23 m/s
https://foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/74b-1_Ronan_Gunship#Engine_&_Mobility-0
Colonial gunboat: Charon: 6.69 m/s
https://foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/Type_C_-_%E2%80%9CCharon%E2%80%9D#Engine_&_Mobility-0

So not only does the Warden gunboat has 360 degree mortar rotation where Colonial gunboat does not, not only has it a place where crew can hide, where Colonial crew is expose all the time, the Warden gunboat is also faster.

The Colonial gunboat has guns on it sides, so it actually should be the faster gunboat to be able to swim side by side to the Warden gunboat and shoot it from the sides, but as it plays out now on paper, the Warden gunboat is at an advantage because it can outrun the Colonial gunboat, and shoot using rear mounted gun (can shoot from front or back only).

The Warden gunboat is only 20 rmat more costly.

I won't talk about infantry weapons because they are more about personal preference more than anything else (I prefer the loughcaster over most other infantry weapons because I like to not miss), but I will say that the Aalto's semi auto function could be removed one day and it would take years for anyone to notice.

Yes many infantry weapons are personal preference, but there are broken weapons such as the Fiddler (that is not only my opinion) being simply a laser gun.
Aalto semi auto has long range and is quite accurate as I have found out quite recently by finding it and using it as a Collie, as I mostly use rifles for infantry play (at least 95% of playtime).
The new Warden shotgun being second slot and 1 shot down from 5 meters, is much better than the Colonial shotgun (I see no reason why I would take Colonial shotgun over Argenti, however the Warden shotgun can be COMBINED with a Blakerow or Loughcaster since its a 2nd slot weapon - if you run out of ammo in primary slot u still have 2 powerfull shots that are leathal at close range. Alternatively it can be switched mid fight from rifle to shotgun if enemy is closing in).

The biggest problem I have with the current balance is Falchion MPF bonus (56.6 rmats each) and AT/rpg production exclusivity, think if you stole a warden sniper rifle and it used a ammo that you also had to steal.

I think you are overexaggerating the Falchion MPF bonus.

I have seen on frontlines dozens upon dozens of Warden tanks, much more than Colonial tanks even with the extra +2 Falchion crate bonus for many wars, so Wardens seem to do quite well regardless of this – there is no visible difference.

For the +2 Falchion bonus to work, Colonials would have to have extra player slots in hexes, to be able to bring more tanks into the hex in general, but guess what – Colonials still have to wait in line and in queue to get those extra tanks in, so in the longer run it does not really matter, and devs "zerg" strat for Colonial side falls short.

Falchion being a yeet tank does sound nice, however you have to understand that not many people want to keep yeeting a tank, losing it within 5 minutes, then going back to seaport to pull out the tank and rearming and driving back to frontline (gets a lot worse with queues to hexes).
So in theory it sounds pretty, in practice its quite a lot of boring work, I myself do not participate in this, and I dont think I ever did (most I did is sacrifice the Falchion over another Colonial tank that had more value, most of Colonial tanks do, lol).

With the way the economy is in game (unless something changed) with nearly infinite rmats, +2 Falchion does bring very little for the Colonial Faction, There is no realistic way the Falchion bonus contributes much to Colonials winning wars IMO.

The Falchion tank within itself feels bland, and if a person is not upgrading it to a Spatha (even now with only 10% HV40) IMO is wasting the rmats that had been used to produce that Falchion.

On a side not I was hoping it would be Colonials to get an original tank variant, but of course wardens yet got another variant, the 30mm even tough they already had rapid 20mm. Colies only have 40mm, 68mm, flame and now also MTD with Tremola, while Wardens have so many (and much more) interesting variants with AC's, Tanks and infantry weapons...

If the only ballance problem Wardens see is the +2 Falchion, then Wardens do not have to worry about anything lol.

PS. Totally forgot about Warden partisan Duck Car as well as SkyCaller, both very very good, but I think this wall of text is big enough.

[Quad Shot]

Not going to mention much as I want to spend the next 2+ hours playing foxhole not writing about it, when I say cycle speed it is how fast a tank can go from firing a shell to firing the next one. This calculation takes into account both the firing duration (how long it takes after firing a shell before you can reload) and reload duration (how long it takes to load the next shell), by adding these up you get the cycle speed.

For example, the spatha's reload duration is 3 seconds and firing duration is 1.5 seconds. This means that after you fire a shell, it takes 4.5 seconds until you can fire again.

The dps calculations were done by me by calculating the shells fired per minute, multiplying by the shells damage to find dpm and dividing by 60 to find dps

calculating the spathas dps looks like this
reload duration: 3sec
fire duration: 1.5sec
3+1.5 = 4.5 (cycle speed)
60/4.5 = 13.33333 (fire rate per minute)
13.33333*660 = 8800 (dpm)
8800/60 = 146.66667 (dps)

The BT inventory slots was a mistake on my part as I based it off a section of the wiki that has not been updated in a long time (sidebar on right has not been changed to show the dedicated ammo slot change).

edit: the entire lordscar crew is exposed, a two bombastone's would be needed to kill the crew, but harpa radius means that two well placed harpas would be needed for the same effect.

[Puppet Pal Clem]

omg you guys are trying to outdo each other with who can write the biggest bible lol

[Quad Shot]

Originally posted by Puppet Pal Clem:

omg you guys are trying to outdo each other with who can write the biggest bible lol

party san has clearly won in this sense.

[Party San]

Originally posted by Puppet Pal Clem:

omg you guys are trying to outdo each other with who can write the biggest bible lol

I have written everything I believe in regards to imballances between the two teams (not without errors, but they were sincere errors, and not something I tried to push because I have an agenda – ie. Cycle/dps in terms of Spatha vs Outlaw in regards to new update changes).
Dont read everything if you dont want to – scroll to 1 paragraph and read it (apart from Spatha/Outlaw info in terms of cycle and dps, I need to edit that). Then during war, find out if its true, ask around, check wiki – just for that thing in that 1 paragraph (of course if you want).

Sure this is an assymetrical game and its fine to leave some assymetry, but some things just have been too assymetrical to the point where Colonials stopped playing (like Colonial navy before the recent patches), and the flask which is still broken, where Wardens do not understand (I believe many are on puprose not ackowledging flask power).

Originally posted by Quad Shot:

party san has clearly won in this sense.

If you dont want to reply to 95% of what I have written, at least keep the snarky remarks to yourself, or dont, but you will get back similar comments in return.
Its not just volume for volume sake – I am giving legit comparison discrepancies, what I believe to be true.

You are the one writing nonsense about the +2 Falchion in crates, like that was something very big for Colonials (gave good reasons why its not), SO MANY Warden tanks during wars, I dont see Falchions (or Spathas after fac upgrade) massively outpopping Warden tanks, do you? Why is there not for each 3 Warden tanks 5 Colonial tanks during tank fights (Spatha or Falchion)? Because thats not how it works. There is pop limit, queues, player numbers on each side during wars to take into consideration, Logistics, rmat economy...
Guess what, I will not be surprised if now Colonials will mass produce Bardiches because of the 2 shot autoloader, instead of Falchions because of the +2 bonus in each crate...

The biggest error I did in my posts was about "the cycle" between Spatha and Outlaw yes, but that does not change fact Outlaw is the better generalist tank (poke tank, flank tank, tankline tank, trench clearing tank, pve tank), and Wardens have more specialist tanks (more original variants).
Many things I have written are true (for example Colonials having worse Navy in general – submarine buffs/nerfs this patch will make it better, up to Colonials that use sea vics to see how playing field will be this next war).
I dont want to repeat myself, its there in my previous posts in this thread.

However I stand by what I said about Bardiche. In a tankline it cannot afford to pull back and reload all 2 shells, its a Brawler tank designed to get hit, and push enemy tankline back shelding lighter tanks, such as the LTD as they retaliate.

I have been playing this game since war 90, since when Colonials did not have any hand held pve tools, and Wardens had the cutler (when both teams used satchels to kill concrete).
I remember Colonials having to steal Cutlers from the battle field to use to clear Warden pillboxes.

Then Colonials recieved the Lunaire/ Tremola, but is was SO underpowered it took 4 (or 3?) tremolas to kill a Watchtower (if I remember correctly) while back then still Cutler with 1 rpg killed a Watchtower.

Throughout my whole playtime Colonials had always the worst arsenal, and always missing something to be able to compete on a level playing field with the Wardens. Many vets I talked to back then had been saying that Warden is easy mode and Colonial is hard mode, and for good reasons (which generaly is fine).

As of this patch, the game is way more ballance than it was back then by comparison, but there are still places where it is silly broken (Flask, I dont care if you agree or not, I call Warden bias on any Warden thinking its ok to have AT with 100% track chance, without Colonials having any other AT tool that has high rng (100% is highest there can be)).

This thread is about what faction has better tools in general for war based on opinions, observations during wars and numbers (something which I failed to provide initially), but also its here to introduce new players to certain mechanics (example – new player might not know Stygian is slower off road, and has to deploy etc, this is mentioned somewhere in this thread).

Not going to mention much as I want to spend the next 2+ hours playing foxhole not writing about it, when I say cycle speed it is how fast a tank can go from firing a shell to firing the next one. This calculation takes into account both the firing duration (how long it takes after firing a shell before you can reload) and reload duration (how long it takes to load the next shell), by adding these up you get the cycle speed.

For example, the spatha's reload duration is 3 seconds and firing duration is 1.5 seconds. This means that after you fire a shell, it takes 4.5 seconds until you can fire again.

The dps calculations were done by me by calculating the shells fired per minute, multiplying by the shells damage to find dpm and dividing by 60 to find dps

calculating the spathas dps looks like this
reload duration: 3sec
fire duration: 1.5sec
3+1.5 = 4.5 (cycle speed)
60/4.5 = 13.33333 (fire rate per minute)
13.33333*660 = 8800 (dpm)
8800/60 = 146.66667 (dps)

The BT inventory slots was a mistake on my part as I based it off a section of the wiki that has not been updated in a long time (sidebar on right has not been changed to show the dedicated ammo slot change).

Listen, if you dont want to reply its fine. Im glad you explained what you meant cycle after I inquired, I will go back and edit parts of the posts regarding this.

Anyone reading this – especially new players, can verity what I am writing in general in game, if they only choose to do so.
What is more I believe many players will come to many conclusions as I have in my posts, simply because many things are true (Balista vs Chieftain for example).

I overheard recently people comparing Warden Gunboat to Colonial Gunboat, saying Colonial gunboat is s*it, and its not because they got the info from me, from this post, but because thats how it is, for several reasons, they came to their own similar conclusion.
So its fine, read these posts, dont read them, comment on them, dont comment on them. All fine by me.

edit: the entire lordscar crew is exposed, a two bombastone's would be needed to kill the crew, but harpa radius means that two well placed harpas would be needed for the same effect.

How long is the Lordscar open top crew area? 6 meters? 7 meters?
My point was to prove the Boma is not superior to the Harpa (as is still being repeated by many Wardens) after recent changes.
Needing both 2 Bomastone and 2 Harpa to kill for example Lordscar crew, proves the Bomastone is not superior to the Harpa. With 2 "well placed" Harpas you might kill all 4 crewmembers, with 1 you might kill 1 crewmember or 2 crewmembers, where with a Bomastone you might only bleed them.

You will have a bigger chance to 1 shot decrew any pushgun with a Harpa than with a Bomastone, and just 1 meter difference in throwing distance. You will have a bigger chance to bleed any pushgun crew with Bomastone.

https://foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/A3_Harpa_Fragmentation_Grenade
It deals 200 Light Kinetic damage at the point of impact and decreasing amounts in a 5.5m radius.

https://foxhole.wiki.gg/wiki/Bomastone_Grenade
It deals 125 Shrapnel damage at the point of impact and decreasing amounts in a 6.5m radius.

Harpa to Bomastone difference: 1 meter radius difference, 1 meter throwing distance diference.

The Bomastone is not superior to the Harpa grenade.
But the Flask is superior to all Colonial AT weapons (100% track chance, 100% penetrate chance, strips armour, autoequip, throw from barges, decent amount in inventory before getting encumbered).

To anyone asking: why is he talking about flask and bomastone in comparison?
Because anytime Colonials would talk about how OP the flask is, Wardens would come out of the woodwork and talk about how Bomastone throwing range, and bleed chance was soooo bad (Harpa down chance 100% > Bomastone bleed chance 100% after throw range update).
Bomastone got nerfed to the ground, flask nerfs were cosmetic.

[Henrique Lique]

Only a colonial would say such stupid thing (Prefer harpas over bomas). Bomas literally rain from the sky on any trench fight at night. )

[Party San]

Originally posted by Henrique Lique:

Only a colonial would say such stupid thing (Prefer harpas over bomas). Bomas literally rain from the sky on any trench fight at night. )

Do you have problems understanding what I have written?
Do you know the new Bomastone range nerf has not been in game yet during a normal war?
1 meter range between Bomastone and Harpa on throwing range from the NEXT war we will have, you are talking about Bomastones from the past, in the past wars before the nerf.

Typical Warden with knee-jerk reaction, when he hears: Bomastone lol.

Edit: You prefer 100% bleed than 100% kill on grenade impact? lol Im all for switching Harpa for Bomastone for Colonials even with -1m throw range and -1m radius, no problem.

[Quad Shot]

At first this thread seemed rather constructive, now it just looks like a buffoon bait posting.

[Party San]

Originally posted by Quad Shot:

At first this thread seemed rather constructive, now it just looks like a buffoon bait posting.

Hey thanks for letting us know how you feel, would appreciate if you would specify which part you think is bait, the last part where I give my opinion of prefering Harpa over Boma (after most recent Boma nerf)? Or something more?

For everyone else that is still reading this thread I have created a janky diagram trying to visualise White Ash aka flask splash damage (I did some kindergarten school type maths lol).
I dont know how to embed images into Steam forum posts because Im a noob, so I posted the image on imgur:

https://imgur.com/a/white-ash-splash-diagram-fixed-typos-MRvSb1B

Special shoutout to Foxhole planner.

Ps. Fixed typos, uploaded again.

[Party San]

Well i guess there is another thing worth mentioning.

I have heard that new Warden ATR can be shot out of gunboats, while the Colonial ATR cannot (have not tried this by myself). Can anyone explain why?
Just like back in the day, Wardens could throw Flasks out of Barges (I mean they still can but since navy has been updated perphaps not that important atm), while Colonials could not shoot ignifist out of barges, we had only mamon and stickies to use with much much limited range.

Why did Wardens get ATR that is able to be used from gunboat (not sure if from barge also?), and Colonials did not, despite having a worse gunboat in their arsenal?

Also, how come a burst fire Booker is base weapon for AUTOMATIC atr (Greyhound), while Dusk a base weapon that is AUTOMATIC is turned into burst atr?
I mean this is a game, either one could be programmed into being able to be turned into strawberry cheesecake, but that would also not make much sense.

Almost looks like the atrs were swapped last minute, and the greyhound was supposed to be collie and burstfire atr would be warden. Since wardens have the better gunboat, having collie atr that can shoot from gunboat could make naval much more pleasant for collies.
Also would make sense, since burst fire base gun would be turned into burst fire atr, and auto base gun would be turned into auto atr.

[Loonessia]

Originally posted by Quad Shot:

At first this thread seemed rather constructive, now it just looks like a buffoon bait posting.

If we could actually be constructive about things and not derail the convo into an underhanded flame war, that'd be nice. Talking about "The size of bibles" is basically "I just wanted to post" in the context of this thread, I have to admit. And while I took this

Originally posted by Quad Shot:

Originally posted by Puppet Pal Clem:

omg you guys are trying to outdo each other with who can write the biggest bible lol

party san has clearly won in this sense.

as a joke, still not cool man.
Party san was pretty clear about a lot of things, and I can agree with a lot of them. I've also read your posts and you did add to a respectful convo and even to a point cleared up some of the warden bias that's been presented.

both of you, let's either parley this thread, before it turns for the worse, or continue conductivity. Ignore any "insults" any faction would like to bring to it. You don't want it locked because a dev thought this was an unholy flame war.

Now then, a couple things I'd like to note

Wardens get an ARC/RPG bonesaw. They typically love to use this as an insta kill weapon given how (relatively cheap?) the ammo can be. Bomastone and harpas can't compare to the instant death a bonesaw can bring.

Also to note, the B2 Varsi Anti Tank Grenade. I see it as "Shoot behind the enemy tank, and they'll either get max damage from the back, or they have to push further in (Which they won't do if they're already getting poked by let's say, an outlaw) or they'll have to back OVER the grenade and if they have enough time they'll be able to dodge it. It adds to the chaos that is in the warden arsenal of anti tank bursting. I see it as a rehashed Bonesaw trading raw damage and explosive timer, for the ease of firing it from a rifle slingshot and 4 meters more range

Clancy Raca can be pretty busted. The tradeoff is basically "5 more meters and instakill for 2 less per crate" I don't get this. In a scenario I'd use a sniper rifle, I'd be up on a cliff, and in that case, the wardens have an advantage, which is exactly what's going on right now scuttletown-fort rictus. The worst part about the auger to me right now, is basically that the stabilization time for both of them is around the same. Auger is pretty much inferior to the Raca, unless i'm missing something.

[Osiris Zoran]

They need to bring the collie Auger sniper rifle up to 101-150 damage. it is complete garbage with how long it takes to acquire a target you shoot them once and they run away. You cant kill anyone with it.

The Quickhatch takes forever to acquire target and even locked in it still misses majority of the time.