Signals setup is too difficult

[chris.australia]

Why is setting up signals so difficult?
I have 2 tracks side by side, I setup signal towers like in the video. ............. nothing!
arrghhhhhhhhh
The original one in the tutorial began to animate to show it was working, this second one does nothing :-(

[Mudfog]

What do you mean by "nothing!".

[chaney]

From the Signals section of this guide:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1293183195

"There are other guides on the topic, so this will be brief. For some reason this has been a difficult topic for many, but the signal behavior is simple and effective if you understand it.

TIP #1 If you are used to signals in another game, FORGET WHAT YOU THINK SIGNALS DO IN ***THIS*** GAME! Don't try to make your expectations match the game, instead learn how the game does work.

Signals divide track into blocks. In Realistic mode, only ONE train may use a block of track at a time, the first train to claim a particular block goes first while the others wait for it to exit the block.

The signals may require some practice and experiment to use effectively. Please play with them while not trying to win a scenario!!!

There are two types of signal: Stop and Directional. Stop signals are represented during construction by a yellow cone, Directional by a yellow cone with a red disc (the "no" symbol.)

Signals will cause trains traveling in the direction of the cone to stop if the block ahead is not clear. Stop signals will have no effect on trains going the other way, but Directional signals will completely prevent trains from going in the other direction. Use them to make an efficient two-track setup.

With tool tips on, directions are at the bottom of the screen.

You can place individual signals, or many at a time. Hitting CTRL will place signals along an entire section of track with one click. They will be spaced roughly a full train length apart.

Click to place Stop signals, SHIFT-Click for Directional. The mouse wheel will change the planned signal direction while building, and clicking on an existing signal will change its direction."

If this doesn't make the mechanics click for you, post a screen shot and we'll try to find the problem.

[chris.australia]

Thanks but no thanks.
When splitting tracks there is a given, the game knows the player should always set a direction for each track. The game should automatically insert a switch above each line where the player just clicks to set direction. That's it. Simple.
But instead, the game has the player do tedious work, and then when the signals aren't doing what their supposed to....what? what can a player do? waste more time trying to lay them down again, but then it doesn't work, what do you expect the player will feel?

[chaney]

Quoting myself quoting myself:

"TIP #1 If you are used to signals in another game, FORGET WHAT YOU THINK SIGNALS DO IN ***THIS*** GAME! Don't try to make your expectations match the game, instead learn how the game does work."

It's not that bad, you can literally populate a pair of tracks with a set of spaced Directional Signals in about 2 seconds. Literally 2 seconds.

If signals were automatically placed and were NOT what you wanted, how much tedious time would be wasted cleaning that up? There are a LOT of situations where I don't want things to be done the way the software would automatically default to do them. MS Word and Clippy come to mind.

[Mudfog]

A screenshot of one end of the two tracks where they connect to a station may help us sort out your problem.

[ElPrezCBF]

It's not hard to understand signals actually. You just need to know the difference between two way signals (without stop icon) and directional signals (with stop icon). Your problem could be due to one of two scenarios. Either you wrongly used two way signals or placed the first directional signal at the opposite end instead of the highlighted area indicated by the tutorial (signal placement must be in sequence for the tutorial to proceed) although in normal gameplay, there's no required placement sequence. You can tell whether you placed a directional signal by the moving dotted lines on the track in the direction pointed to by the signal. This will not appear if it's a two way signal.

[chris.australia]

Tip for developers

1. For every fork, display an option above each track that allows for switching directions.
2. _nothing else, that's it_

I would argue that this is much easier UIX for the player.

[chris.australia]

....by the way, I have played this before, eventually I figured out how to use signals, but I do remember that it was painstakingly difficult, and I would always be wasting a lot of time setting it up that felt frustrating. That's my recollection, and now the experience is just being repeated. :-(

[daddy_felix]

I never had any problems with signals... maybe I saw an explanation on Youtube or whatever...

[The_10th_Man]

Setting signals had been one of the most frustrating tasks for me as well until a few days ago. The on screen help only tells you to do one at a time (shift = directional, control = multi, wheel = change direction). It doesn't tell you what happens when you combine them together.

So I had played more than 300 hours not realising that you can hold down both shift and control together and left click to set up a directional signal with multi points on either long or short sections of track. Then you can add a small spin of the mouse wheel on the neighbouring track to change the direction (at the same time as holding down both shift and control) and get trains flowing each way on dedicated tracks in a matter of seconds.

Main additional tip I can give is don't add a supply tower onto the new section of track until after you have set the directional signals on both sides of the track. The tower acts as a road block for the insertion of the signals, so you will have to repeat the above on both sides of the tower if you add it first. The automatic distancing of the multi tracks also works a bit like justified alignment in a Word document. There will be some wider gaps that tend to naturally lend themselves to having a tower placed between them. So best to add it after signalling, not before.

[NetPCDoc]

Originally posted by chris.australia:

....by the way, I have played this before, eventually I figured out how to use signals, but I do remember that it was painstakingly difficult, and I would always be wasting a lot of time setting it up that felt frustrating. That's my recollection, and now the experience is just being repeated. :-(

I presume you do remember that there is a setting to turn off the signal systems - game might be less realistic (trains will just run over/through each other, without any crashes) - so that you do not have to worry about setting up signals? ... or multi-tracking?

[rsturgeon]

I have serveral other railroad games and to me this game is the easiest.

[Maxim]

Originally posted by chris.australia:

Thanks but no thanks.
When splitting tracks there is a given, the game knows the player should always set a direction for each track.

This is wrong thinking because it locks the player into one choice.

Freedom of choice is what makes a game more versatile and in order to solve puzzles you need to be versatile.

Many times I run 4 Lanes out of a station with no signals at all, other than using double crossovers.. and then I switch trains from track to track using waypoints (both adding and deleting waypoints on the fly) which you may not have learned how to use...

telling me that the game should have put my signals down always the same way as a given is just wrong.

[Grumpyolman]

Guys I am 80 yrs young and I did not find any problem with signalling. I love the ctrl left button auto placement.
The only thing that gets me is a no pause button. I do find that very frustrating

[azairvine]

It's really not productive to be ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ on the OP just because "everyone else" seems to find signalling easy. Telling someone something is easy is one of the most useless and redundant things you can say. If someone says they're having trouble, they're having trouble. Too many narrow minded people who assume the way they process things is the way everyone does.

I struggle with signals too. It's not exactly logical that I struggle with them, as yes they *should* be easy. But different people have different learning difficulties they have to deal with.

The OP doesn't have bad suggestions TBH. For someone struggling with signals it sounds like a good solution. You tell him he can run the game sans-signals - but no one seems to consider that his idea could *also* be an option in the settings for people who have trouble with signals.

Don't go blindly defending a poorly executed function of the game (if it was supported properly there wouldn't be user-made guides for it) simply because you've figured it out and are close minded to other ideas.